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LAGrunthaner
Samba Member
Joined: March 18, 2007
Posts: 5505
Location: 1st Coast
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 Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 2:01 am Post subject: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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I have a 2013 Honda Fit and I'm trying to understand the technology of the tire pressure valve system. The light went on due to change in weather then after I filled all 4 tires at 33psi (door jam label) and drove 5-10 miles the light remains on.
The TPMS is NOT on and I heard the trunk spare can trigger the low tire pressure light. I'll check the psi again on each tire this afternoon with a second gauge then take to the parkway (NJ's not free-way) for 10 miles at 70mph and see if that works.
How does the pressure valve work? Is there a battery somewhere? Professors please teach me.
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| Lind wrote: |
| Have you considered simply starting with a nicer bus? I don't know what your skills are, but the race is easier if you can see the finish line. If you are not a runner, don't start off doing a marathon. |
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slave1pilot
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Joined: February 22, 2010
Posts: 943
Location: Tehachapi CA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 2:09 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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should be a TPMS button on the lower left side of your dash
press and hold it until the warning light blinks twice.
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Abscate
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Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 22633
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 2:14 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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There are two technologies I’m aware of.
One is literally a sensor built into the valve core which transmits info to a processor. I think they are Bluetooth based?
Earlier tech used the ABS tone ring to detect the wheel rpm and thus detects the slight change in rpm when deflation occurs to wheel size change.
I think your Honda uses the latter technology.
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LAGrunthaner
Samba Member
Joined: March 18, 2007
Posts: 5505
Location: 1st Coast
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 3:24 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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I recall resetting the TPMS when that light went on 20K ago. Being that light is NOT ON I shouldn't reed to reset.
I found this video/web site from Honda (see below)and the spare is not fitted with the sensor.
I'm going to use my own compressor as the local gas station has 1 of 2 working inflators maybe other stuff is going on at that shop.
https://owners.honda.com/vehicles/information/2013...tpms-video
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| Lind wrote: |
| Have you considered simply starting with a nicer bus? I don't know what your skills are, but the race is easier if you can see the finish line. If you are not a runner, don't start off doing a marathon. |
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finster
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Joined: May 26, 2012
Posts: 7929
Location: north o' the border
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 3:32 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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I had just found that honda video!
also this from the fitfreak.net forum
For USA cars:
2008-2013 use direct TPMS which uses a pressure sensor inside each tire and has BOTH of the dash lights pictured below
2015 and newer use indirect TPMS.....which does not have actual sensors in each tire. This system only has the low tire pressure light.
first thing to check is your tyre gauge accurate? are the tyres holding pressure?
looks like more $ earning technology for the tyre/works shops to me 
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slave1pilot
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2010
Posts: 943
Location: Tehachapi CA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 4:18 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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My mistake
I thought you said your light was on
but then I saw that you said your TPMS was not on
so I have no idea what's going on now
are you just trying to figure how the system works?
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Bonesberg55
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Joined: January 18, 2012
Posts: 1270
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 4:54 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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| The system is annoying and stupid. My light(2017 Caravan) went on a couple of weeks ago after the van was sitting overnight in the garage. All tires read 35 PSI . That is the recommended pressure from the manufacturer(Firestone). The night was unusually cool. As most everyone knows, cold makes rubber expand so that would reduce the pressure but c'mon! I pumped them up to 38 PSI and the light has been off since. The thing is that I had put 38 PSI in the tires before the cool night. |
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supercub
Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2010
Posts: 358
Location: Wisconsin
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 5:02 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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| LAGrunthaner wrote: |
I have a 2013 Honda Fit and I'm trying to understand the technology of the tire pressure valve system. The light went on due to change in weather then after I filled all 4 tires at 33psi (door jam label) and drove 5-10 miles the light remains on.
The TPMS is NOT on and I heard the trunk spare can trigger the low tire pressure light. I'll check the psi again on each tire this afternoon with a second gauge then take to the parkway (NJ's not free-way) for 10 miles at 70mph and see if that works.
