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soloyosh Samba Member
Joined: February 24, 2021 Posts: 28 Location: LHC, AZ
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Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:34 am Post subject: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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Hi all,
I was working in the garage last night on our new-to-us 1800.
The fan shroud we have seems to be missing a number of fasteners. I forgot to bring them to work to order them. I remember they were M6 but can anyone confirm the length of 29 and 31 in the view below?
Thank you
Brett and Aaron _________________ Brett (dad) and Aaron (son) |
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obieoberstar Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 1127 Location: Tucson
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Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:41 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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I believe #29 is M8. Unsure of the length of the M6 and M8 fasteners on that shroud. |
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ivwshane Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 1920 Location: Sacramento ca
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Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 7:34 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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This is what I found (from the general forum in the hardware sticky).
ivwshane wrote: |
I've never been to this part of the forum but hopefully this info helps.
This applies to a 77 type IV engine but it could cover other type IV model years.
Sizes are either exact or the closest sizes currently available new. Most hardware can/was purchased from boltdepot, belmetric, and fastenal.
Nuts and bolts
Clutch pressure plate
- 8mmx18.5mm 1.25 @6 hex tap
Engine mount
- 8mmx20mm 1.25 @4 serrated flange (fastenal #11115901)
Plenum-case mount
- 8mmx83?mm 1.25 @2 hex tap
EGR
- 6mmx10mm 1.0 @2 pan head
EGR valve
- 6mmx16mm 1.0 @2 hex tap
EGR valve to plenum
- 6mmx55mm 1.0 @2 Allen head cap
Throttle body
- 6mmx25mm 1.0 @2 pan head
EGR/exhaust
- 8mmx30mm 1.25 @2 hex tap
Heat exchanger left
- 6mmx14mm 1.0 @1 serrated flange (fastenal # 11115895-16mm # 111115894-12mm)
Booster fan
- 6mmx15mm 1.0 @2 hex tap
Fan guard
- 6mmx14mm 1.0 @1 serrated flange
Alternator bracket
- 8mmx18mm 1.25 @2 hex tap
Fan housing
- 6mmx20mm 1.25 @8 pan Phillips
- 8mmx16mm 1.25 @1 hex tap
- 8mmx45mm 1.25 @2 hex tap
- 8mmx45mm 1.25 @1 hex
- 8mmx30mm 1.25 @3 hex tap
Starter bolt
- 10mmx70mm 1.5 @1 hex
Exhaust EGR side
- 8mmx30mm 1.25 @2 hex tap
- 8mmx20mm 1.25 @1 hex
Engine carrier bolts
- 8mmx65mm 1.25 @4 hex
Bumper
- 10mmx25mm 1.5 @4 hex tap
Fan hub
- 8mmx30mm 1.25 @1 serrated flange
Transmission (fastenal # 11115903)
- 10mmx75mm 1.5 @1 hex
Transmission mount
- 10mmx45mm 1.5 @2 hex
CV bolts
- 8mmx48mm 12 point
Cooling tin
- 6mmx12mm 1.0 @1 hex tap (fastenal # 0128747)
Cylinder cooling tin
- 5mmx12mm 1.0 @2 hex tap (fastenal # 1138543)
Oil temp plate
- 6mmx10mm 1.0 @2 hex tap (fastenal # 11113804)
Valve lifters
- 7mm nut @8 (fastenal # 0161929)
- 6mm square nut @4 (fastenal # 0161910)
Thermostat
- 8mmx10mm 1.25 @1 hex tap (fastenal # 11552374)
Engine case top
- 8mmx45mm 1.25 @1 hex
- 8mmx88mm 1.25 @1 hex
- 8mmx93mm 1.25 @1 hex
Alternator tin
- 6mmx30mm 1.0 @1 hex tap (fastenal # 0153965)
Control flaps cable holder
- 4mmx8mm @1 hex tap (fastenal # 0162373)
- 4mm square nut
Fan housing cooling flaps (non stock item and a mod to keep flaps from falling off)
- 1/8" spring e-clips x4 (fastenal # 0401249)
Stud length for cross over pipe
28.5mmx8mmx1.25 |
_________________ 77 westy 2.0 FI
69 ghia coup 1600dp
70 single cab |
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soloyosh Samba Member
Joined: February 24, 2021 Posts: 28 Location: LHC, AZ
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:22 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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ivwshane wrote: |
This is what I found (from the general forum in the hardware sticky).
ivwshane wrote: |
I've never been to this part of the forum but hopefully this info helps.
