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tehillah1 Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2009 Posts: 306 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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I like those little, odd shaped patches...you're quilting it back together. |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Major progress this last weekend. Finally got the heater channel in place.
Prep in the A-pillar cavity by using Corroseal primer then shot some rattle can paint to cover it. It is still wet here but it dries black.
Cut the defroster tube to length and welded the original top piece on. I wrapped it with some permanent flex tape for strength. The old pipe was a bit thin and could unravel.
Tacked here and there, and the door gap was good. Then went for it!
Door gaps 5-6mm on this side. Any tighter and the door would rub on the protrusion on the striker. Latch engagement is very good, and the rubber guide buffers are fitted. The door closes solid and aligned.
Next is B-pillar tacking, then quarter panel fitting. This hot and heavy progress really is satisfying to see done. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=765074 |
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VW_Jimbo Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2016 Posts: 10621 Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 10:20 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Very nice update! Looks very well done! _________________ Jimbo
There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!
TDCTDI wrote: |
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look. |
67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 12:22 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Thanks Jimbo. I am grateful this forum is here for me to document the project, and to get feedback from others. I have definitely learned a lot from the other members that have done similar repairs.
This journey is going to be a long one but very worthwhile, IMO. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=765074 |
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VW_Jimbo Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2016 Posts: 10621 Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 1:10 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Dan22 wrote: |
Thanks Jimbo. I am grateful this forum is here for me to document the project, and to get feedback from others. I have definitely learned a lot from the other members that have done similar repairs.
This journey is going to be a long one but very worthwhile, IMO. |
It is totally worth it! My wife agrees hesitantly. See has seen a lot of Bugs come and go. This is the oldest one I have restored for myself! So, it’s a keeper! _________________ Jimbo
There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!
TDCTDI wrote: |
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look. |
67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2024 10:34 am Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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I spent a good bit of time measuring and aligning the B-pillar. Measured it to a knat's nose to 924mm, and made sure the surface is planar to the rest of the jamb. There is a slight angle to the jamb surface, slanting away from inside to outside. The vertical measurement here is perfect to spec as well.
This pic I am aligning the upper surface to the lower by parallel rulers. I did this at several points up the B-pillar and all were good.
Door gap check is good.
Tacked. I will not weld this home until I graft in the quarter panel patch.
I then switched gears to see how much I could repair the warped original panel. I bought a shrinking disk a few years ago and watched videos on how to use it. I roughed in the upper half of the damage area with hammer and dolly but reached a point of no improvement. I sanded off the paint, and gave the disk a go at it.
Probably hard to tell the progress. It took many repeat runs of spraying and disking and checking. The spots are my spot welder electric shrinking points. So all the process is not just the shrinking disk.
I was not going for perfection since most of this damage will be replaced, but again, I wanted to see how well the shrinking process worked. My grinder is quite heavy so it is not an easy task. The lower edge of the panel is not attached so I could not really work it down there. The upper half did improve. It is easy to see the pocked area that is still low, and is not worth fixing. It will get replaced with clean metal. The door gap is not good mid way up as well. My panel cut line will be diagonal from up by the door latch, down to the wheel well. I want to preserve as much original metal as possible, hence my effort to smooth the upper area downward.
I have to say that it did work much of the high spot streched metal back to a smooth surface. I DA'd this to show the high/low spots better. The reflection and feel is not bad.
Today I start fitting in the replacement QP.
_________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=765074 |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2024 10:13 am Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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OK time again for some major cutting and fitting, but this is third base for this car restoration, body work wise.
Trimmed down the new panel, allowing for overlap on the original.
Then cut way the offending metal. No going back!
Fitting it on for a look. Door line looks nice so far.
Clamped and sheet metal screwed it in place. Started by cutting down the door jamb. Targeting half way in between the door seal surface. My cutter is not so good at keeping a straight line. I also fitted it to allow for the kerf to close up and make a no-gap fit. The width of this part is 21mm wide.
Then I moved on to cut the outer line. Once again allowing for kerf.
Sitting there!
All the cutting and crouching the last couple days really wore me out. On to final prep stages for welding - next time. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2024 10:34 am Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Final prep and welding day.
I had some drilled spot weld holes that do not line up (overlap) with the 1955 style cross panel, so I had to fill in these holes first. Made small circular patches and welded them in.
I fully welded them on both sides. This is just the tacking.