How does the pressure valve work? Is there a battery somewhere? Professors please teach me. |
I'm pretty sure as a 2013, your Honda would have an individual sensor in each wheel and yes, they each have a battery in them which sealed so the battery is not easily replaceable. Later Hondas are rotation-based systems that use the wheel speed sensors to pick up speed differences between the wheels to detect a low tire. That style has a button on the dash near the steering column to reset the light. Newer Hondas bury that feature in a menu on the infotainment touch screen. There are two main types of TPMS sensors, one screw in metal style and one style with a normal looking rubber stem. Ford used a banded sensor early on that had a big hose clamp looking ring that tightened it to the inside diameter of the wheel and used a standard valve stem. Each sensor has a unique ID# which is sent wirelessly to the car. Most sensors will trip the light at around 5psi low. When you air the tires back up some cars will turn off the light almost immediately while some have to be driven a few miles to register. Toyota/Lexus and Jeep Wranglers do use a sensor in the spare if it's full-sized. I'm sure some fancier Euro brands do too. I've never seen a sensor in a donut spare and I don't recall ever seeing a full-size spare in a Honda Fit, so I don't think that is your problem. So back to the battery, typically they start to die at around 10 years old, which your car is right in that range. On most brands the pressure light will flash when the car is first started and then stay on solid when there is a fault with the system, like a dead sensor battery. I think Honda has that second light that says TPMS that you were talking about, which comes on for faults instead of the flashing, but I can't remember. I have seen where sometimes the car will lose communication with a sensor if the car sits for too long, and sometimes for no good reason at all. There is a tool that we have at work that you use to scan each sensor and then plug it into the OBD port and retrain the car to the sensors. That tool also can program new sensors for the car when they need to be replaced. Probably more than you wanted to know, but that's what I know from dealing with TPMS systems at work over the past 6 years. And even with the nanny light, half the cars that come into the shop, come in with the light on and low tires anyway. |
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Q-Dog
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Joined: April 05, 2010
Posts: 8698
Location: Sunset, Louisiana
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 5:48 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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I had to replace the TPMS sensors in our 2011 Honda when they were about 9 years old. TPMS lights would come on during cold weather. Yours are in that range.
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74 Thing
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 7:00 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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Stupid system required by gov because owners of vehicles are too irresponsible to check their tire pressure periodically.
Go to your local tire shop and have them get out the TPMS monitor and check to see of all your sensors are working. Probably one or more of the sensors in the tire has a bad battery. Then you will have to pay for a dismount/remount of the tire and replacement of a sensor just to get the damn dash warning light to go out. |
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TDCTDI
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Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12846
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 7:22 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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TPMS systems are the reason why manufacturers & lots of dedicated tire shops use nitrogen in the tires. Nitrogen is less reactive to temperature changes. Filling your tires from a normal air pump just sets yourself up for aggravation.
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steve244
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Joined: March 18, 2022
Posts: 1664
Location: GA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2022 7:24 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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| LAGrunthaner wrote: |
I have a 2013 Honda Fit and I'm trying to understand the technology of the tire pressure valve system. The light went on due to change in weather then after I filled all 4 tires at 33psi (door jam label) and drove 5-10 miles the light remains on.
The TPMS is NOT on and I heard the trunk spare can trigger the low tire pressure light. I'll check the psi again on each tire this afternoon with a second gauge then take to the parkway (NJ's not free-way) for 10 miles at 70mph and see if that works.
How does the pressure valve work? Is there a battery somewhere? Professors please teach me. |
As a former fit freak, I AM AN AUTHORITY!!!!
It works the same as any other TPMS system.
there's a sender in each tire that senses pressure. Each has its own battery. There is none in the spare (sheesh).
Each sensor has a centrifugal activated switch so above 20MPH it starts sending a signal that's picked up by the car's TPMS receiver. If any tire drops 10% (approx) or more below the sticker PSI rating it alerts you with the low pressure warning light (tire with exclamation mark in it).
If there is a problem with any of the senders or receiver (i.e. dead battery) the TPMS warning light comes on (there are two warning lights).
I'll bet you guys get your significant others to program your VCRs.
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EverettB 
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steve244
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Joined: March 18, 2022
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LAGrunthaner
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Joined: March 18, 2007
Posts: 5505
Location: 1st Coast
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| Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2022 2:21 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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FIXED! What are the chances of the air pump with gauge and my gauge not giving me the correct data of 33 psi? Yes I went to another station on my way home from work filled all 4 tires @33psi then the light went out as I drove down the block. Time to go back to old style gauge with post (I have a garage full of them) instead of the dial style. Thanks everyone for jumping in with suggestions. Very interesting comments, however I'm glad I missed all the BS.