This applies to a 77 type IV engine but it could cover other type IV model years.
Sizes are either exact or the closest sizes currently available new. Most hardware can/was purchased from boltdepot, belmetric, and fastenal.
Nuts and bolts
Fan housing
- 6mmx20mm 1.25 @8 pan Phillips
- 8mmx16mm 1.25 @1 hex tap
- 8mmx45mm 1.25 @2 hex tap
- 8mmx45mm 1.25 @1 hex
- 8mmx30mm 1.25 @3 hex tap
Cooling tin
- 6mmx12mm 1.0 @1 hex tap (fastenal # 0128747)
Cylinder cooling tin
- 5mmx12mm 1.0 @2 hex tap (fastenal # 1138543)
Alternator tin
- 6mmx30mm 1.0 @1 hex tap (fastenal # 0153965)
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Interesting. All my tin screws on both engines that I have are slotted cheese heads (M6x10) and the non-hex screws on the fan housing are also slotted cheese heads. I was going to change them out because I hate slotted fasteners but the list above said they should be Phillips and hex respectively. Is that what you guys have been seeing on other Type 4 engines?
Cheers _________________ Brett (dad) and Aaron (son) |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51153 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:31 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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Slot changed to Phillips ~76 IIRC, earlier ones are all slot and some hex all over the tin. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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obieoberstar Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 1127 Location: Tucson
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:15 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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next time my engine is out I will replace all the fan housing hardware with some socket head screws. Mostly for cosmetic reasons, but they easier to get a proper torque on.
while i am at it, I might cut off that little flat area that sticks out just above the alternator. It gets in the way when trying to turn the engine over using a wrench on the alternator pulley. |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51153 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:48 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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obieoberstar wrote: |
while i am at it, I might cut off that little flat area that sticks out just above the alternator.. |
Isn't that going to make belt adjustment (more) challenging? _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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obieoberstar Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 1127 Location: Tucson
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:08 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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never used that spot to adjust the belt.
i use a serpentine belt tool that has a 90 degree hook on the end of it to pull on the upper socket head screw to tension the belt. |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50352
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Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:48 am Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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I like flange head screws with a hex for holding the tin as it makes removal easier. I like to use my tiny little 1/4" ratchet for installing as it keeps me from being prone to overtightening them. |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12728 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:36 am Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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busdaddy wrote: |
obieoberstar wrote: |
while i am at it, I might cut off that little flat area that sticks out just above the alternator.. |
Isn't that going to make belt adjustment (more) challenging? |
Can't you just stab a screwdriver into the tin and bend it all to shit instead?
+1 for flanged or Phillips tin screws, MUCH easier to instal than flat-head when working upside down or horizontally.
Robbie _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50352
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Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:27 am Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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airschooled wrote: |
busdaddy wrote: |
obieoberstar wrote: |
while i am at it, I might cut off that little flat area that sticks out just above the alternator.. |
Isn't that going to make belt adjustment (more) challenging? |
Can't you just stab a screwdriver into the tin and bend it all to shit instead?
+1 for flanged or Phillips tin screws, MUCH easier to instal than flat-head when working upside down or horizontally.
Robbie |
An impact hammer is easier to use with a Phillips head as well, as it's hard to keep a bit centered in a slotted head screw. |
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edhnb Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2011 Posts: 229 Location: El Dorado Hills, California
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Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 2:23 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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When assembling the 2 halves of the fan shroud, is there a need for any form a gasket type sealant? Also, anyone know the torque specs for the shroud fastening bolts? _________________ 1977 Asi Riviera |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51153 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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No sealant required, but some Neverseez on the fastener threads isn't a bad idea.
Torque specs are in the Bentley, maybe not for those particular bolts, but find 2 or 3 other 6mm bolts or machine screws and see what's recommended for them, preferrably ones used in magnesium or aluminum castings.
Hint: there's some similar fasteners securing the throwout bearing guide sleeve to the bellhousing on 71+ transmissions so look in the end of the transmission section. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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obieoberstar Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 1127 Location: Tucson
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Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:46 pm Post subject: Re: Type 4 fan shroud fasteners |
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for the 6mm screws I would not go past 80 in/lbs. 8mm, 10 ft/bs, max.
just make sure the halves are coming together evenly. they need to be snug, and just a little more.
best practice would be to run a tap/thread chaser on all the threaded fittings while you have it apart.
some Blue thread locker would be good too. |
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