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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2021 8:30 am Post subject: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Thanks guys for your suggestions & input on my request for motor info a while back.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=759259&highlight=
I like the sound of Brian e's idea.
Quote: |
76mm crank
5.5 rods
94mm B pistons
cb2288 cam
10:1, .045" deck height
light flywheel
1 1/2" header
Really good 40x35 heads, 180+ cfm @ .550", 285ft/sec average port velocity
1.5 rockers
44mm IDF's
Easy to build, 2109cc, quick revving, and would be a pile of fun in a buggy. |
I had, what I thought, was a usable core motor. After closer inspection it already had an .050 line bore and still needed to have a spun bearing cleaned up... dammit...
My boss is a very understanding VW guy who had an unused case on the shelf in his garage that he was going to make into a coffee table... one day. He says he has no idea on the internals, but he would trade for my roached one 'cuz he only needs a "coffee table" quality case.
He brings it to work yesterday and drops it into the back of my truck. It's an AS21 dual relief case that's "only" a 1600! Fingers crossed it'll be better than the one I have inside.
A weird serial number, right? WTF?
Wish me luck fellas. I'll keep it updated here as I progress. Be safe. _________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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jeffrey8164 Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2018 Posts: 3819 Location: Georgia
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Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2021 8:47 am Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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When you order a new case it comes with no stamping. At least mine didn’t.
Who knows why the original builder stamped it 125.
If I had the stamping kit, I would’ve stamped mine the original engine numbers 😉 _________________ Volkswagen!
Turning owners into mechanics since 1938.
“Let he that is without oil throw the first rod”
(Compression 8.7:1) |
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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:27 am Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Main bearings on the AS21 case are only .010 and in much better shape!
Onward! :2gunfire: _________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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Lingwendil Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2009 Posts: 3988 Location: Antioch, California, a block from the hood
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Brian_e Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009 Posts: 3294 Location: Rapid City, SD
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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:43 am Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Your plan sounds perfect to me!
Send the case to Brothers in Ontario to do the machine work.
Panchito's, or Tims S1 heads would be perfect.
Brian _________________ www.type-emotorsports.com |
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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 12:59 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Been a little delay, but the cases are shipping today! _________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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vwracerdave Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004 Posts: 15309 Location: Deep in the 405
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Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:44 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Quote: |
76mm crank
5.5 rods
94mm B pistons
cb2288 cam
10:1, .045" deck height
light flywheel
1 1/2" header
Really good 40x35 heads, 180+ cfm @ .550", 285ft/sec average port velocity
1.5 rockers
44mm IDF's |
With the current gas situation and this BS green new deal scam I suggest you be a little conservative on CR and run 8.7-9.0 to be able to run on 89 octane gas. I'm guessing with the push for electric vehicles because of climate change hoax, we may soon not be able to get 91 or 93 octane gas. Maybe I'm wrong so build whatever you want, but consider what may happen to all of us very soon. _________________ 2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK |
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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 7:20 am Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Brian_e wrote: |
Your plan sounds perfect to me!
Send the case to Brothers in Ontario to do the machine work.
Panchito's, or Tims S1 heads would be perfect.
Brian |
The cases are back from Brothers'. There was a little delay in finding my cases but once located, the turn-around was properly quick and beautiful results!
Sure, there's still cleaning to do, but the ball continues to roll. Also... I have been convinced to put an 82mm crank inside with the 94mm pistons. Should be interesting! _________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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Matthew Samba Member
Joined: January 29, 2004 Posts: 1760 Location: Eastern Tennessee
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Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 10:26 am Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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The case looks good.
Every Samba build turns into a 82 x 94. Now you will need better heads... _________________ 1965 Beetle sedan
Click to view image |
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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 2:18 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Matthew wrote: |
The case looks good.
Every Samba build turns into a 82 x 94. Now you will need better heads... |
One thing at a time, Mathew... one thing at a time.
Next thing I need are pieces to go inside the case.
Quote: |
Hello CB?..... I'd like to place a phone order for delivery... |
_________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2022 1:51 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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So, question for the community...
As the CCs have gone up to 2276, from the original recipe, do the heads need to be upgraded in any way? Or are Tim's stage I still a good choice?
Edit to add:
Crank & rods and misc. hardware have arrived from CB. Cam & lifters from Car Craft. Most of the stuff to assemble the cases. _________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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sled Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2005 Posts: 6179
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Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2022 2:48 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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well, a glass buggy does not need anywhere near the lower end torque that a bus does, nor a beetle. You can get away with a "larger" head as you won't notice lack of air speed at lower rpms like you would in a heavy vehicle. That being said, Tims S2's are loved by MANY on 2276/2332 street engines.
will your S1's hold you back? theoretically yes, but it depends on how you will realistically drive this thing. Do you want to bang gears at 6000-6500 rpms? or are you going to just put around town shifting at 4500?
My buddy has a 2332 in a 1956 bus with w120 cam and GOOD 40x35 heads with around 68cc ports. It pulls HARD where you want it to, but the same combo wouldn't be quite as fun in a buggy as its more torque focused, and less rpm.
$0.02 _________________ drive your split. |
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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2022 8:34 am Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Mr. Tims has replied to my inquiry and says that the Stage II heads are his recommendation & says the combo as described to him should be good for 160 HP. Onwards! :2gunfire: _________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 4:05 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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So, as I failed to update this thread... the buggy is now on the road!
I understand the transaxle is "pretty good" and "may" hold up to some abuse...
