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LDP28
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2022
Posts: 11
Location: Canada
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 Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2022 12:18 pm Post subject: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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Could anyone help me. Im tryna figure out where the main relay is and I cant find it. Also is it normal that my fuel pump relay is plugged like this. Thanks !
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22422
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2022 12:57 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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I think you're missing the pump wire it self. The white plug and wires come from the engine compartment/ECU, while the red wire comes from the fuse box. What you're missing is the power wire from the relay to the pump, as the ground wire connects to a bare metal spot under the dash.
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Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
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LDP28
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2022
Posts: 11
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2022 2:33 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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Thanks. I followed the wire from the fuel pump and this is where they go. Im kinda confused. One goes on the fuse box (red wire) and the other i have no clue.
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KTPhil 
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34009
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2022 3:37 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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#3 is the main relay under the back seat.
$4 is the pump relay under the dash.
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LDP28
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2022
Posts: 11
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2022 3:58 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| Thanks for the info about the main relay ! |
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LDP28
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2022
Posts: 11
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 12:24 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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Is this thing the main relay ? If so what pin are which
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22422
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 12:56 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| LDP28 wrote: |
Is this thing the main relay ? If so what pin are which
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No, that's the Voltage Regulator. The main relay looks exactly like the one up front under the dash, but is mounted on the back side of the left kick panel. It might have a small relay sitting right next to it (for the rear window de-fog).
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Erik G
Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002
Posts: 13278
Location: Tejas!
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 1:27 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| also, looks like a bug voltage relay in place of the original. it will work, but as you can see doesnt bolt up, and wires have to stretch. one of those looks a little melty as well. Was this a running driving car or are you rescuing from the dead? |
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LDP28
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2022
Posts: 11
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 2:26 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| Im tryna rescue it from the dead. It hasn’t run in over 25 years. |
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LDP28
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2022
Posts: 11
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 2:30 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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Is this the fuel pump ? If so the wires of it dont go the relay whatsoever. One goes on the fuse box and one seems to be going to the ignition switch but im not sure
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Mike Fisher
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Joined: January 30, 2006
Posts: 17970
Location: Eugene, OR
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 9:30 am Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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Yes, it's the stock fuel pump.
All the rotten cloth covered hoses need to be replaced as they will spring pin hole leeks!
Take it All apart and clean/rebuild/rewire, including a new fuel filter.
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69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
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'68 Karmann Ghia sold
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22422
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 12:24 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| LDP28 wrote: |
Is this the fuel pump ? If so the wires of it dont go the relay whatsoever. One goes on the fuse box and one seems to be going to the ignition switch but im not sure
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Yes, the PO might have been trying to get the pump to run, by bypassing the relay. More than likely that pump is dead. What quite a few of us have done, is switch to the 2 port 85-90 Ford ranger pump. Airtex part # E2000 or Precision brand #16020. This pump has been found to work very well for FI applications of our cars, so don't think of it as a Ford ranger pump, but rather an FI pump. Note this is an in-out type of pump versus the stock 3 port pump. It's also cheaper 75-100 bucks versus 300+ for the stock Bosch pump (a big reason many of us have gone to it, plus you can get it almost anywhere). I hope this helps.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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JCBond
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2022
Posts: 27
Location: Utah
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 12:30 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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Sorry don't mean to highjack your thread. Where do you guys check the fuel pressure. I guess you can check it on any line? Or you check it between the regulator and the tank in the return line? And what if your pump is rated way high like 80 psi? The regulator will regulate it down to 24 psi?
And I don't really understand why the regulator is on the return line. That doesn't make sense to me. But then not a lot of stuff does. |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22422
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 1:25 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| JCBond wrote: |
Sorry don't mean to highjack your thread. Where do you guys check the fuel pressure. I guess you can check it on any line? Or you check it between the regulator and the tank in the return line? And what if your pump is rated way high like 80 psi? The regulator will regulate it down to 24 psi?
