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Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73?
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73bus_and_me
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 4:36 pm    Post subject: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

Hi all, we just completed our first trip, driving to Lake Tahoe actually from the bay area, in our 73' Bay Window Bus (weekender) acquired last Spring. We slept for 3 nights in the bus and woke to several inches of snow the last morning. It was beautiful!!!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Anyhow, it was also "snowing" white dust from the wood panel in the ceiling which gave a noticeably white powdery appearance on the rubber mat flooring and also on our clothing. The panel has faint white embedded in the wood grain, which I assume are the remnants of paint.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


We're not sure if we should replace the panel, seal it, get it sanded down by some kind of approved lead removal place or what not.

Our "next step" is probably to get an EPA-approved lead test kit.

Has anyone been through this and have any tips?
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aeromech
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 5:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

I’d seal it. Unless you add the flakes to your coffee, I doubt it would be a problem but lightly sand and then seal
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 5:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

Welcome!

The finish flaking off the panelling isn't uncommon, even the best German coatings break down after 48 years. But you are the first to ask about lead content, I guess you'll want to avoid licking the interior if you are worried.
A good vacuuming with a stiff brush attachment usually gets all the loose crap off. Nobody has found a way to exactly replicate the photo printed finish on those, a light sanding, some whitish stain and a coat of varnish usually comes really close though.
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aeromech
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 5:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

^^^^^^ what he said
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Malokin Martin
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 7:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

The original panels are pickled. I can’t remember if they were varnished after. It doesn’t look like they were painted from 500 miles away in the one photo you posted on my screen.
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danfromsyr
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 7:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

now if we could only get some radioactive coating.
then it would glow softly at night.
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aeromech
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 8:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

Honestly I would consider the entire bus to be lead contaminated. Therefore it’s a total loss. It just so happens that I recently (read tomorrow) started a company that specializes in lead disposal. My company will only charge you a small fee to collect your bus and make this problem go away for you.
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my59
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 8:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

I have dealt with lead contamination and remediation, owning an 1860's house and having young kids while renovating it.
Dry scraping and or sanding is a big don't do it.
Testing for lead if positive makes you liable if it's positive and you don't disclose.
Hepa vacuum and wet wiping might be something to consider. With loose debris off, priming and painting would encapsulate what's left..
Please keep in mind that lead affects children significantly more thN adults, as child's brains are still developing where adults are what they are.
Lead is an element, so we just move it around. Be cognizant of how it is disposed of, and only hunt waterfowl with steel or bismuth shot
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metahacker
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 9:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

the Germans were already anti-lead-paint way before us (the US banned it in 1978).

In 1886, women and children were not allowed in lead paint factories.
By 1961, Germans considered lead paint a no-no. (simply a best practice, although not formally banned, if I understand correctly)

You should test it and let us know for all of our own edification.

I wouldn't let it concern you the least bit on your trip. If you want to put a mask on and wipe it with a wet rag, go for it.
But I wouldn't stress out about it.
Don't eat it.
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 9:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

my59 wrote:

Testing for lead if positive makes you liable if it's positive and you don't disclose.


Yeah, I figured testing would be stepping into a big steaming pile of trouble, clean it up as safe as you can and don't mention it ever happened.
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Starbucket
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2021 12:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

Buy a water filtration vacuum, around $125.00 and clean up the area then seal the panel with clear paint.
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metahacker
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2021 3:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

oh cmon Smile it's not like he has a rental property with some liability lawsuit lying in the wait

this is about their own bus and their own safety

wouldn't hurt to test and i'm sure many of us would honestly like to hear the results (or not, depending on what the test says, heh)
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pioneer1
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2021 3:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

Seal the finish. I used a latex linen color stain to refinish. Move the stain around with a rag to create that woodgrain finish. Then seal with semi glass urethane. Just like new
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73bus_and_me
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2021 9:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

Thanks everyone.

I did two lead paint tests and both were negative. Thank you Germany. The 3M lead test kit is really well designed. It includes a sheet with actual lead in it so you can confirm each test was capable of detecting lead.

