Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine
Page: 1, 2  Next
Forum Index -> Vanagon Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
hacklete
Samba Member


Joined: August 29, 2021
Posts: 5
Location: CA
hacklete is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 12:30 pm    Post subject: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

Wondering what it costs to get a 2.1L engine put into an 1984 vanagon.
Has anyone had this done lately? Not DIY but at a shop.

I'm new to the vanagon world and considering getting a 1984 with an older 1.9L engine and then putting in a new 2.1 and want to understand what it might cost.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
hdenter
Samba Member


Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 2749
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
hdenter is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 1:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

You will need to find a good 2.1 core to either trade in or have rebuilt. Also, if you are going to have a rebuilt engine installed with a 2.1 block, you should think about bumping it to a 2.2. the larger piston kit only adds a few hundred dollars more and supplies a noticable bump in power over a 2.1. the good new is that you can install this new engine into your 1.9 just as you would the original engine. On the outside, they are essential the same. The case bolt that holds the intake plenum is different and you need to bend it up out of the way. As for cost, that depends on who's pre-built engine you purchase and who puts it in or what shop you hire to rebuild the core you find...

I have a 2.1 in my '85 using all the 1.9 accessories and early fuel injection. It works great.


Hans
_________________
'79 triple white convertible bug
'84 sunroof vanagon
'85 weekender
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Classifieds Feedback
hdenter
Samba Member


Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 2749
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
hdenter is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 1:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

A good quality rebuilt engine should cost about $4500-5000. You can pay less, but you are trading cost savings for doing less machine work and lesser quality parts. Simply swapping the old motor out and putting a new motor in probably could be done for $1500-2000. But then, would it makes sense to install old dirty fuel injectors on a motor you just spent $6,000 installing? How old is the radiator in that 1.9? Does it need a new engine because the old one overheated? Would you put your $6,000 engine in a car with a clogged radiator? If you bought a low-cost rebuilt motor and only paid to have the motors swapped, you might be out the door for $5,000. On the other hand if you buy a good quality rebuild motor and do the things necessary to ensure that it will last a long time and be reliable, you're going to be heading towards $8000 or more depending on what things in this van you KNOW are already in good reliable condition.

Hans
_________________
'79 triple white convertible bug
'84 sunroof vanagon
'85 weekender
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Classifieds Feedback
hdenter
Samba Member


Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 2749
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
hdenter is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 1:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

There are two kinds of vanagon owners: those of us with dirty fingers who do the lions share of the work ourselves and those who have deep enough pockets to pay others to do the work.
_________________
'79 triple white convertible bug
'84 sunroof vanagon
'85 weekender
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Classifieds Feedback
hacklete
Samba Member


Joined: August 29, 2021
Posts: 5
Location: CA
hacklete is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 1:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

Thanks for the info. I am new to auto mechanics and while I would absolutely love to do all the work myself, it will take me a few years to get up to speed. So while I have another job, yes I do have some money to hire someone who knows what they are doing to do it. But, you know, maybe I am just a fat cat who doesn't want to get their hands dirty Razz
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
hdenter
Samba Member


Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 2749
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
hdenter is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 1:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

Fortunately for you, you've already found the right place to go for help and advice right here on the samba. If you do a search through old threads you will find lots of stories of the highs and lows of both paying to have your engine rebuilt or doing it yourself. There's lots of information if you dig around looking for it here. There are numerous shops in Northern, Central and Southern California that are known for doing good work on vanagons. Even better, there are plenty of members here such as myself that would gladly stop by and help out or offer advice over a six pack of beer.

Before you buy, make sure you go through the FAC threads regarding what to look for when buying a van. There are lots of clues that can help you decide if the van you are looking at is worthy of the price you will be paying and the work that it may need done to it.

