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Klister Samba Member
Joined: March 06, 2018 Posts: 185 Location: Washington
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 2:14 pm Post subject: No longer vanless |
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I had a '69 Westfalia for 8 years and gave it up when my daughter got her license so we could have 2 cars that everyone could drive.
For the past 2 years I've been searching for a syncro - 1st year was mostly educating myself and getting used to the market ($$$!!!). I was at a meetup near Seattle recently and one van owner asked what I was driving, and then noted "Oh, so currently vanless". Sniff.
But recently picked up one in Seattle - 1991, purchased in Germany and shipped over, rebuilt engine recently to 2.3L. Basic but excellent condition with only 91k miles on it. Full camper.
First of likely many questions. The battery under the passenger seat has a lid on it with 4 screws. The plate for the rotating seat covers two of the screws - so you need to take off the seat and that plate just to get to the dang battery??
The lever for allowing the seat to rotate is broken (near term project) so I can't tell if that would allow access. Thanks
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SCM Samba Member
Joined: January 26, 2011 Posts: 3102 Location: Bozeman MT
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 2:21 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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Klister wrote: |
The plate for the rotating seat covers two of the screws - so you need to take off the seat and that plate just to get to the dang battery??
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Kind of. You might also be able to do that by rotating the swivel 90 degrees without removing the seat but I don't really remember.
That lid over the aux battery is hinged on the side nearest the sink. So, if you slide the driver's seat forward and off its rails (there's a little release lever on the side of the seat nearest the door) you can rotate the swivel base 180 degrees and that will allow you to flip that battery door up without using tools. Once you do this once or twice it becomes really easy.
Nice van! _________________ '91 Westfalia GL Automatic (GTA "Turbo" Rebuild w/Peloquin) and 2.3L GoWesty Engine |
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DigiMatrix Samba Member
Joined: April 20, 2010 Posts: 449 Location: Up North Canada
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 2:26 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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Klister wrote: |
The battery under the passenger seat has a lid on it with 4 screws. The plate for the rotating seat covers two of the screws - so you need to take off the seat and that plate just to get to the dang battery?? |
Just rotate the Passenger seat 180 and you can get at the battery no issue - don't have to remove the seat, once you fix the rotate feature. _________________ _________________
'91 Syncro Westfalia
soon to be 2.5 liter stroker WBX 10:1 comp
Digifant ECU with knock sensor and custom
cylinder selective knock control by me |
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leecat Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2012 Posts: 773 Location: Regina
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 2:38 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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That is one nice looking van. I wish I was a millionaire too, and that's what I'd drive!!! I'll be happy to make you a ridiculously lowball offer though - after all, who wants a van with a broken front seat rotating lever? |
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bobbyblack Samba Member
Joined: May 21, 2015 Posts: 4333 Location: United States, Iowa
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 2:53 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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DigiMatrix wrote: |
Just rotate the Passenger seat 180 and you can get at the battery no issue - don't have to remove the seat, once you fix the rotate feature. |
And... Possibly slide the seat toward the front of the bus after rotating. BTW, I keep a screwdriver and a 10mm wrench tucked in right beside the Passenger seat back... never know when you might have to get that cover off QUICK!!
Oh, and also... ya, LOVE that bus. I can't imagine the jump from a Bay to a Syncro Vanagon... But, it is possible at some point some old granny will need one taken out of her barn, and I'll be 'sad' to accept. I admit to collecting old VW's, but a Syncro is just a little beyond my target scope until I win the lotto.
Also, the broken rotation lever was most likely due to some previous owner not taking the time to learn how to twist/wiggle/twist the lever out when removing the turret at some point. I've been nearly there once myself. I needed to take a good rest before attempting to finagle it back correctly anyway. Good luck with the fix!!
-bobby _________________ '87 Westy 'Flossie','86 Westy 'R1','86 tintop GL - Subi2.2 'J2','83.5 stock tintop L 'ZoomBus','74 Karmann Ghia, '63 Notch
Last edited by bobbyblack on Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:31 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Ahwahnee Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010 Posts: 9776 Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:17 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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I rotate the seat but then move it by 45* long enough to get the screws out... more access that way.
I use an cordless drill on those screws as they are fine thread and longish, take a while with just a screwdriver.
Nice Syncro (but better you can than me). |
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tjet Samba Member
Joined: June 10, 2014 Posts: 3528 Location: CA & NM
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:18 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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Klister wrote: |
But recently picked up one in Seattle - 1991, purchased in Germany and shipped over, rebuilt engine recently to 2.3L.
