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obieoberstar
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 1126
Location: Tucson
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 Posted: Sat May 21, 2022 6:39 pm Post subject: Did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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First time owner of a pre'68 beetle. I had a really nice '70 some years ago. But with a good price from a friend, this project is now mine.
After it was at home with the title I started to look into things.
i was under the impression it was a '64.
Verified the chassis number on the title to the one on the frame match--58196xx
Arizona tile lists it as a '64. However it also lists the date of it being First Registered as 04/1963.
That does not make sense since thesamba archives show it to be a September 1963 production.
So I have a '63, right?
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obieoberstar
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 1126
Location: Tucson
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| Posted: Sat May 21, 2022 6:53 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| what is left of the original paint looks to be more of a '63 Turquoise than the Bahama Blue of '64. |
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House
Minutia Militia
Joined: June 13, 2001
Posts: 1766
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| Posted: Sat May 21, 2022 7:06 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| A September 1963 build would be a 1964 model year. |
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gt1953
Samba Member
Joined: May 08, 2002
Posts: 13848
Location: White Mountains Arizona
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| Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 6:54 am Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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That does have a 63 engine cover based on the liscence plate light.
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Ceckert64
Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2015
Posts: 1956
Location: Manitowoc, WI
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mukluk
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012
Posts: 7023
Location: Clyde, TX
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| Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 8:21 am Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| Ceckert64 wrote: |
| gt1953 wrote: |
| That does have a 63 engine cover based on the liscence plate light. |
The very early 64s still had the 63 style decklid and front turn signals. I think they were only the first few months. |
The new license plate light housing didn't appear until January of 1964.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/lit/64what_year/2.jpg
The car in question is a 1964 model made in early October 1963 based on the provided VIN.
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1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga" |
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House
Minutia Militia
Joined: June 13, 2001
Posts: 1766
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| Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 9:01 am Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| mukluk wrote: |
| The car in question is a 1964 model made in early October 1963 based on the provided VIN. |
Agreed. I was going off the OP saying it was a Sept build. |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24733
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 11:28 am Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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Do note in the late Summer when the adverts in paper, TV, and online start coming out about the new 2023 models you can buy when it is still well into 2022!
https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2016/11/why-us-model-years-come/
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VW_Jimbo 
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2016
Posts: 9954
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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| Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 12:20 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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Need to see more of the car. I believe the trunk panel stamping changed in 64. I would need to verify that, but they modified that panel with different configurations of stamping. That ALMOST a sure fire method of dating these bodies, since that is a bitch of a panel to replace!
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Jimbo
There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!
| TDCTDI wrote: |
| Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look. |
| 67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!  |
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heimlich
VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016
Posts: 6593
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Tue May 24, 2022 8:17 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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If it has a factory metal sunroof it has to be a 64.
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raydog
Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2006
Posts: 1163
Location: Cape Cod
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 5:29 am Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| mukluk wrote: |
The car in question is a 1964 model made in early October 1963 based on the provided VIN. |
Correct, check out the Technical section - VIN/Chassis numbers for type 1
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Slow 1200
Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2004
Posts: 2105
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 5:31 am Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| the wider license plate light came in august 63, all Deluxe 64s have it (Standards kept the narrow one) . Front indicators changed at the end of october |
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Blue Baron
VW Aficionado
Joined: June 16, 2006
Posts: 24050
Location: Southeast USA
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 11:11 am Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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The first few months of the '64 model year retained the "beak" license plate light as well as the "peanut" turn signals; however, it had the new decklid with the shortened "spine."
You can see in the photo the spine ends at the license plate light, rather than curving down a bit below it, as it did in '63. VW was already anticipating the wider light.
Other '64isms include new colors such as Java Green, Bahama Blue and Sea Blue, two thumb buttons on the steering wheel instead of a half ring, and unique
striped upholstery that didn't last long before splitting. (Most '64s needed seat covers.)
