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sehilliard1
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2008
Posts: 46
Location: North Canton
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 Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:31 am Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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I'd be a little more cautious about how much info you give regarding the parking location of your bus. Sounds like easy pickings for someone if its sitting on a campus parking lot somewhere disable going into holiday break time.
While most on here are genuinely trying to help, there are bad players out there and a bus can be a target.
Good luck. I think I'd slap the plug back in one more time and try to get it to a secure location before pulling the motor and making a more permanent fix. Thats just my two cents. |
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BulliBill
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2004
Posts: 4572
Location: St Charles, MO
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:57 am Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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Absolutely great advice above! Get that Bus to a safe location. Then contact a few local VW service shops and get estimates of the cost of the repair. A good shop probably already owns the tools needed and has the experience in using them.
Bill
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I'm looking for these license plate frames for my fleet:
Coeur D'Alene - Lake Shore Volkswagen
Mission VW - San Fernando
Thornton VW - Stockton
Thanks for any help! |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 11:02 am Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| VanillaGorilla11 wrote: |
| Alright thank you for the info I guess it’s time to start researching time-serts and how to install them. If anyone has any more advice I’d love to hear it. Thanks for the help again and I’ll be back when I inevitability need some more help down the road. |
Glad to help. Just put grease onto tap to catch the metal chips to keep them out of the cylinder.
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VanillaGorilla11
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2021
Posts: 73
Location: Gilbert, AZ
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:19 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| sehilliard1 wrote: |
I'd be a little more cautious about how much info you give regarding the parking location of your bus. Sounds like easy pickings for someone if its sitting on a campus parking lot somewhere disable going into holiday break time.
While most on here are genuinely trying to help, there are bad players out there and a bus can be a target.
Good luck. I think I'd slap the plug back in one more time and try to get it to a secure location before pulling the motor and making a more permanent fix. Thats just my two cents. |
Thanks for looking out and the heads up. It is behind security gates 24/7 and I check up on it regularly. Since as you all know everyone’s eyes are on it every time they see it in the garage. I’m planning on bringing it home for the holidays so I can work on it in a better location. I’m planning on picking up a new plug and seeing if that helps the issue while I work on a more permanent fix if needed. |
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BarryL 
Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14269
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:06 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| When you do put the plug in and wrench it does it get tight? If so how tight are you doing it? What tool combination are you using? |
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VanillaGorilla11
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2021
Posts: 73
Location: Gilbert, AZ
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:11 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| I don’t have a torque wrench so I just use a ratchet. I hand tighten it then when I can not tighten it anymore use the ratchet for about a quarter turn to snug it down. Whenever I do this it tightens down and does not seem loose and the other plugs seem to have had no issue which I replaced at the same time as the one I’m having problems with. |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:28 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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Get a torque wrench ASAP. You could be damaging threads by torquing too much or allowing threaded fasteners to come loose all too easily without proper torque value applied.
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VanillaGorilla11
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2021
Posts: 73
Location: Gilbert, AZ
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:35 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| Sounds like a plan I’ll probably pick one up when I pick up a gauge gap this weekend before I put in the spark plug. What ft. Lbs would I want to tighten to on a 40 horse engine I’ve seen some people say roughly 18 but I’ve also seen 22-29. Thanks Everyone |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:09 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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Go up to the top of this same page you are reading right now. Up there is the "Technical" button, left click on that. On the next page scroll down to the "Technical Instruction Manuals" column. In that column is the "Without Guesswork" manuals which were used by the VW dealer mechanics for almost all technical data needed quickly when they were maintaining the ACVWs in the shop. Things like torque values, wear limits, proper spacing etc., all quickly accessible. There is also a good but not great bus manual titled "Type II Transporter Series 1200-1600 Shop Manual". Lots and lots of other need to know info in not only that column, most of the other columns of info there.
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:19 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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For a great must have VW bus repair manual you need to find yourself a copy soonest.
https://www2.cip1.com/acc-c10-9649/
Worth every cent at that price, but if you check out your local used book shop often and thesamba classifieds every day you might be able to find a good used copy for under $100.00.
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:22 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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Also do post several images of the engine in situ. Not only in the engine compartment, but the underside. That way all us VW nutters can see if we can spot any problems you have that need to be cured to keep the engine healthy and happy for as long as possible.
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Last edited by Eric&Barb on Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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VanillaGorilla11
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2021
Posts: 73
Location: Gilbert, AZ
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:23 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| Eric&Barb wrote: |
For a great must have VW bus repair manual you need to find yourself a copy soonest.
https://www2.cip1.com/acc-c10-9649/
Worth every cent at that price, but if you check out your local used book shop often and thesamba classifieds every day you might be able to find a good used copy for under $100.00. |
I definitely want that book except the one for the earlier busses since mine is a 61’. That’s the only thing I really asked for this Christmas season. |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:25 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| VanillaGorilla11 wrote: |
I definitely want that book except the one for the earlier busses since mine is a 61’. That’s the only thing I really asked for this Christmas season. |
Most excellent!! 
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VanillaGorilla11
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2021
Posts: 73
Location: Gilbert, AZ
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:28 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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Here are some old photos I had on hand from when I swapped the engine I’ll gladly post more when I can take a few more. |
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BarryL
Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14269
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 6:36 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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If your spark plug will actually tighten then try putting in a new plug that will have a new crush washer.