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| Lind wrote: |
| Have you considered simply starting with a nicer bus? I don't know what your skills are, but the race is easier if you can see the finish line. If you are not a runner, don't start off doing a marathon. |
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steve244
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Joined: March 18, 2022
Posts: 1664
Location: GA
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| Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2022 7:25 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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| LAGrunthaner wrote: |
| FIXED! What are the chances of the air pump with gauge and my gauge not giving me the correct data of 33 psi? |
mmmm, did you check them warm after driving or cold first thing in the morning.
they need to be at 33psi cold. If they're warm from driving I'd fill them to 35.
Some hypermilers put 50psi in them. I don't recommend that as it'll shake your teeth out, but it's not unsafe to inflate to the max PSI rating on the tires.
Check out fitfreak.net. You have a 2nd gen GE. Ask them what grade of gas to use.
I owned an 09 for 10 years and then gave it to my son. He sold it and bought a ford ranger. Asshole.
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82 AC vanagon approx 200K miles (3K are mine).
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ToolBox
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Location: Detroit, where they don't jack parts off my ride in the parking lot of the 7-11
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| Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2022 8:50 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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| LAGrunthaner wrote: |
| FIXED! What are the chances of the air pump with gauge and my gauge not giving me the correct data of 33 psi? |
Pretty good.
Our test cars travel with a dedicated calibrated tire pressure gauge. |
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Jon Schmid
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Joined: May 29, 2012
Posts: 2037
Location: Southern California
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| Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2022 8:57 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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| I'm glad I have 20+ YO cars with none of this BS electronic nonsense. Where does it all end? |
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steve244
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| Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2022 9:26 am Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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It's alerted me a few times over the past two years of a puncture/slow leak before it was to the stage I had to put on the spare. Much easier to pull into the tire shop and have them repair it.
This also would avoid the situation of an underinflated tire and driving at highway speeds.
I picked up the vanagon after purchase and blissfully drove 3,000 miles with one of the rear tires at 20PSI (looked ok). Kept wondering why it fishtailed everytime a semi passed me. It normally runs 40PSI in back.
I like having the system, but I wish the senders were permanent somehow. The battery technology is good for about 10 years.
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82 AC vanagon approx 200K miles (3K are mine).
DD is a 2015 Leaf
Road Trip to Hell (FL 2023)
The Vanagon's drivetrain and chassis restomod thread. Best sung to the tune of I Did It My Way... |
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TornadoRed06
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Joined: August 30, 2020
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Location: Porto - Portugal
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| Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2022 2:27 pm Post subject: Re: How does tire pressure technology work? |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
| TPMS systems are the reason why manufacturers & lots of dedicated tire shops use nitrogen in the tires. Nitrogen is less reactive to temperature changes. Filling your tires from a normal air pump just sets yourself up for aggravation. |
Oh, really??
So, that is the reason why these guys are gauging me 11 Euro plus (consider it $12), they gave me in this work estimate for 4 new tires with rubber TR413 valves on steel wheels for this vintage VW...
Too bad it hasn't ABS, let alone TPMS!!!
... last time I checked, "air" that, we people, pump into tires have 78% or more Nitrogen in it, that is Nitrogen enough for me, don't see a reason to hand $12 to "professionals" to pump that Nitrogen stuff through rubber valves. And with the amount of TDI and all the other diesel engines here in Europe, we might well get a lot more in it actually.
And now that we discuss this kind of silly stuff, come to mind that Green valve caps are supposed to be the telling sign that tires are pumped with Nitrogen and Silver valve caps tell TPMS valves... Too bad this Porsche Taycan GTS came from the factory with HUF TPMS sensors black from top to bottom (at least this is what we glance on the outside) and this plastic Black valve cap with Alligator EHA inscriptions on it can be put to pasture with those Oh So Chick! Black valve caps with either coloured or monochrome Porsche Logos from Porsche Tequipment. Ah, so nice that "professionals" can be curbed this easily!  |
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