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francoangellini
Samba Member
Joined: January 10, 2012
Posts: 223
Location: Chile-South America
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 Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 3:24 pm Post subject: Permatex sealants |
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Hello,
What are the differences between these two perrmatex sealants?
Last edited by francoangellini on Wed Nov 23, 2022 2:26 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Zundfolge1432 
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004
Posts: 12468
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:18 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| Let’s see ones in a tube the other a plastic bottle😀 I also see two different part numbers in 8000 series. Permatex website might give a better answer. I’m gonna look it up. I like the aviation permatex been using it four decades. That’s 40 years. I could buy three of them for what one tube of curil costs. One big difference is one says it dries hard. Aviation permatex doesn’t do that. |
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txoval
Samba Member
Joined: January 23, 2004
Posts: 3552
Location: The Woodlands, TX
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:39 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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Aviation sealant also doesn’t setup fast…it’s the consistency of maple syrup
What are you trying to seal? |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:58 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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The one in the tube part # 80008 is Form-a-gasket #1 (hence that big red 1 on the label). It's density or specific gravity is 1.5.
The one in the bottle is form-a-gasket #3. Part #80019.
They are essentially the same chemical "formula"....except that the 80008 is a PASTE used for filling larger gaps like valve covers on watercooled cars.
The 80019 is a liquid. It flows out thinner like for use on an engine case. Its density or specific gravity is 1.1
Ray |
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MURZI
Samba Member
Joined: August 25, 2005
Posts: 5063
Location: Madisonville, La
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:23 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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80019 works well in a large syringe….. think turkey injector. Available at every super market. …..For medical precision application 😁😁😁. Seriously. I always use a syringe now.
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jpaull
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2005
Posts: 3466
Location: Paradise, Ca
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:54 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| The stuff in the tube is thicker and sets harder then the aviation. |
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bsairhead
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2008
Posts: 3580
Location: viroqua wi.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 10:22 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| The one in the bottle has a built in brush in the lid. I put that sh*t on everything. |
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francoangellini
Samba Member
Joined: January 10, 2012
Posts: 223
Location: Chile-South America
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 2:36 am Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| In my country they do not sell aviation permatex bottle, assuming the same chemical formula, will it be possible to dilute the tube to transform it into something similar to sealing cases?....is it a viable idea? |
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MuzzcoVW
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2018
Posts: 1475
Location: Westfield, MA.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 5:41 am Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| francoangellini wrote: |
| In my country they do not sell aviation permatex bottle, assuming the same chemical formula, will it be possible to dilute the tube to transform it into something similar to sealing cases?....is it a viable idea? |
Simple answer, Absolutely Not! Search for the thread on sealing your case..there's lots of great information. Are you able to get Loctite 518? It's great for case halves. |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 8:34 am Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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Do not try to dilute the sealant in the tube. Typically the Thickening agents for sealers and adhesives are homogenized in at a level that is not easy to break down without damage to the sealant properties.
As jpaull noted, the thicker aviation #1 in the tube sets harder and less flexible.
There are MANY types of sealant that work just fine on the case.
In fact....you can do just as well on the case parting lines with a high quality RTV if it's applied very thin and evenly. Something very oil resistant like permatex ultra black or ultra copper.
Or you can use solvent based sealers like Permatex Moto-seal or Yamabond or Hondabond. The purpose of those type of sealants is that they are totally fuel and oil proof....and they have a high percentage of solvent that is designed to evaporate away so it aids in applying the sealer in a very thin and uniform manner.
Ray |
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Cusser
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Joined: October 02, 2006
Posts: 31379
Location: Hot Arizona
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tripicana
Samba Member
Joined: February 13, 2003
Posts: 1164
Location: colorado springs
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 6:29 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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Permatex motoseal #29132 is yamabond equivalent. Last motor I sealed with yamabond does not leak.
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Zundfolge1432
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004
Posts: 12468
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:26 am Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| Cusser wrote: |
| I've used the Aviation Form-a-Gasket for decades; never have tried the other. |
X2 I butter my bread with it😀 it’s cheap and available almost everywhere in the United States. I’ve even seen 3M weatherstrip adhesive used and it works.