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So that would be a "grey market" vehicle. I wonder what the R&P ratio is.
Clean van . Cant go wrong with a syncro westy, especially a last year production model. Trifecta. |
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elizer Samba Member
Joined: May 02, 2016 Posts: 1450 Location: Northern Virginia
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 4:08 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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OMG beautiful syncro!
Its a twin of mine!
I always wanted a white one but I "settled" for blue.
I bet the inside looks amazing!
The day I got it. Doesn't look quite the same.now.
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vanis13 Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2010 Posts: 3082 Location: ABQ NM USA.... Except when not
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 4:53 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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elizer wrote: |
OMG beautiful syncro!
Its a twin of mine!
I always wanted a white one but I "settled" for blue.
I bet the inside looks amazing!
The day I got it. Doesn't look quite the same.now.
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You get it at the dealer?
Maybe you traded 4 JEEPs for it?.... Or 20 Chryslers? _________________ 83.5 Westy with Subaru 2.5, 4 spd manual, center seat, COLD A/C on 134a!, Winter camp heated with an Espar B4 gasoline furnace
www.SuperVanagon.com - some stuff I make |
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Klister Samba Member
Joined: March 06, 2018 Posts: 185 Location: Washington
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 5:09 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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djkeev wrote: |
Nice find!
Original Syncro Westy?
There are a lot of transplants onto tintops running around.
Dave |
Yep original 2 knob westy syncro. The 80 year old German woman purchased over there and was, until recently, still driving it! |
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Klister Samba Member
Joined: March 06, 2018 Posts: 185 Location: Washington
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 5:14 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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elizer wrote: |
OMG beautiful syncro!
Its a twin of mine!
I always wanted a white one but I "settled" for blue.
I bet the inside looks amazing!
The day I got it. Doesn't look quite the same.now.
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Very nice! Wheels and suspension are on my list.
A few projects to do but generally in great shape, missing stove knob, the owner had no idea what happened to the lug wrench or jack ("I never changed a tire - got a flat once and called AAA") |
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elizer Samba Member
Joined: May 02, 2016 Posts: 1450 Location: Northern Virginia
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 5:15 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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vanis13 wrote: |
You get it at the dealer?
Maybe you traded 4 JEEPs for it?.... Or 20 Chryslers? |
I got it about 6 years ago when the prices were falling off slightly after the gowesty price craziness. I called the moment it popped up and I left a deposit (7 people already called). I picked it up for what I consider a good price compared to todays market price.
104k miles - 100% original no modifications. $24,500 in Bay City, Mi. I'm the one who ruined it and made it look like how it does today.
I have to say Klister's is really nice. I really wanted white, but none were around. I can't wait to see more pictures of everything. |
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kamzcab86 Samba Moderator
Joined: July 26, 2008 Posts: 7893 Location: Arizona
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 7:03 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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Congrats!
tjet wrote: |
So that would be a "grey market" vehicle. |
Or, bought through VW's tourist delivery program. M-code sticker would reveal the details. _________________ ~Kamz
1986 Cabriolet: www.Cabby-Info.com
1990 Vanagon Westfalia: Old Blue's Blog
2016 Golf GTI S
"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance." - 孔子 |
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Sodo Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007 Posts: 9521 Location: Western WA
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Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 10:52 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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Klister wrote: |
Yep original 2 knob westy syncro. The 80 year old German woman purchased over there and was, until recently, still driving it! |
I'm sure one is the rear locker.
But what does the 2nd knob do? Front locker or decoupler?
Very nice to have low-mile stuff.
Did you get service records?
It's time for my reminder to dump out that factory gear oil along with the original break-in trash that's likely been been in there since mile-zero.
There is a component in the gearbox called the 3rd/4th slider that lasts about 125,000-175,000 miles, then it breaks and can ruin other very expensive stuff plus delete many useful miles from the components NOT destroyed. Much like a timing belt on a modern car. They call you an idiot if you let a timing belt break due to inattention, but on Vanagons it's a "custom" to drive 'til it breaks it and take the whole trans down. It's been a known problem for 20 years, wise to replace the hub at 125,000.
And there's other stuff, like deleting the ground strap at the front of the transaxle, replace it with a cable direct from the starter mount bolt.
Flush the power steering to preserve what you have, you can't get good rebuilt power steering racks anymore.
Have all the CVs serviced, they could be OEM and could go another 100k if taken care of.
If you're parking it outside take care that the driver-side rocker panel stays dry inside, they rust out. People say it's the utility boxes leaking too.