And I don't really understand why the regulator is on the return line. That doesn't make sense to me. But then not a lot of stuff does. |
On the top of the left side injectors is a port on top with an 8mm headed screw with a sealing washer. Remove the screw and washer, and install a piece of 5/16ths hose to it with a clamp, and put your fuel pressure gauge on that. It's also good to use a 0-60 psi gauge, as that puts you in the middle of the gauge with 30psi (most accurate part of the gauge). You're looking for 28-30 psi when the system is charged with fuel and set correctly.
Most of us have made our own gauges using either a water pipe gauge, or a tire pressure gauge, with some fittings and hose with a couple of clamps for less than 10-20 bucks. I think my entire FI pressure gauge set up cost about 12 bucks. Keep in mind Ray would have you buy a really good gauge set up, and use it instead (gauge alone costing 30+). Myself, I'm not that precision on my measurements, as long as I can get close, and see what's going on, that's all I need. Besides I might only use it once or twice a year at most, sometimes not even that much (hard to justify spending a lot of money for testing equipment).
I hope this helps.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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JCBond
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2022
Posts: 27
Location: Utah
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 2:08 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| Bobnotch wrote: |
| JCBond wrote: |
Sorry don't mean to highjack your thread. Where do you guys check the fuel pressure. I guess you can check it on any line? Or you check it between the regulator and the tank in the return line? And what if your pump is rated way high like 80 psi? The regulator will regulate it down to 24 psi?
And I don't really understand why the regulator is on the return line. That doesn't make sense to me. But then not a lot of stuff does. |
On the top of the left side injectors is a port on top with an 8mm headed screw with a sealing washer. Remove the screw and washer, and install a piece of 5/16ths hose to it with a clamp, and put your fuel pressure gauge on that. It's also good to use a 0-60 psi gauge, as that puts you in the middle of the gauge with 30psi (most accurate part of the gauge). You're looking for 28-30 psi when the system is charged with fuel and set correctly.
Most of us have made our own gauges using either a water pipe gauge, or a tire pressure gauge, with some fittings and hose with a couple of clamps for less than 10-20 bucks. I think my entire FI pressure gauge set up cost about 12 bucks. Keep in mind Ray would have you buy a really good gauge set up, and use it instead (gauge alone costing 30+). Myself, I'm not that precision on my measurements, as long as I can get close, and see what's going on, that's all I need. Besides I might only use it once or twice a year at most, sometimes not even that much (hard to justify spending a lot of money for testing equipment).
I hope this helps. |
Thanks. I did make my own pressure gauge in like ten minutes out of stuff in the shop. Thanks for the tip. I hurried and canceled the one I ordered a few hours ago. Like you I'd probably use it only once a year.
This was my top end reading. So I'm assuming the pressure regulator is bad?
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KTPhil
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34009
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 2:18 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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Also could be a pinched line between the regulator and the return.
Replacing all the hoses is a good maintenance thing anyway. 20 feet of hose, maybe 35 FI clamps. |
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JCBond
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2022
Posts: 27
Location: Utah
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 2:35 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| KTPhil wrote: |
Also could be a pinched line between the regulator and the return.
Replacing all the hoses is a good maintenance thing anyway. 20 feet of hose, maybe 35 FI clamps. |
Ok. I did replace all the lines from the tank to the injectors all around and from the injectors to the regulator. But I did not see that line from the regulator back to the tank. It is still the original cloth one. I will replace that. Maybe clogged in there somewhere. I do hear gas dripping into the tank when you stop cranking. |
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JCBond
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2022
Posts: 27
Location: Utah
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 3:00 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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| I blew that line out. Looked clean. And I adjusted the regulator all the way down and still got 60 psi. |
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KTPhil
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34009
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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JCBond
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2022
Posts: 27
Location: Utah
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 3:21 pm Post subject: Re: VW Type 3 Notchback |
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No the pump was shot. I got a new pump with in and out. I've seen that diagram before. So it should be plumbed the same either way. And I didn't know that thing was a dampner. I thought it was a fuel filter. I took it out. Should I put it back?
I think they plumbed the whole thing wrong. Both of those ports that come out of the bottom of the tank are plumbed together and then go to the inlet on the pump. I don't know if you can see from this picture.
Last edited by JCBond on Mon May 02, 2022 3:34 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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