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36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions
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dave conklin
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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2022 12:38 pm    Post subject: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

Last weekend I was at a Porsche swap meet and bought a really nice roller crank for 36 HP VW. It’s super clean and the main journals measure out as standard. The rod bearings feel good. Seems like a nice piece… I just couldn’t leave it there. LOL
If I had the appropriate car, I would throw together a 36 horse motor just to play with, but I don’t. Do you think there’s people out there who would take the risk on it. Is it worth trying to sell… If so what’s it worth?
Opinions welcome.
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Fishynos72
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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2022 6:40 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

firstly that is very cool.

Hens teeth in Australia, might be more common on the other side of the world though.

Personally I'd pull down a running engine to fit it.

I would probably have someone who knows more than I check to make sure it's balance is true and not going to shake the engine apart.
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henry roberts
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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2022 12:53 am    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

great find! what stroke is it?

maybe it is time to build a vintage speed car? we know you have form for building great cars.
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oldslow
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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2022 3:20 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

Stay tuned to this space for exciting news!
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henry roberts
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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2022 7:02 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

very jealous. i was too slow. Crying or Very sad
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oldslow
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 2:24 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

First of all, thanks to dave conklin
He spotted and purchased this crank.
Dave very kindly sold this at a nice price.
The crank is a gamble, as ALL used roller cranks are.
I promised I would measure and inspect it, and report results on theSamba.
If this crank has any life left in it at all
I will build something with it
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earthquake
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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 12:17 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

I talked to Gene Berg years ago and he told me they would drain the oil on a roller crank motor and fill the case full of kerosene and let it idle and listen for noise from the crank to see if the rod bearings were good, he said it would make clicking or knocking noises if the were any problems. He said not to rev it or let it run too long.

eQ
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 7:06 am    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

I have been trying to research SPG roller crankshafts and have been unsuccessful.

Of course the crank has a few pages in “Hotrodding the VW”, but that is talking about cranks for 1300/1600 blocks.

Has anyone seen an advertisement for a SPG roller? I can’t seem to find one anywhere.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 10:07 am    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

Most likely this spg crank is a 74mm with 22mm pins I've never seen or heard of a 64mm 36hp roller crank ...spg made 40hp/1600cc 69mm -82mm cranks ...but I remember in the classified adds a guy had a so called 64mm 40hp spg rollercrank I remember asking him if it was a 69mm and he swore it was a 64mm roller crank with 20mm pins ..I didn't buy it since I didn't think a 64mm roller was need since a plain 64mm crank in a 40hp case has a lot of clearance and was a lot cheaper keeping a plain crank ... I've only seen 74mm roller cranks for 36hp engines/cases /356/912 cases I've never seen a 69mm roller crank for a 36hp or 64mm ...
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RolandD
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 4:27 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

I have stockpiled a 69mm 1600 and 64mm 40 hp crank.

I have never hear of a 64 mm 36 hp crank, but that means nothing.

Phil's inc in Evanston Illinois sold off-road race equipment in the 70's. I can look and see what they listed.


Roland
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oldslow
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 12:40 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

Piston pin measures good, journals measure good.
Stroke is 64mm. 4 dowels, not 8. Piston pins are 20mm. Fits in a 36hp case.

I have no idea how to measure connecting rod wear. Does anyone know?


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Last edited by oldslow on Mon Jun 13, 2022 5:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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dave conklin
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 7:11 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

Probably need to talk to Porsche 356 a engine builders. The early cars all head roller cranks.
As a sidenote, some of my 356 buddies have told me that the issues Porsche had with roller cranks were that they would beat up the cases due to the weight and they did not survive low rpm operation. You needed to keep the revs up so that the bearings will keep oiled.
Really excited to see you doing something with this crank. Should be a fun project
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56samba
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:12 am    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

oldslow wrote:
I have been trying to research SPG roller crankshafts and have been unsuccessful.

Of course the crank has a few pages in “Hotrodding the VW”, but that is talking about cranks for 1300/1600 blocks.

Has anyone seen an advertisement for a SPG roller? I can’t seem to find one anywhere.


At some point, SPG made roller bearing cranks for 36 hp engines as I read in an old brochure from them. Unfortunately, I don't have the brochure anymore and only took two pics.

Jan


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oldslow
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2022 3:46 am    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

.
Found this, 1972
.
.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2022 1:34 am    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

I seem to remember reading that only the 64mm cranks had 4 dowel pins for the flywheel and that they are hard as coffin nails to drill [crank] for the other 4.

eQ
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Link to Kelly J. Nolte 3/20/53 - 11/6/08
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oldslow
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2022 5:11 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

This is the case I intend it put the roller crank in. It’s a VW factory refurbished case, I think. It looks so pretty because someone painted it silver.

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The bearing surfaces have discoloration, but #1 has no ridge at all - passes the “fingernail test” we will see after the clean up.

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I think that this casting number means March 11, 1960?

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esde
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2022 5:22 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

4 pins should be fine, as the roller cranks cannot take the shock of hard shifts and clutch drops anyway. The sections are just pressed together, and too much shock can supposedly twist things. At least this is what I was told when I considered running a roller crank 10 years ago, they pretty quickly talked me out of it.
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RolandD
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 3:28 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

I finally found my 1976 Phil's catalog which listed SPG cranks in 82mm and 84 mm for $427 compared to Pauter cranks for $340.

Have you studied the milled notch in the mains for oils spray?

Roland
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 6:12 pm    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

These are a nice illustration of bearing modifications from Flat4
https://www.facebook.com/320703828073771/posts/spg...801920222/

They say:
SPG ROLLER BEARING CRANKSHAFT ENGINE BUILD.
Now we made modified main bearing to use with SPG Roller Bearing Crankshaft. One in black coated is the N.O.S. set which come with SPG Roller Bearing Crankshaft set and notice anything ?
Yes, there are cut to splash oil to connecting rods bearing. Crankshaft web has a hole passage to connecting rods and this is the only way they can receive oil to their bearing.

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Monzaz
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2022 2:53 am    Post subject: Re: 36 HP Roller Crank Thoughts and Opinions Reply with quote

I have a pair of NOS 64mm SPG Cranks here, 20mm smallends. Yes they do exist.


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