The more expensive choices don’t seem to work any better but it sounds way more cool and authoritative when it comes up in conversation, kinda like using Gray Poupon instead of French’s.
Mmmm…… |
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Vanapplebomb
Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2010
Posts: 5417
Location: Holland, MI
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:38 am Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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The reason a lot of people don’t see better results with different sealants is all down to prep work. A case that has been well prepped and sealed with aviation sealant will hold up far better than a poorly prepped case with high end anaerobic sealants or top of the line RTVs (eg, Dow Corning, etc).
Here is an example of an engine I tore down. Looks like Loctite 574. Notice it is over 0.007” thick!!!! 
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Janne71
Samba Member
Joined: September 29, 2015
Posts: 127
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 3:53 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| Vanapplebomb wrote: |
The reason a lot of people don’t see better results with different sealants is all down to prep work. A case that has been well prepped and sealed with aviation sealant will hold up far better than a poorly prepped case with high end anaerobic sealants or top of the line RTVs (eg, Dow Corning, etc).
Here is an example of an engine I tore down. Looks like Loctite 574. Notice it is over 0.007” thick!!!!
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Okay what thickness have form a gasket ? Loctite has as i think lower density than form … and should get minimal gap between cases
And the overfilling of loctite will splash out whit the oil and removes after oil change
Porsche use this shit to engine cases What could get wrong then. And I’ll think it’s glued and kept the strange together better. Maybe I have wrong but has used the loctite on one engine whit good results leakfree 😊 |
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Vanapplebomb
Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2010
Posts: 5417
Location: Holland, MI
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 5:10 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| Janne71 wrote: |
Okay what thickness have form a gasket ? Loctite has as i think lower density than form … and should get minimal gap between cases
And the overfilling of loctite will splash out whit the oil and removes after oil change |
Loctite 574 is designed to fill gaps up to 0.25mm (about 0.010 inches) between flanges. If your case isn’t flat or has high spots, there can be large gaps.
I always “stone” the parting surfaces to knock down the high spots. The closer they mate, the easier to seal.
A typical whetstone works well, but I use a diamond lapping plate because it leaves less grit behind. Kerosene or WD40 work well to keep the stone from packing up.
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Janne71
Samba Member
Joined: September 29, 2015
Posts: 127
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 5:22 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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| Vanapplebomb wrote: |
| Janne71 wrote: |
Okay what thickness have form a gasket ? Loctite has as i think lower density than form … and should get minimal gap between cases
And the overfilling of loctite will splash out whit the oil and removes after oil change |
Loctite 574 is designed to fill gaps up to 0.25mm (about 0.010 inches) between flanges. |
Yes up to yes but, with really fine cases you’d not have that gap between them
Question is what FORM…. Is building the gap It’s have higher density then loctite
That should give you bigger gap between cases and not get its tight then loctite with lower density. Maybe I have wrong there about density  |
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Vanapplebomb
Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2010
Posts: 5417
Location: Holland, MI
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 5:42 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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It has nothing to do with the density of the sealant. In fact, it has nothing to do with the sealant at all. It’s the case. 
Whoever put this engine together before me just spread some sealant on the case halves and bolted it together without paying any attention to the condition of the mating surfaces.
Little dings in the case cause the material to displace and push up. Around every small ding is a high spot. It doesn’t take much to do on soft magnesium or aluminum cases. All you have to do is just bump it with a harder material, and the material will displace and push up around the point of contact.
The whole point is, all the talk of sealant viscosity, etc, is totally irrelevant unless your case halves are actually nice and flat.
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modok
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2009
Posts: 26790
Location: Colorado Springs
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| Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:54 pm Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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I bought some permatex #1 once just to see what it was.
I haven't find a use for it yet.
It dries hard, UNLIKE 2,3,300 which dry to a sugary dried syrup consistency. |
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balljoint
Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Tobago
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2022 6:02 am Post subject: Re: Permatex sealants |
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Wasn't some guys saying lately that the 3H was drying hard and maybe the formula was changed?
I had bad experience recently with it on an oil pump and probably will never use it anywhere except for the main stud o rings.
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