Good luck!
_________________
'79 triple white convertible bug
'84 sunroof vanagon
'85 weekender
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Classifieds Feedback
dobryan
Samba Member


Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 16474
Location: Brookeville, MD
dobryan is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 2:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=525798
_________________
Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru EJ25 and Peloquin TBD

"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson

MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646

Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371

The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
bobbyblack Premium Member
Samba Member


Joined: May 21, 2015
Posts: 4333
Location: United States, Iowa
bobbyblack is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 2:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

While I am glad to hear you want to keep the engine essentially how VW designed them, I have to wonder about how you will feel when you are all done spending something like 10 grand, and having somewhere in the 90'ish horsepower range engine... I know Cali is making things difficult for doing transplants, and I am on the fence with those as well.. Having done the majority of a Subi ej22 transplant in my daughters rig... However, Stevens Auto Haus (https://www.h2ovanagon.com/) might be something to consider, if you actually want to have another hundred ponies than stock. Sure there are drawbacks, but it sounds like you want something reliable, and you have some money to make it what you want. Personally, I like staying in the VW family, and for some this is a big factor in what they are doing in their approach and thought process.

If it were my 1983.5-1985 'baby' and I had the money, sure, I'd find a whole engine, engine harness, (essentially everything in the engine area) and even a super late transaxle (later than say March of '90) and do all the hoses, radiator, etc. I might even consider having someone install the later dash, and all the front harness too, as those old style fuses really turn me OFF. But then again, you might just be way better of starting your whole inner debate by looking at another rig altogether that is in the 'late series' '86+ (and for most of those folks really looking, the 90+). Might be a lot of $'s, but you'd not be needing to do all that transferring of stuff around.

Be aware that Vanagon fever is pretty serious. My dejected 83.5 sits patiently waiting, even seeing yet another Westy show up in my 'stable' of running and parts buses... (5 total now, I've got a particularly bad case of the fever..)
_________________
'87 Westy 'Flossie','86 Westy 'R1','86 tintop GL - Subi2.2 'J2','83.5 stock tintop L 'ZoomBus','74 Karmann Ghia, '63 Notch
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
hacklete
Samba Member


Joined: August 29, 2021
Posts: 5
Location: CA
hacklete is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

I see what you're saying. I've been having debates of this nature in my head for a few weeks. I'm leaning towards an 86 right now actually. And yeah is it worth the cost for that little extra horsepower? Maybe not.

Yeah I guess I can always accumulate a group of vans Very Happy of course I don't expect that will be the case, but I don't think anyone does in the beginning. The only thing holding me back is space right now. They sure are tempting though!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
Wildthings
Samba Member


Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50261

Wildthings is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2021 10:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

You could buy a used engine pretty cheap from a shop that does Subaru or other conversions. If you get every last part you need to do the upgrade to a 2.1L its not that big of a deal to install one, but that every last part can be hard to come by as you don't know what it is going to be until it is needed.

When I converted my 83 1/2 to a 2.1L I had an engine I had acquired for a shop that did conversions and most everything I had removed from my 91 when I converted it to a 2.2l Subaru. There were still a few snags, but it was not a bad swap as swaps go.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
erdonline
Samba Member


Joined: September 26, 2004
Posts: 943
Location: CT
erdonline is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Sep 12, 2021 8:25 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

In my opinion, the differences between the 2.1 and the 1.9 are not worth installing at this point unless the current engine is really on its way out. But then you've got a few choices to make. The engine management system, cooling and exhaust are different for the 1.9 and the 2.1. but if you swap over whole systems, they are interchangeable. In other words you could unbolt everything from your current engine and put it on a 2.1 with the few details mentioned in another post. Or you could swap over the engine management system of the 2.1 and even the cooling and exhaust. The newer cooling system hoses are a little easier to get a hold of and parts for the 2.1 engine management can be cheaper and more available. But I wouldn't do any swap just to go from 85 horsepower to 92 horsepower.