Do you live in the PNW or just come here to snatch our vans?
Anyway Congrats! _________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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Klister Samba Member
Joined: March 06, 2018 Posts: 185 Location: Washington
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2021 10:01 am Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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Sodo wrote: |
Klister wrote: |
Yep original 2 knob westy syncro. The 80 year old German woman purchased over there and was, until recently, still driving it! |
I'm sure one is the rear locker.
But what does the 2nd knob do? Front locker or decoupler?
Very nice to have low-mile stuff.
Did you get service records?
It's time for my reminder to dump out that factory gear oil along with the original break-in trash that's likely been been in there since mile-zero.
There is a component in the gearbox called the 3rd/4th slider that lasts about 125,000-175,000 miles, then it breaks and can ruin other very expensive stuff plus delete many useful miles from the components NOT destroyed. Much like a timing belt on a modern car. They call you an idiot if you let a timing belt break due to inattention, but on Vanagons it's a "custom" to drive 'til it breaks it and take the whole trans down. It's been a known problem for 20 years, wise to replace the hub at 125,000.
And there's other stuff, like deleting the ground strap at the front of the transaxle, replace it with a cable direct from the starter mount bolt.
Flush the power steering to preserve what you have, you can't get good rebuilt power steering racks anymore.
Have all the CVs serviced, they could be OEM and could go another 100k if taken care of.
If you're parking it outside take care that the driver-side rocker panel stays dry inside, they rust out. People say it's the utility boxes leaking too.
Do you live in the PNW or just come here to snatch our vans?
Anyway Congrats! |
My mistake - meant single knob for the rear diff locker. I live in Seattle - so when this came up I was able to jump across town the next day for a test drive. Owner had 7 calls already. Crazy. And yes - I have all the service records - German woman owner, very organized. Have all the manuals and even the folder that came with the pickup in Germany with their name on it.
Thanks for the advice - what is the issue with the ground strap vs cable - just more dependable? Yea, upgrade from my '69 so I'm on the learning curve. Thank goodness for the experts here! |
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Wasted youth Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2012 Posts: 5134 Location: California's Hot and Smoggy Central Valley
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2021 10:17 am Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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To remove either battery, I always need to remove the seats, then the seat bases. Previous owner detached the hinges on the lids. I kinda like that, actually. The carpet holds it there and they don't rattle. |
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davideric9 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2009 Posts: 998 Location: Oakland CA
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2021 3:52 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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maybe a difference between the years, but my 1987 westies do not have hinges on the battery lid _________________ 1987 Syncro Westfalia, stock (bought 1994)
1986 Syncro Westfalia SVX, 3 knob (bought 2008)
1987 Westfalia (bought 2010)
1988 Wolfsburg GL (bought 2012) |
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MsTaboo Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2006 Posts: 4065 Location: East Kootenay, British Columbia
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2021 4:22 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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Nice looking Syncro Westy. Great score!
I believe that PNW vehicles make the best used cars. All that rain washes them clean and not much sun to cook the rubber and interiors.
As long as they're not parked in the shade where the moss can grow!
Reminds me of ours when it was young. We bought it from the original owner in Seattle in 2006. We sold it when we moved to Canada, instantly regretted, however were able to buy it back in 2008.
Here it is on the way home to Canada at a PNW get-together in White Salmon.
Been a few additions over the years.
_________________ Currently:
'90 Syncro Westy 3 knob w/Zetec
The information age has morphed into the age of disinformation and willful ignorance. Agnotology!
Help the fight against Truth Decay.
Defend democracy, support Ukraine. |
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Sodo Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007 Posts: 9521 Location: Western WA
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2021 10:56 pm Post subject: Re: No longer vanless |
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Klister wrote: |
what is the issue with the ground strap vs cable - just more dependable? |
Strap vs cable likely makes no difference.
It's "proper ground; starter cable direct to chassis"
.vs.
"multiple series interfaces; starter ground to main case to gear carrier housing to low gear housing to ground strap to chassis".
5 connections in series, all old, outdoors, dissimilar materials, non-serviceable.
The resistances are additive (series)
And there's risk that current could take a path thru transmission bearings.
I suspect many starters have been replaced for not FIRST eliminating this silly ground path deficiency.
A direct ground cable is $15 well-spent. If you ever have starter problems your diagnosis can actually be 'conclusive'.
Other thread: Starter Ground No Start
There are not a lot of pics of this mod.
It may the lowest-cost mod there is. _________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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