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Slow 1200
Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2004
Posts: 2105
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| Posted: Fri May 27, 2022 11:39 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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i used to have a oct 63 car, i'm pretty familiar with 64isms 
if you check any literature from august 1963 you'll see that they went through the trouble of airbrushing the wide license plate in place, or taking new pictures, so i don't think many 64 deluxes left the factory with the old style light |
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EVfun
Samba Member
Joined: April 01, 2012
Posts: 5474
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 8:06 am Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| Slow 1200 wrote: |
i used to have a oct 63 car, i'm pretty familiar with 64isms
if you check any literature from august 1963 you'll see that they went through the trouble of airbrushing the wide license plate in place, or taking new pictures, so i don't think many 64 deluxes left the factory with the old style light |
Progressive Refinements indicates the license plate light holes where relocated the same time as the stamping was changed to eliminate the out turned ends on the center stamping. However, I have seen a number of those engine covers without the holes for the later wide plate light. A couple years ago I looked at a red Bug billed as a '64 and found it had an engine cover and plate like just like shown at the top of this post. It was an early '64 with I believe a September '63 production date. No evidence of welding up holes or doing any respaying of paint except for an exterior only overshoot. Progressive Refinements does indicate the front turn signals where the old style until October 31st '63. Below is the only shot I kept of the '64 in question.
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obieoberstar
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 1126
Location: Tucson
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| Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 5:47 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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thanks all. looks to be an early production '64 model.
unfortunately the original fenders did not come with it. some unknown repop that have been sitting outside. I may be able to see if the fenders are still at the previous owner's place. that would be nice. along with the fuel tank and bumpers.
just going through the milk crates of parts that came with it. looks to be all there, more or less.
my plan is to put it all back together and make it a runner with out too much expended and enjoy it.
does anyone have a link to a parts catalog for this model? It would make putting this puzzle together again less painful. |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24733
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 5:56 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| obieoberstar wrote: |
does anyone have a link to a parts catalog for this model? It would make putting this puzzle together again less painful. |
http://www.oacdp.org/
Left click on the "Upcoming" button at the top of that webpage for the type 1 parts manual.
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Last edited by Eric&Barb on Sat May 28, 2022 6:39 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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obieoberstar
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 1126
Location: Tucson
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| Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 6:37 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| thank you |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24733
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 6:51 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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| obieoberstar wrote: |
| thank you |
No problem! Posted the below previously in another thread, but worth posting again.
Parts manuals are a real eye opener, invariably you will find parts you did not know your VW originally had. For a lot of the smaller parts you can use the part number from the parts manuals to find more info part or availability of the part you are looking for thru a search of the WWW.
When you do WWW searches with the nine digit part numbers, put VW and a space before the part number. Remove the two spaces in the part number, and leave off any letter suffix at the end of the part number. So you will get a "VW XXXXXXXXX" to search with. Also "VW XXX-XXX-XXX" will work for other websites.
Keep in mind about every nine digit VW part number:
A. That the very first digit is what model of VW the part was originally designed for. Lots of type 1 parts on the type 2s, some type 2 and 3 parts were used in the type 1. Other parts are only used on that type of VW and no other.
B. 2nd and 3rd digits are the model the part was originally designed for. Some parts are ONLY for that model. Others were later fitted to all VW models.
C. 4th digit tells you which section/chapter of the parts manual the part is found in.
D. The 5th thru 9th digits are the actual part number.
E. Letter suffix means it is an improved part over the last part without letter suffix, or as each letter ( A, B, C, D, etc.) is used the later letter means some change has been made. Sometimes each later part can be used directly in the same area, some can not without replacing other parts around it.
F. If you know a part is RH or LH ONLY, you can tell by the last digit of the part number which side it goes on. an even digit then the part is RH, odd digit and the part is LH. Easiest way to remember this is that a LH drive VW has to have at least the driver, so one person, which is an odd digit. A VW with one driver and one passenger is two people, so an even digit.
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obieoberstar
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 1126
Location: Tucson
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| Posted: Tue May 31, 2022 7:59 pm Post subject: Re: did I buy a '63 or '64? |
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Thank you for sharing the information on the VW part numbering system. It all makes sense. It is amazing what a part number alone will tell you.
My plan is to get the glass in before the monsoon starts here in Tucson. All the hard parts are present, but the fasteners are missing or rusted from sitting in a plastic jar. |
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