I sprayed weld through primer and moved onto final fitting of the QP. The door jamb/upper QP corner was the starting point, in order to get the bend radius and door gap lined up. I was shooting for minimal fit gap but I later found that a tiny gap may be better. I say this because when I tacked in one spot, the shrinkage pushed a zero gap up to a slight bulge on the outer face. I will sort this out in the final welding of the outside. It could also be that I just did not fit it good enough.
Around the world and tacking things in.
A little bit of grinding but not bad! I will be fully welding the outside next. Taking my time and checking everything. The bulge I can clean up with a Dremel cutting wheel. They are super thin and are relatively easy to control. The wheels break easy though.
Ground wheel well, and the door gap.
_________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
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tehillah1 Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2009 Posts: 306 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2024 6:25 am Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Very nice fit on that quarter panel Dan. It looks like everything is laying nice and flat and staying where it belongs. Great repair. |
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VW_Jimbo Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2016 Posts: 10621 Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2024 8:31 am Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Nice job! I like to leave at minimum a 1/32” to 1/16” gap between the 2 pieces when fitting a panel. There are 2 reasons;
1 - it allows for some expansion, as you are becoming well aware of. The issue is it cannot get to big, or you start to REALLY ADD HEAT to the panel, and that equates to warping. But too little means buckling. So, there is a fine line!
2- This is the big reason! If, I mean, IF you end up misaligning or something else changes the alignment, it is super easy to just cut the tack. On the smaller tacks, I use a pair of pointed (read that as custom) dikes. Slender enough to get just a tiny bit further down on the tack blob. This method means, NO HEAT ADDED, which equates to low warping!
Not saying your method is wrong or right. Just saying, from my experiences through the years, some margin of flexibility is nice to have! I am still just a student, still learning all of the ins and outs of this trade, but more on a hobby level. I learn by reading and watching. Maybe, a few dozen books and thousands of articles.
However, there are those with Uber efficient skills and a tight joint works good. Well, they make it look easy and GOOD! Bastards!
Bottom line is do not go too big on that gap. The bigger it is, the more welding has to be done. More welding makes more heat. And heat is what we need to mitigate. But don’t go too small either, for similiar reasoning! And don’t forget those cooled off copper backers!
Oh, and a bucket of water and a rag make for tack welds. Gets the heat out quickly! Clatter recommended this to me for stitch welding. Sounds like zap, zap, zap, psssssssssttttttt. Move to some other area on the other side and repeat zap, zap, zap, psssssssssstttttttt! Then just allow the steel to cool naturally (I.e. go do something else). Return in 20 minutes and relive that last session!
Nice work! Love catching up on your thread! _________________ Jimbo
There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!
TDCTDI wrote: |
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look. |
67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2024 12:46 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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The "pooch" out that I am dealing with is ~2mm max. I think (hope) that when I relieve the excess material, it will pull back down where it should be. I agree on the minimal heat approach. The weld will shrink the cut line down and could result in a valley along the line.
Bottom line is this seam will test and challenge my skills for panel replacement. I know I can get it eventually, but it is more a matter of how the process goes.
I will share the experience for the group. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=765074 |
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VW_Jimbo Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2016 Posts: 10621 Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2024 5:56 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Dan22 wrote: |
The "pooch" out that I am dealing with is ~2mm max. I think (hope) that when I relieve the excess material, it will pull back down where it should be. I agree on the minimal heat approach. The weld will shrink the cut line down and could result in a valley along the line.
Bottom line is this seam will test and challenge my skills for panel replacement. I know I can get it eventually, but it is more a matter of how the process goes.
I will share the experience for the group. |
A copper backer works awesome for mitigating the heat! I use 4 of them. 2 in a bucket of water, 2 under the weld seams. They get swapped out as I proceed. Sometimes the water gets warm from the continuous inserting of the copper bars! That stuff really takes the heat away from the panel!
The next thing I have started doing is using the hammer and dolly through out the process. Get the first few tacks in and hammer them as flat as I can, while also moving the panel where it needs to be. I then bring that first set down and move on. Next set get the same treatment. I will do this at each set of tacks I pop on! Works great! I had no movement when I did the ragtop clip and the passenger door skin! _________________ Jimbo
There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!