Ed
_________________
'85 Vanagon Westfalia
'84 Vanagon 7-passenger
'98 Mexican air-cooled Beetle
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
davlance01
Samba Member


Joined: May 10, 2013
Posts: 224
Location: Ohio
davlance01 is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Sep 12, 2021 11:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

I wouldn't give up my 1.9 for nothing.
_________________
Life is short and the road is long so if you want to see it all you have to drive fast!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
hacklete
Samba Member


Joined: August 29, 2021
Posts: 5
Location: CA
hacklete is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:41 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

Well, I've had some advantures in the last few weeks looking for my van. But those are stories for another thread.
Currently looking at a 84 that needs a rebuilt engine as 2 of the cylinders are gone. Would be 8k approx for a rebuild and install according to my mechanic.

I also have the option to go to 2.1. If that options on the table with a complete rebuild necessary anyway is it still the same considerations do you think?
I wish I had a garage to work on it myself!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
danfromsyr
Samba Member


Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15129
Location: Syracuse, NY
danfromsyr is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:51 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

davlance01 wrote:
I wouldn't give up my 1.9 for nothing.

that's HILARIOUS given the signature line in your post

davlance01 wrote:
Life is short and the road is long so if you want to see it all you have to drive fast!



I wouldn't run a 1.9 any further than the local playground.
there's hills in them there woods..
and I do NOT enjoy the close up view of the front grill of dump trucks and semi's

played that 45mph up interstate grades game once... once.. fuq-dat
_________________
Abscate wrote:
These are the reasons we have words like “wanker”
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
4Gears4Tires
Samba Member


Joined: October 08, 2018
Posts: 2982
Location: MD
4Gears4Tires is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:53 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

I once hit 84mph (indicated) with my 1.9 powered Syncro.

Down a long hill.
_________________
'87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
danfromsyr
Samba Member


Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15129
Location: Syracuse, NY
danfromsyr is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:21 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

so close to going back to the future..
_________________
Abscate wrote:
These are the reasons we have words like “wanker”
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
hdenter
Samba Member


Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 2749
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
hdenter is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 10:38 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

To the OP, the considerations are still the same. If you want to go from 1.9 to 2.1 (or 2.2 or 2.3) you will need to come up with a 2.1 core. Or, at least find a good 2.1 crankshaft and the appropriate pistons go make the change to a 2.1+ engine displacement. If your mechanic were to try and rebuild your 1.9 case with a 2.1 crank, he would need to find new bearings for the 1.9 case. To my knowledge, those bearings are NLA. Three of the main bearings are the same as what is found in a 1600cc air cooled bug engine, but the fourth bearing is unique to the 1.9. Bearings for the 2.1 case are much easier to find.

Hans
_________________
'79 triple white convertible bug
'84 sunroof vanagon
'85 weekender
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Classifieds Feedback
Wildthings
Samba Member


Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50261

Wildthings is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:19 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

hacklete wrote:
Well, I've had some advantures in the last few weeks looking for my van. But those are stories for another thread.
Currently looking at a 84 that needs a rebuilt engine as 2 of the cylinders are gone. Would be 8k approx for a rebuild and install according to my mechanic.

I also have the option to go to 2.1. If that options on the table with a complete rebuild necessary anyway is it still the same considerations do you think?
I wish I had a garage to work on it myself!


Pickup an engine that has been removed to do a Subaru (or other) swap for $500, install it over a couple of days, and be on your way.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
hacklete
Samba Member


Joined: August 29, 2021
Posts: 5
Location: CA
hacklete is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 12:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

I love your optimism @wildthings
My neighbors would also love to see me do this on the street in front of my apartment 😂😂
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member


Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12103
Location: Port Manteau
Zeitgeist 13 is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 12:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of 1.9 -> 2.1L engine Reply with quote

I recently replaced a worn 2.1 in an '84 van. I recommend keeping the 2.1 Digifant and exhaust, but using your existing 1.9 cooling system. It's mostly a plug n' play proposition. I sold my excellent running 2.1 complete with the wiring harness and ECU for $300. This is one of the least expensive and simple engine swaps available for these vans.
_________________
Casey--

'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Vanagon All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.