I have a fresh built trans in the works. I will drive it 99% on the road, 1% at the dragstrip?? but long freeway trips aren't in the future. As I try and decide on some gear ratios, I found comments by Murzi regarding his box
3.88:1 R&P
3.78 1st
2.06 2nd
1.48 3rd
1.04 (1.00?) 4th
At that Alstrup mentioned an alternative set up:
3.88:1 R&P
Keep 1st & 2nd as above
1.44 3rd
.93 4th
What do y'all think? Could I run down the freeway for an hour on Murzi's box or would I be better off with Alstrup's set up? _________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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vwracerdave Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004 Posts: 15309 Location: Deep in the 405
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 4:32 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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We need to know what size rear tires before we can make any gear ratio suggestions.
I have 29" tall 255/70-15 rear tires with a 4.12 R&P and 3.78/2.06/1.48/1.04 gears. I can cruise all day long doing 70 MPH at 3500 RPM. I don't drive my buggy any faster because it is so light it will start wondering with any amount of wind or semi truck side draft. A have a pair of 26" tall 235/60-15 DOT drag radials I put on when I go to the track. _________________ 2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK |
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slayer61 Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2021 Posts: 1018 Location: CA
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Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 7:58 am Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Sorry Dave.., I failed to mention 295/50-15 or 26.625" give or take on the rears. _________________
Cusser wrote: |
... Most folks are idiots when it deals with electrical !!! |
67rustavenger wrote: |
3/4 race cam? What's missing, one of the lobes? |
Paul
'68 Manx clone... Sears??
2276 built on AS21 case
W-125 w/ GB 1.25:1 rockers
Mahle forged pistons
CB 4340 crank
CB H beam rods
deep sump
44 HPMX
EMPI GTV 2 STG II wedge ports
CB Magna spark
1 5/8 merged collector w/ hater stinger |
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Back to top |
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vwracerdave Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004 Posts: 15309 Location: Deep in the 405
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Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 9:56 am Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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https://weddleindustries.com/gear-calculator
You need to play around with the gear ratio calculator and see what you want.
295/50-15 and 3.88 R&P with 1.04 4th is 71 MPH at 3600 RPM highway cruising.
For a lightweight Dunebuggy with 295/50-15 rear tires I'd consider a 4.12 R&P with stock 3.78/2.06/1.26/.93 gears. That will be 74 MPH at 3600 RPM cruising, and have a little more zip in 1st & 2nd gear city driving than the 3.88 R&P. This will be a lot cheaper to build than a trans with close ratio 3/4. _________________ 2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK |
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clonebug Samba Member
Joined: January 29, 2005 Posts: 4028 Location: NW Washington
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Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 5:11 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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I have a stock geared 67 transaxle with 275/60-15 tires at 28 inches tall and I love the gearing especially with the turbo. I can cruise 70 mph at 3100 rpm and 55 mph at 2450 rpm.
To me it is almost the perfect gearing but I do have the turbo to help me at higher speeds. _________________
vwracerdave wrote: |
Take a good long look in the mirror and report back on what you see. |
Paul.H wrote: |
That one line on that chart is probably better info than you can get from this place in a month |
My Megasquirt Fuel Injection Turbo Buggy Build
Water/Alcohol Injection
Audi TT intercooler
Upgraded to MS3Pro-Evo
EcuMaster PMU16
ECUMaster ADU5 Digital Dash
http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=127936 |
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EVfun Samba Member
Joined: April 01, 2012 Posts: 5481 Location: Seattle
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Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 5:23 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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slayer61 wrote: |
I have a fresh built trans in the works. I will drive it 99% on the road, 1% at the dragstrip?? but long freeway trips aren't in the future. As I try and decide on some gear ratios, I found comments by Murzi regarding his box
3.88:1 R&P
3.78 1st
2.06 2nd
1.48 3rd
1.04 (1.00?) 4th
At that Alstrup mentioned an alternative set up:
3.88:1 R&P
Keep 1st & 2nd as above
1.44 3rd
.93 4th
What do y'all think? Could I run down the freeway for an hour on Murzi's box or would I be better off with Alstrup's set up? |
As you mentioned later, this is with a 26.6 inch tall tire.
I would recommend you follow Alstrup's advice. It fits the 1% racing situation better. I have a box in my garage (with '67 axles) that is geared:
4.375 R&P
3.8 first
2.06 second
1.32 third (from a 40 horse Bug box)
0.93 forth
The transaxle was built by Transform (remember them?). With 29 inch tall rear tires that drove very well in my first buggy. With your large engine and shorter tires you can pull the taller R&P. It ran a warmed over 1600 DP engine and the buggy weighed in at 1100 lb. (it was a stripped down death trap) I still have that transaxle in my garage, it could end up in my buggy at some point. _________________
Wildthings wrote: |
As a general rule, cheap parts are the most expensive parts you can buy. |
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madmike Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2005 Posts: 5292 Location: Atlanta,Michigan
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Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 7:11 pm Post subject: Re: Slayer's glass buggy 2109 |
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Slayer,,In a while from now, You will be Bored with just the power from dual Carbs: N/a.... so keep the stock ratio gearing for the New 'Turbo' Power ? Nice tub Buggy & a Stinger too _________________ 'Black Ice'Drag Buggy 'Turbo'
Rail Buggy 1915 turbo
76 Drag/Street bug 2180cc 'Turbo' 11:85 @113 mph"If I go any faster I'll burn up the Hamster" ,gets 28 mpg. also 10/09/22 11.90 @115 mph
"If I'm ever on Life Support,UNPLUG Me, Then Plug me back In see if that Works" |
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