TDCTDI wrote: |
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look. |
67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Thu May 02, 2024 4:40 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Spent the evening slowly welding in the seam. It took over an hour with all the welding and cooling and checking. The good news is nothing got worse. The profile gauge shows no warping in the new panel. The original above the cut line had some remaining crash damage. The back side of the weld is showing good penetration.
Ground down and stripped the paint so I can finish it off. I will use all my tricks including the spot weld dent puller, spinning disk and shrinking devices. I find I enjoy even the basic hammer and dolly work.
It is so nice to see clean, continuous metal. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
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VW_Jimbo Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2016 Posts: 10621 Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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Posted: Thu May 02, 2024 6:25 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Nice job! And yes, shiny steel looks so much better than rusty flaky stuff! _________________ Jimbo
There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!
TDCTDI wrote: |
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look. |
67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Sun May 12, 2024 9:02 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Practicing at metal finishing and planishing to the ideal profile. Warpage was minimal but I had to work with the hammer and dolly to add a bit more crown to the shape. Then a couple passes with the shrinking disk to even it out.
Sharpie coverage shows the remaining flaws. I eyeballed the reflection of this panel and it is very close to only needing a very thin coating of filler. Not ready for doing that kind of job yet. I want to finish all the metal work first.
Some side work in the mean time. Made some nut plates for adding in seat belt anchors. The curved ones will fit in the B-pillar for 3 point shoulder belts for the front.
Lastly, I picked up the wrong size fuel tap made for 8mm fuel lines. I bought it from a private member a few years ago so no return option. I figured I could "machine" the pipe OD down with a grinder or sander. To do it, I tapped the hole for a #6 screw, then cut the head off the screw so I can mount it in my drill. Then spin it as I sanded the OD. I used my finger sander. Got it down to 6mm and it is smooth enough and straight enough to not leak.
It is a nice VW logo'd tap, correct style for my car. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
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tehillah1 Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2009 Posts: 306 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Mon May 13, 2024 7:22 am Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Very nice work on that quarter panel Dan. I'm intrigued to see the b-pillar seatbelt mounting process, something I've contemplated for my car. |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Mon May 13, 2024 8:30 am Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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tehillah1 wrote: |
Very nice work on that quarter panel Dan. I'm intrigued to see the b-pillar seatbelt mounting process, something I've contemplated for my car. |
Thanks T1. I will document the seat belt mount progress when I get to that point. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Mon May 20, 2024 10:13 am Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Well, I got to it..
I installed a seat and test fitted where the shoulder belt would be comfortable. I also saw the same location used in later beetles, so it must be appropriate. In my case, I centered it to the door wedge location, which is very close to half way up the quarter window vertical edge.
I double checked the profile of the curve and shaped the nut plate to close to this curve. The radius is tight on one side and wider on the other. The plate size is 50x75mm. The 7/16" nut is welded on both sides and ground do the nut protrudes slightly toward the inside.
Marked the hole and drilled it to just larger than the protruding nut on the nut plate. Used a wire to pull it up into place. This was particularly easy! Note that I have the lower inner panels cut out on my car at the moment due to the outer quarter panel and heater channel repairs. I am not sure if the nut plate can get in the gap of a car without some access modifications.
I used magnets to hold it in place while I put the main bolt in with washers and tightened it up. Then I drilled a couple holes to install sheet metal screws to suck the plate up tight to the inner skin.
Then I drilled several holes to make spot welds. I also welded around the big hole to the nut. Attempting to make as much sheet metal welded contact to spread the load.
It went a little better on the passenger side.
Ground down the weld bumps.
I am happy with the result. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
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tehillah1 Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2009 Posts: 306 Location: Colorado
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Posted: Mon May 20, 2024 4:45 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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I like the process Dan. I've seen folks cut out the b-pillar and weld a patch with a weld nut back in. That seemed beyond my skillset, but I can see how your process makes sense. Will you use a typical floor mount lap belt set up? |
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Dan22 Samba Member
Joined: August 30, 2019 Posts: 562 Location: Battle Ground, WA
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Posted: Mon May 20, 2024 5:40 pm Post subject: Re: The Life and Rebuild of Dad’s Iceland Green 1955 Beetle |
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Yes, I will have one floor mount and the other on the side of the tunnel. I intend to weld a nut directly to the tunnel, flat or slightly raised to the outside.
This assumes that I can do that without there being internal tubes to deal with getting around. If it fails, I will mount to the pan both sides. _________________ 1-0900722 die langsame grüne Schildkröte
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