Installing shorter IRS axles

[halbug]

Hi there, can someone help me with how to set up rear axles with shorter SAW axles?

I am using Mendeola True Track trailing arms, with narrowed track width. I bought short axles from Sway-a-Way to go with them.

I noticed that the SAW axles do not have a flange at the end of the splines like VW ones have. This may allow for some variation and also accounts for the different lenghth reqiured right to left axle. However, the CV joints have a press fit on the splines, so they will not "find" there right location by themselves.

How do I determine where to place the inner splined ball hub on the axle, so that it is in the right location to the outer ball cage of the CV joint and will work properly?

Any suggestions?
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[NJ John]

I believe that inner flange is considered a CV buster in the off road world. Someone who actually have used these should chime in.
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[RickS]

Clean the splines on the axles and cv joints. They do indeed float and find their own place.

I’ve used these on 2 cars with IRS and bus transmissions. One car also had 1 5/8” narrowed control arms.

[halbug]

Rick, thank you for your reply! Simply cleaning them up will not make them float for sure in my case. It would take some sanding and clearancing to make them move freely.

VW has a press fit and positive stops inner and outer on each CV, so I am not sure floating CVs are the only solution? I am looking for longevity.

Maybe I have to mesure where the sweet spot is through the complete range of suspension movement. Or set it optimal for normal standing height? I assume the CV is set perfectly when the inner race is exactly center to the outer?

Any advice is welcome, and maybe floating is the right thing to do. I am just not sure yet

Cheers Lars
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[cbeck]

The axle has to float in the cv's to accommodate the distance between the drive flanges changing during wheel travel.

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[jsturtlebuggy]

Hajbug I don’t know where you found the information that VW CV joints are a press fit on the axles, it is wrong. All CV joints on any VW vehicle I worked on in the last 50 years, the CV joints have been a slip fit on the splines. The early ones did use a concave washer on the inner stop on the axles along with the circlip on the outside.
SwayAway made axles so that there was inner stop and longer splines so CV would float on axle. Yes the inner stop was a CV breaker when being used off road (from personal experience).
If your CVS do not easily slide on axle splines, you need to find out why. If you hammered on the CV to get on splines, get out the three corner file and clean it up.
And I have shorten aftermarket axles to fit. It something you have to do since you cannot always find the correct length axle without spending big money for custom made.
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Having fun with Dune Buggies since 1970
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[halbug]

[halbug]

[halbug]

I assume you will confirm that these CV's have been pre-assembled wrongly? BTW, by the factory

Cheers
Lars
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[RickS]

I would disassemble, debur and then reassemble with the proper grease. Made in China means rough around the edges.

[Ian Godfrey]

part of this is a tricky question. The outer... yours seems to have a chamfer on both sides so it is hard to know which side should face the flange.
the star and cage do matter and are straight forward.
star flat side and the cage flat side go on the flange end and
star side with the depression and the cage bevel side go on the shaft side.
there are some great photos here
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0

[Ian Godfrey]

looking at your photos again I think the top one is all correct for the axle boot side.
Flat outer mounting face
Bevelled cage
Raised area on the star

But I do agree with disassemble, probably sand all the inside edges of the cages
and reassemble with the small point on the star to the wide section on the outer.
don't forget to 'clock' the CV's at each end of the axle.

[halbug]

On the top foto the inside star with the step flange on the face as well as the beveled side of the cage are good to go onto the shaft side. So far clear.

The outside cage I think needs to be facing the other way for two reasons. The flange face in below picture has a step to receive a gasket, included in the box. I assume that side should go to the rubber boot = axle side. The other face of the cage has flat surface (top picture) and I would mount this rather to the flange for best contact?!? Doesn't the outer slot on the cage also indicate the flange side?
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[halbug]

I think this is how they should go together?!? Top side to the axle.

@Rick, you where right, very sharp corners everywhere inside This is what you gonna get for ordering genuine SKF products
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[Ian Godfrey]

I have not seen this gasket setup before, maybe some others have.
the lines around the outer edge seem different on many brands.
I have seen 1 line on GKN/Lobro, no lines on Empi and 3 + 1 lines on older factory? ones

Here's my thinking though, when you torque up the bolts the boot flange is going to crush into the gasket and the loading on the bolt head won't be even.
I could imagine (even with schnorr washers) the cv bolts coming loose = trouble
the other way around would put the recess on the flange side (outer) and the bolt heads have a solid flat surface to torque up too.
I'd love to hear if anyone has used this design of CV and their experiences?

[Busstom]

I always thought the groove around the O.D. of the outer race always went toward the flanges.

[halbug]

[jsturtlebuggy]

That is the first CV joint I seen using a gasket like that on a VW.
Porsche 914 4 cylinder cars use a gasket around the outer perimeter on flange side. It also used only 4 bolts and 2dowel pins to mount to flange.
If you going to use that CV I would put gasket side towards flange.
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Fair Oaks/Orangevale, CA
Elrod Motorsports
Motion Tire Motorsports
Having fun with Dune Buggies since 1970
Into Volkswagens since 1960

[halbug]

Hi Joseph, interesting! Gasket against the flange is how they where assembled when I got them new.

Actually these are bus T3 / 914 CV's. Not bug.
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[jsturtlebuggy]

I have to wonder what other vehicles use a 100mm outside diameter CV other then what VW has made.
Most of my experience is with Lobro brand and some GNK brand CVs.
On my own buggies I am using Empi 930 CV joints that are made in China and they hold up well in off and on road use.
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Joseph
Fair Oaks/Orangevale, CA
Elrod Motorsports
Motion Tire Motorsports
Having fun with Dune Buggies since 1970
Into Volkswagens since 1960