When the plug was blown out didn't the engine loose power and sound like a Harley Davidson was tailgating you? |
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VanillaGorilla11
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2021
Posts: 73
Location: Gilbert, AZ
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| Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 6:52 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| The first time it blew out I was able to drive it through the intersection I was at and immediately park but the sound was very noticeable. The second time I immediately stopped the car and turned it off but again I heard a loud noise before immediately turning the car off and pushing it to a parking spot. But both times I was able to put the plug back in after letting the engine cool down and drive it about 30-40 ish minutes again without an issue. However the second time it blew it took about 20 ish minutes to get the bus to start back up again before I was able to drive it back home. But I think this has more to do with me flooding it rather than the spark plug but I could be wrong. |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 7:51 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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| VanillaGorilla11 wrote: |
Here are some old photos I had on hand from when I swapped the engine I’ll gladly post more when I can take a few more. |
Well the engine is almost certainly not a 1200cc 40HP version. Probably a 1600cc. N. American 40HP engine version has a much different shaped intake manifold, and only the overseas markets had parts for making an otherwise 1500/1600 engine into a 1200cc engine.
1. Get a stock 1961-63 bus air cleaner with coil mounted bracket. You will need to make a small spacer bracket to make it work, and then re-jet the carb to work properly. What you have right now is garbage.
2. Dump the cheap rear tin piece for stock tin with the fresh air tubes from fan shroud to the heat exchangers. Not having the heat exchangers connected up to blow cooling air thru them will cause 30F higher engine oil temp.
3. Missing the plastic spark plug clips that go into those three larger holes in the rear (rear as in closer to the rear bumper) of the fan shroud. Helps to keep spark plug cables from rubbing up against other parts and plugs those holes up so you are not leaking out cooling air the engine needs to keep cool.
4. Looks like you are missing the rear lower #4 & 2 cylinder tin pieces. Those tins keep the rear cylinder cooling more evenly so they do not loose compression when they warp.
5. Missing thermostat below cylinders #1 & 2, and the flap inside the fan shroud. This is not letting the engine properly warm up in cooler weather and not get the proper amount of air directed out to the heads in warm/hot weather. This increases engine wear and shortens longevity. Plus means less MPG, and less get up and go.
6. Axle boots have seams in the 12 O'clock positions. Axles pivot up and down on the rubber boot end just inside the transaxle. Having that seam pointed up will result in the boots tearing apart a lot sooner than later. Loosen up the small and large boot clamps. Rotate the boots to the 3 or 9 O'clock positions. Tighten down the larger clamps first. Then push the small end of each boot toward the transaxle about 3/16" (4.5mm), hold the boot there while tightening the small clamp. This keeps the boots from getting too stretched out when the VW is jacked up, resulting in the axles drooping down a lot more with load on the wheels removed.
7. Sometime peel the reflective insulation off the engine lid. Not helping anything temp wise, and will encourage rust of the lid.
8. Get the proper metal fuel line from fuel pump on thru the front engine tin, and make sure the VW grommet is in the front tin also. You will have a lot less chance of fuel fire.
9. You have the 1968-71 bus fifteen gallon fuel tank, instead of the stock 10.5 gallon one. Either one will work fine. You should consider installing the 1956-60 fuel tap. The upper half of the fuel tank is above the fuel pump, so if there is a failure of the fuel line between the fuel pump and carb that fuel just pours downhill. Fuel tap can be shut off due to fire or just when pulling the engine or replacing the flex fuel lines. Replace the flex fuel lines at least every two years to prevent fuel leak and fire.
10. Do take the time and center punch around the brass tubes in the fuel pump and the one going into the carb. Doing that will make sure those tubes are kept tight so they do not fall out and cause a VW BBQ. Never ever just pull off the flex fuel lines off of those pipes which will loosen them up. The stock VW gas flex lines actually grip much harder on the pipes when pulled off, just like how the old fashioned Chinese finger cuffs work. Instead either push the hose tip off each pipe with something flat like a flat tip screwdriver or just slit the side of the flex fuel line to release it off the pipe.
11. Get a couple of rebuildable fuel pumps and two rebuild kits for them from WW. Most aftermarket fuel pumps put out too much fuel pressure. Which in turn means too much fuel flooding down the carb, which can ruin piston rings and cylinders resulting in loss of compression.
12. Check that you have ground wires from each taillight bulb holder, and each ground wire goes to the battery ground cable point on the body. Otherwise the taillights will all too often be dim or flicker. VW finally in the 1970 model bus added ground wires at the factory due to all the taillight problems they had over the years before.
Here is our 1641cc SP engine in our 1960 walk thru panel camper conversion:
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 8:10 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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13. Sometime soon do invest in a German made vacuum advance distributor that will work with your model of carb. That will improve the drivability of the bus.
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VanillaGorilla11
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2021
Posts: 73
Location: Gilbert, AZ
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| Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 8:36 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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Thank You for the advice. Here are some more older photos for reference.
The first is the engine as I got it before removing it from the bus. The second is after I pulled it and it is next to the engine currently in the bus.
This is the engine in the bus currently undressed.
And this is what is currently remaining on the old engine from both engines. |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 8:55 pm Post subject: Re: Butter Bus Revival |
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A. Looks like another 1500/1600 engine. Would help to have images shot at down more the head tin level.
B. Rebuild-able fuel pump, good!
C. Tins on the top of the fan shroud are for dog house shroud. DH cooling shroud system requires a Wider cooling fan to provide enough cooling air over the engine. Using a thinner non-DH fan is bad for cooling the engine. Thusly checking fan width used is important. Also important is making sure all the proper DH tins and seals are used for maximum engine cooling. DH does not pre-heat the cooling air going to the LH cylinders, so those are less heat stressed, which means less failure on that side.
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