Jumpseat vs middle row seat in Westfalia

[pck]

I'm trying to make decision on seating arrangements in my Westfalia. I will be traveling with my wife, two kids 8 and 10, and OCCASIONALLY my oldest daughter who's college age. I need a removable 5th seat for when she decides to camp with us. My van has the floor rails for a single slide in seat, which seams like a good option. It would be a little bulky, but I could slide out the seat when we're camped and she'd be comfortable and have some space from her younger siblings. The other option is installing a rear jump seat. I'd have to do some modifications to make it work, but I like how much less space it takes. What I don't know is how comfortable it is, or how she'd feel riding backwards on a long road trip. Anyone else in a similar boat? Any other pros or cons?

[spitsnrovers]

I had an '84 aircooled Westfalia and mounted the slide in centre single seat. In 1985 my wife and 3 teen age children did a trip from Calgary to Grande Canyon, Disney Land, and back up the US west coast to Calgary.
The centre seat was perfect.

Everybody faced forward,
The seat slid out easily at night to put into the annex so all 5 of us slept in the van - rain or shine.
There is storage space under the seat, and
The seat also acted as a nice chair while on the ground in camp grounds.

But I have never had the rear facing jump seat to compare it with.
_________________
'88 VW Westfalia
'75 Triumph Spitfire 1500

[djkeev]

Years ago I took four of my Grandchildren from Jersey to Montana in my 86 "weekender" with the old rear facing storage box seat.i

That seat was the golden throne! There were fights on who got to sit there until we developed a seating rotation schedule.

Zero problems with riding backwards.

Dave
_________________
Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos

Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert

[DuncanS]

Never heard of the single middle row seat before. It makes a lot of sense since it can be put on the ground outside to either sit there or make for more room inside. I'll bet it's heavy and awkward as I know W'burg makes bullet proof seat bases. Seems like with a little effort it could even work out to be a portable potty slot.

It would be nice if the slides were a little bit farther forward so the rear people could get good leg room. The single could be in the middle so their legs would go up the center aisle.

A nice item. A normal double, which is reasonably available as many take them out of tintops, could be harvested to either convert or be turned into a base for a standard front seat on a swivel. When turned around it could be a hassock or just face outward. Gets a fella thinking.

Duncan

[dobryan]

Yep. You can fit a single or double middle seat in a westy.

_________________
Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru EJ25 and Peloquin TBD

"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson

MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646

Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371

The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794

[DuncanS]

Judging from the adjustable arm rest and the loop at the from bottom edge of the seat, it is a DS front seat mounted on a swivel. Looks like it would be super useful.

Are these seats common? I can't believe that after almost 40 years of
T3 ownership, I never heard of them.

I've never been a fan of the middle seat mounting with the channels which make foot work a bit dicy without shoes. Also disliked the requirement of removing the aluminum cap at the edge of the sliding door. I tended to either remove the channels or cover them over and just ignored having anything in the middle. After the hockey bus career taking 5 or 6 kids to a game came to an end, the seat never when back in. In fact, although I have a jump seat behind the PS front, it has only been used once in 8 years.

Duncan

[dobryan]

[vtmtber]

My kids are 15, 11 and 7 so we needed another seat as well. I added a jump seat years ago and it is one of the best things I have done to my Westy. The kids love it and it's very functional while camping too. I rarely take it out but I can in less that 10 seconds if I need the floor space.

_________________
1987 VW Westfalia, 1999 BMW M Coupe, 1986 VW Scirocco 16V, 1976 BMW 2002, 1968 Jaguar XKE

[crazyvwvanman]

The single middle seat was a somewhat common option in 84 (Wolfy), 85, and 86 models of full campers.
I've had maybe a dozen of those seats, prolly still have 3 or 4.
The seat base has a locking compartment that used the same key as the glovebox does.

The loop you noticed isn't part of the seat itself but rather part of the swivel mechanism welded in place on this single seat base as well as the front seat positions of Westy campers that came with kitchens. When you remove the seat from the base the loop stays behind on the base.

Mark

[Red Ryder]

[DuncanS]

Arm rests do give it away as an owner mod. Notice the upholstery is brown and the DS is grey. The head rest matches the front seats.

Note the difference between the stock armrests for the jump seats and the front seat adjustable ones in the pic below.

Modifying a two seat middle base to accommodate a swivel mechanism would be pretty easy.

I just spent a bunch of time reworking my middle seat and worked on the base which ultimately didn't get used, but could have been saved for that very purpose. I'd like to make a base for the jump seat so it can be used outdoors. Folding legs so it wouldn't take up too much space when stored.

Duncan

[nemobuscaptain]

[DeLvxe]

If you go with the non-factory installed jump seat, there are lots of safety concerns to take into account because the original design was engineered and us DIY guys just kind of figure it out. The bracket mount, floor mount, and seat belt attachments wouldn't meet the same factory safety standards. Not saying don't do it (I did) just that you'll want to know what you are getting into.

I put some back steel in the wheel well behind the bracket because I think the vans that came with jumpseats had some sore of reinforcement. Also, where the bracket attaches to the floor should be welded in place -- Foreign Auto Supply sells a kit, but it wouldn't be difficult to make.
_________________
1991 manual camper with EJ25

[pnwkayaker]

I just saw this mod in a van for sale https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2497730, if it's done well, I think it's a great way to bring a family on a road trip (more leg room, all kids seeing each other, etc). You still cannot open the fridge but I think you are able to swing the table in between.

_________________
87 Syncro Westy EJ25 ("Tardis")

Seattle Meetup at Marymoor (link)
A collection of Simple Useful Mods (SUM) (link)

[pck]

[dobryan]

[ZsZ]

It is more comfortable to travel on a forward facing seat, however it is much comfortable to camp with the back facing jumpseat installed.
Single front facing midle seats are hard to get, so I would go with the jumpseat.
_________________
Zoltan
1.9 MTdi 2wd Multivan (ex Caravelle)
Van since 2006, engine since 2008

[ZsZ]

[DuncanS]

Look at the rear seat. It has one adjustable armrest on the right side and non adjustable one on the left. The brackets are different, but just bolt into the same holes. Haven't gotten around to replacing the left one yet.

Jump seat safety. Unless you are driven into from behind at a serious rate of speed, all the forces on the jump seat are to the front, so reinforcing the PS pedestal may be overkill. The sockets on the floor see sheer forces so using high grad bolts with a backing plate should also be OK.

Duncan

[CanStan]

I've owned all 3 versions of extra seats.

I had an '84 Westy with both a single middle seat, as well as the double middle seat. They are quick enough to install and remove, so I didn't mind changing them to suit whatever needs I had at the moment. I found I kept the single seat installed most of the time. The biggest issue was if we were camping, the seat had to be moved outside. If we didn't have the side tent set up, or the weather wasn't the greatest, it created a little bit of hassle.
The singles seem to be way less common than the doubles, so if you're impartial ether way, the double will be easier and cheaper to find.

I then bought a '90 Westy, and installed a rear facing jump seat. That was by far the best setup for us. Especially on the long road trips when the kids were really young, my wife liked to be able to hop into the back to help them with a snack, or whatever else little kids always seem to need a hand with. I thought it might be in the way a bit, but even on a 2 month road trip with 4 of us in the Van, it wasn't a problem. Since you can remove it in literally 10 seconds, the odd time we would put it outside at the campsite. But for the most part, it just stayed where it was.

Of all the options, I would personally do the rear facing jump seat again without hesitation.