I can't say this result would generalize to other buses (though hopefully it would) because it's possible a former owner could have modified the ceiling and painted it with US lead paint early in the bus's history. And who know what the history is of my bus?

Anyhow, my next step will be to sand the ceiling until the paint stops flaking off it. I don't necessarily need or want it to be eliminated entirely because it kind of looks retro and imperfect.

Then I'll apply a latex linen color stain to refinish as pioneer1 recommended. I think the challenge will be to waterproof it afterwards with a finish that does not look "glossy" so the water vapor from us sleeping at night (even with front windows cracked) does not affect the wood. Maybe some light sanding with steel wool would take care of any gloss.

Hey pioneer1, I also have an 80's-era 911 targa. Mine is a red 1987 with around 50 thousand original miles.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2021 11:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

73bus_and_me wrote:
The 3M lead test kit is really well designed. It includes a sheet with actual lead in it so you can confirm each test was capable of detecting lead.


*buys poison test kit. kit includes poison*

what a world we live in

73bus_and_me wrote:
Thank you Germany.


not so fast. you'll have a stroke when you find out about the asbestos in the heating system Dancing
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Xevin Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:03 am    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

My buddy’s wife grew up driving bugs as a teenager. When she married my buddy (Who also owns a fleet of vintage VWs) she was daily driving an 80/81 Vanagon as her daily driver for many years. A handful of years ago she went to work for a firm that does lead testing. When she tested her Vanagon the results made her uncomfortable to let her young son travel in the Van. She stopped driving it for good. I don’t have details of the results but maybe I’ll ask her if she recalls the specifics.
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sodbuster
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 8:38 am    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

Xevin wrote:
My buddy’s wife grew up driving bugs as a teenager. When she married my buddy (Who also owns a fleet of vintage VWs) she was daily driving an 80/81 Vanagon as her daily driver for many years. A handful of years ago she went to work for a firm that does lead testing. When she tested her Vanagon the results made her uncomfortable to let her young son travel in the Van. She stopped driving it for good. I don’t have details of the results but maybe I’ll ask her if she recalls the specifics.


So in other words you really do not know what the source of the lead contamination was.

For the original poster. that is the original finish on your pannels. and it is a wood stain and not paint. Smile
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KTPhil Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 8:52 am    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

skills@eurocarsplus wrote:
73bus_and_me wrote:
The 3M lead test kit is really well designed. It includes a sheet with actual lead in it so you can confirm each test was capable of detecting lead.


*buys poison test kit. kit includes poison*

what a world we live in


Lol! Funny shit! And no doubt for sale in California it has the Prop 65 warning label.

The only sillier thing is a warning on the laser pointer for my pistol that came with a sticker to put on the weapon stating that there is a health hazard from the laser light. Personally, I'd be more worried about the lead poisoning threat coming our of the barrel, not the photons...
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 9:15 am    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

sodbuster wrote:
Xevin wrote:
My buddy’s wife grew up driving bugs as a teenager. When she married my buddy (Who also owns a fleet of vintage VWs) she was daily driving an 80/81 Vanagon as her daily driver for many years. A handful of years ago she went to work for a firm that does lead testing. When she tested her Vanagon the results made her uncomfortable to let her young son travel in the Van. She stopped driving it for good. I don’t have details of the results but maybe I’ll ask her if she recalls the specifics.


So in other words you really do not know what the source of the lead contamination was.


This is absolutely correct. Hopefully I can get more details from her today and can report back.
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My God! Xevin and I 100% agree Shocked
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metahacker
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 9:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Lead paint in ceiling panel of 73? Reply with quote

just put a coat of penetrol on it and move on with your life, making note to appreciate the patina of your wood headlining that can only be earned and not purchased

the germans aint puttin lead in that shizz
no need to worry
told ya so Smile

i know OLD and PAINT = LEAD death in most ppls minds
but that bus is probably safer with VOCs and toxins than any home built after 1945
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