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Tom K.
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kingkarmann
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 Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 8:41 am Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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| Tom K. wrote: |
| Does anyone have side by side pictures of the pre '71 and post '71 Ghia bumpers front and rear for comparison? I'm looking to buy some for my '65. These tired eyes can't seem to discern any difference, and I'd rather not end up with the wrong ones. Thanks. |
It's really the rear bumper you need to focus on.
Rear bumper blade and overrider are different on a 70-71. The overrider doues not wrap around the rear quarter.
61-69 rear bumper
The overrider wraps around the quarter
61-71 front bumpers are essentially the same.
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Tom K.
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Marcdeb
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 9:15 am Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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There is a long blade and short blade difference due to a change in the shape of the rear wheel opening. I'm not sure what years have the long blade. There are threads in the "stickies" portion of the Ghia forum that have these details.
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Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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kingkarmann
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 9:31 am Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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| Marcdeb wrote: |
| There is a long blade and short blade difference due to a change in the shape of the rear wheel opening. I'm not sure what years have the long blade. There are threads in the "stickies" portion of the Ghia forum that have these details. |
I forgot about those pesky blades....and back up lights 
Here's that link
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=563123
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Tom K.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 12:24 pm Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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OK, so I read through the year-by-year changes thread. Here is a summary of bumper changes:
'58-'59: Over-rider tubes added (except for '59-'60)
'70: Over-rider tubes on rear bumper now end at rear of car, instead of curving around fender flank and ending near wheel opening. (Reason: so as not to block lite from new, larger rear lens.)
'72: Over-rider tubes ended
The sticky does not mention blades.
So, as long as I am looking at used bumpers with over-riders, then I simply need to avoid rear bumpers from the 1970 and 1971 model years. Those bumpers will have "short" tubes.
Thanks!
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'91 Vanagon Westfalia
'70 Beetle Convertible
'71 Super Beetle Semi-Automatic: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=714131&highlight=
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jeffrey8164 
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:38 pm Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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My rear bumper is from a ’69. (Since I was removing the reflectors and liked the wrap around look better.)
Notice how the longer blade protrudes over the wheel opening just a tad.
The mounting points are the same however.
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sputnick60
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:25 pm Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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| Tom K. wrote: |
OK, so I read through the year-by-year changes thread. Here is a summary of bumper changes:
'58-'59: Over-rider tubes added (except for '59-'60)
'70: Over-rider tubes on rear bumper now end at rear of car, instead of curving around fender flank and ending near wheel opening. (Reason: so as not to block lite from new, larger rear lens.)
'72: Over-rider tubes ended
The sticky does not mention blades.
So, as long as I am looking at used bumpers with over-riders, then I simply need to avoid rear bumpers from the 1970 and 1971 model years. Those bumpers will have "short" tubes.
Thanks! |
....And for your '65 you should avoid rear bumpers for MY67 or newer.
Watch out for compatibility of the corner. Obviously the '71 version short tube isn't compatible with any earlier corners with the attachment hole being in a different place. Then anything after MY67 will fit your '65 but the bumper end will be irregularly placed.
Here are some photos from the gallery highlighting differences.
MY66 is the last year for the longer corner pieces.
Then there is this image from the Parts book showing the exploded view...
Hopefully that's useful to you.
Nicholas
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Tom K.
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iowegian
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 5:42 pm Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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As mentioned, short rear corner blades will bolt on to an earlier car, they just fall short of the wheel opening. Not correct for a Purist, but most folks will not know the difference.
'69 bumper on a '61 Ghia
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kingkarmann
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 6:17 pm Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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| Tom K. wrote: |
| Amazing info, Sputnick thank you! |
Agreed!
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Tom K.
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Rob Combs
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:39 am Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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Hi everyone,
The original post mentioned post-71 bumpers too. Maybe I missed something here but the discussion seems to centered around pre-72 bumpers, which is appropriate given the OP has a 65.
Thought I'd mention that the 72-74 bumpers are a totally different beast and the OP should rule those right out... |
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Tom K.
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Marcdeb
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:30 am Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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| Tom K. wrote: |
| Yes, I'm looking only at differences with the over-rider style bumpers, which ended in '72. I've had good luck collecting the many pieces so far by scouring Craigslist. All I have left to get is the three rear blades, the mounting brackets, and then the hardware. |
Actually, the over-rider, which I think you are talking about the Towel Bars ended with the 71 model year. The 72's had the newer and totally different bumpers.
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Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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Tom K.
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 1:36 pm Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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Correct. Here is a new summary for the possible future reader:
Beginning in '58-'59: Over-rider tubes added (except for '59-'60)
Beginning in '67: Rear corner blades shortened by about 1-2 inches to accommodate larger wheel openings
Beginning in '70: Over-rider tubes on rear bumper end at rear of car instead of curving around fender flank to accommodate larger tail light housing
Beginning in '72: Over-rider tubes ended (and mounting brackets changed)
Basically, for my '65 I need to avoid rear bumper parts made after '67 and before '60. I think I can buy any mounting brackets up to '71. This knowledge has been extremely helpful.
Also, I've found new bumper seals at M&T Imports. I haven't ordered them yet because one of the stashes of bumper parts ordered on Craigslist includes those (old and original) seals. But I'm guessing those seals are hard and brittle.
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'91 Vanagon Westfalia
'70 Beetle Convertible
'71 Super Beetle Semi-Automatic: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=714131&highlight=
'65 Ghia: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=762478&highlight= |
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sputnick60
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iowegian
Samba Curmudgeon
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 5:19 pm Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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| Tom K. wrote: |
Basically, for my '65 I need to avoid rear bumper parts made after '67 and before '60. I think I can buy any mounting brackets up to '71. |
Rear center blade , center bow (tube), and overriders (bumper guards) will be the same through '71. Don't forget the overriders are left and right. |
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Tom K.
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Marcdeb
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:48 am Post subject: Re: Ghia Bumper Differences |
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| Tom K. wrote: |
So I'm acquiring things piece by piece. I'm noticing different sizes for these brackets. Can anyone clue me in as to the difference here? Thanks.
[/img] |
Your picture shows the older style front covers. Pretty sure they are 69 and older. The earliest Ghias from the 50's and early 60's may be different as well, I don't have any experience with the earliest cars. 70/71 are not the same.
These Bracket Covers sort of all look the same but they are NOT. Ask me how I know!. The 70/71 covers have a drop down edge that tucks under the bumper. They also use one screw to mount onto the brackets, the second screw replaced with a bump that rides in a hole on the bumper bracket. Also the bottom of the covers have a smaller shape. The edges that press up to the car apron are not the same shape either. Here's pictures of the rears, the fronts have the same characteristic changes. The cover on the left fits 70/71 for sure. The one on the right is for older Ghias, I think 69 and older but I'm not sure what year is the cut off.
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Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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