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Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws?
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Scorpion1110
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:55 am    Post subject: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

So I started removing the FI from the type 3. Pulled the Air cleaner and the passenger side injectors. Then started looking at the air intake. The vertical tin needs to come off held by 4 cheesehead screws.

Soaked them with aero-kroil. Tried a regular screwdriver for laughs. Yeah right. Not happening. OK lets try a stubby. I think I heard the screws laugh at me at that point

Ok, pulled a bit from my impact driver set, grabbed a socket and a 12"extension and a long handle 3/8 ratchet. Nothing. Went the opposite way. Nothing. More Kroil and hit the screws with a wire brush. Then a few raps from a brass hammer. Nothing/nothing/nothing.

Time for a beer break.

Now back to these @#@%^&% Cheeseheads. Any secrets? Haven't tried vice-grips yet because I am trying not to distort the head of the crew.

I have to say the Type III is an ornery little rascal.

I dropped a crate 350 in a friends 1972 C/10 last weekend and it was a piece of cake, but with the type III I cant get a darn screw out.

I feel another beer break coming.

Dave
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raygreenwood
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 12:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

If the engine is out of the car to you can reach it....the HAND impact driver properly used...with a 3lb hand sledge hammer...should either take the screw out or twist it flat off.

Try heating it to about 500F...try the classic mixture of 50/50 ATF and acetone on the threads. It should be hot enough to sizzle on the first few drips...apply a little as its cooling down. Try the impact driver again...with violence. If it does not come loose....then teh screws will never be usable again anyway. Just vise grip them which will usually twist them off. Ray
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Mike Fisher
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 1:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

1/2" drive breaker bar gives you plenty of leverage as you hold the bit tightly to the screw!
I use this setup for Phillips head door bolts with a #4 bit.
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vwpieces
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 1:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

raygreenwood wrote:
the HAND impact driver properly used...Ray


Extension on the impact driver will reduce its effectiveness. Also most people do not understand how to properly use one. You need to load or twist the driver in the direction you want screw to turn, with out pushing the driver down. Now you hit it with a 2lb+ hammer.

Not saying you don't know how or are doing it wrong, but just my observations over the years. Might help others...
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Scorpion1110
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 1:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

Thanks Mike.

Thanks Ray. Thats about the method I used for pulling the studs from my Lancia's exhaust manifold. Heat/Kroil and vice grips. I also keep a home brew bottle of ATF/acetone and will alternate.

In this case,

The second beer and an array of Vice Grips, worked them loose. I have a well-known vice grips fetish so I have about every type known to man. The front came loose with a combination of the bit driver and the vice grips. I was using a long 3/8 ratchet for leverage and one finally popped. Vice grips took care of the other.

However, the little rat in the back was a fight. I used a small set of line vice grips to finally get the sob to break loose. Then I could turn it by hand.

However, these were just the appetizers.

The main course was the two 13mm bolts holding the air intake on. The front came loose pretty easily. The back? I had every ratchet, extension, and swivel socket out. It finally broke with a 13mm deep, straight down with a 12" long quarter-inch wobble extension and an adapted long swing 3/8th.

Total Franken-tool set up.

I now know why everyone advocates keeping the FI, it's a nightmare to remove Smile

Is going to be carefully packed away, and may get an encore at some point in the future.

The bottom line is I was being too careful. Take the cheezers out with vice grips and replace them as needed.

Is it acceptable to use some anti-seize when reinstalling? or does that create problems?

Thanks as always!

Dave
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 9:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

Yes on anti-seize.. Love that stuff.

They make that high-temp copper kind - i use it on almost everything.

Pretty much anything that doesn't get lock tite...
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raygreenwood
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 10:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

Clatter wrote:
Yes on anti-seize.. Love that stuff.

They make that high-temp copper kind - i use it on almost everything.

Pretty much anything that doesn't get lock tite...


Exact same method I use.

If it does not need locktite and is not some kind of very special fastener with inch-pound torque setting.....I sparingly coat it with anti-seize...and am mindful of the torque rating difference it may give certain bolt types.

The damn sheet metal screws....those and lug bolts are the very first ones I learned to religiously apply to. Ray
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Bobnotch
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2021 2:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

Scorpion1110 wrote:


The bottom line is I was being too careful. Take the cheezers out with vice grips and replace them as needed.

Thanks as always!

Dave


I've been replacing them with M6 hex head screws, in case I need to remove them again.
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Scorpion1110
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 21, 2021 5:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

So decided to pull the remaining four cheeseheads for the tins that needed to come off while I mess with the carb intakes. Three went peacefully. Number 4 put up a fight.

Was messing with vicegrips when I remembered these. These socks grip and remove pretty well. Tapped it on old Cheezy and gave it a turn with a 3/8th ratchet and it was out.

Just an idea if you get stuck.

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Glenn Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 21, 2021 6:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

A good penetrating oil, sprayed 3 times a day for a day or tow and heat. Try turning it clockwise first to break the bond.

I take pride in disassembling an old engine and not snapping a single stud or screw.
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Bobnotch
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2021 1:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

Scorpion1110 wrote:
So decided to pull the remaining four cheeseheads for the tins that needed to come off while I mess with the carb intakes. Three went peacefully. Number 4 put up a fight.

Was messing with vicegrips when I remembered these. These socks grip and remove pretty well. Tapped it on old Cheezy and gave it a turn with a 3/8th ratchet and it was out.

Just an idea if you get stuck.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Are these from Lowe's?
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71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote:
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Tram wrote:
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Scorpion1110
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2021 1:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

Bobnotch wrote:
Scorpion1110 wrote:
So decided to pull the remaining four cheeseheads for the tins that needed to come off while I mess with the carb intakes. Three went peacefully. Number 4 put up a fight.

Was messing with vicegrips when I remembered these. These socks grip and remove pretty well. Tapped it on old Cheezy and gave it a turn with a 3/8th ratchet and it was out.

Just an idea if you get stuck.

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Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Are these from Lowe's?


Bob, they are from ACE Hardware. Pretty sure.

Dave
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galencurrington
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2021 10:49 am    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

I have a set kinda like that but it's craftsman and you can using it with a cordless impact drill not the big impact it works every time.
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glassbuggy
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2021 5:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Any secret tricks for removing seized Cheesehead screws? Reply with quote

Everyone stop. Have I got the tool for you! A conduit reamer ( get one right down at Lowes ) has an end that captures the cheese head. As an electrical tool, it is for those conduit fitting screws. Holy F, for these damn tin screws, this tool is the shit.
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