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chris914x181 Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2008 Posts: 53 Location: Sunny San Diego
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 1:59 am Post subject: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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Hi,
I have a 73 Thing that I've owned since 1989. I'm tired of maintaining the front drum brakes and would like to convert them to disc. I've looked through the forums here and have done a number of google searches. But I'm still confused. Is there a straight forward conversion kit that will allow me to keep my stock rims? I've been looking at CSP's kits. Does anyone know it one of their kits will work with the stock rims?
Thanks _________________ 1972 2.0L Porsche 914 Autocrosser
1973 2017 VW Thing
1974 2.0L Porsche 914
1986 Skateboard
2004 7.4L Roadtrek Versatile
http://www.cassidy-online.com |
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mondshine Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2006 Posts: 2769 Location: The World's Motor Capital
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:48 am Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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If you are dead set on keeping your stock Thing wheels, then the CSP Thing brake kit is your only option.
The CSP kit is "OK", but it's not perfect. Here's what I didn't like:
The included Delco calipers were a single piston design, sliding on pins to center themselves. It usually worked OK, but required occasional cleaning to keep the calipers sliding freely.
The included brake hoses were too long; I had to replace them with standard Karmann Ghia length hoses.
The included wheel bearings were Korean Daiwoo. They didn't last very long.
The CSP hubs had no provision to drift out the wheel bearing races; I had to make my own (WTF!).
The hubs and rotors are a bolted assembly. You would be hard pressed to find a shop (brake lathe) capable of turning them as a single piece. Once separated, turned, and re-assembled, there is no guarantee that they will run perfectly true (within a grand or so).
While all of these complaints are minor inconveniences, the CSP kit was less than I expected from a costly German product.
My Thing that had the CSP front brakes was wrecked in an accident in 2020 (the CSP brakes were NOT a factor, I was hit from behind).
Anyway, on my "replacement" Thing, I installed standard Karmann Ghia front disc brakes (with 15" wheels).
Now-a-days, there are 15" steel wheels available that look just like the stock Thing 14" wheels. Switching to 15" wheels opens up possibilities for several different front disc brake kits, Additionally, if you plan to buy tires anytime soon, the choice of tires for 15" wheels is much larger.
Do some more research, and compare the cost. I believe the cost of Karman Ghia calipers, adapter brackets, hoses, rotors, wheel bearings, pads, etc. and a set of 15" steel wheels will come out about the same as the CSP kit.
Karmann Ghia brake parts are easy to get; much more so than service parts for the CSP brakes.
I hope that helps; good luck
Mondshine |
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chris914x181 Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2008 Posts: 53 Location: Sunny San Diego
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 1:15 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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mondshine wrote: |
Anyway, on my "replacement" Thing, I installed standard Karmann Ghia front disc brakes (with 15" wheels).
Now-a-days, there are 15" steel wheels available that look just like the stock Thing 14" wheels. Switching to 15" wheels opens up possibilities for several different front disc brake kits, Additionally, if you plan to buy tires anytime soon, the choice of tires for 15" wheels is much larger.
Do some more research, and compare the cost. I believe the cost of Karman Ghia calipers, adapter brackets, hoses, rotors, wheel bearings, pads, etc. and a set of 15" steel wheels will come out about the same as the CSP kit.
Karmann Ghia brake parts are easy to get; much more so than service parts for the CSP brakes.
I hope that helps; good luck
Mondshine |
Thanks for the repose. I had a few questions. If I go with the Ghia setup, does anyone sell a kit with all the parts that I'll need? Also do you know if 15" rims with mud and snow all terrain A/T tires will fit without any issues. In the past that's why I've stayed with the 14" rims. _________________ 1972 2.0L Porsche 914 Autocrosser
1973 2017 VW Thing
1974 2.0L Porsche 914
1986 Skateboard
2004 7.4L Roadtrek Versatile
http://www.cassidy-online.com |
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mondshine Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2006 Posts: 2769 Location: The World's Motor Capital
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 1:49 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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There are many front disc brake kits available that will work fine; (with 15" wheels) others should chime in with their personal experience with kits from various suppliers.
For my Thing, I just selected individual components from several sources.
For example, the only Empi parts I used were the caliper adapters. They are pretty stout castings, and the calipers are on straight.
My brake rotors, dust shields (which needed minor modification), brake hoses and brake pads are standard Karmann Ghia replacement parts. My calipers are OEVW Teves (some people call them a t e) from a Ghia. My master cylinder is a standard Type 1 (19mm).
I know that there are several people on this forum who have installed complete front disc brake kits on their Things. They can tell you about their experiences.
My tires are 185/15 and fit nicely on 5.5 aftermarket wheels, My spare is on a 5.5" wide steel wheel, and it fits nicely in the trunk.
Good luck, Mondshine |
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Hot Rod Harp Samba Member
Joined: March 02, 2008 Posts: 186 Location: Englewood, New Jersey
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 3:52 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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I bought the SOCAL IMPORTS Inc. wide five ball joint front disc brake kit.
It included everything needed 1976-1984 Rabbit/Jetta calipers & pads,
non vented rotor, master cylinder, stainless brake hoses, bearings & races.
It's a great kit, I'm running Yokohama Geolandar all terrain tires 205/70R15
on 15" X 5.5" steel wheels with stainless hubcaps. I like the look and the ride.
SoCal Imports
6831 Paramount Blvd
Long Beach, CA 90805
(562) 633-9731
www.socalautoparts.com _________________ 74 Thing 1600DP
76 Westfalia 2.0L FI
69 Beetle 1500SP sold
88 Goldwing GL1500/6 sold
RinTinTin in Waldorf Astoria 1956
Last edited by Hot Rod Harp on Thu Jan 05, 2023 4:54 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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chris914x181 Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2008 Posts: 53 Location: Sunny San Diego
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 4:17 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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Hot Rod Harp wrote: |
I bought the SOCAL IMPORTS Inc. wide five ball joint front disc brake kit.
It included everything needed 1976-1984 Rabbit/Jetta calipers & pads,
non vented rotor, master cylinder, stainless brake hoses, bearings & races.
It's a great kit, I'm running Yokohama Geolandar all terrain tires 205/70R15
on 15" X 5.5" steel wheels with stainless hubcaps. I like the look and the ride.
SoCal Imports
6831 Paramount Blvd
Long Beach, CA 90805
(562) 633-9731
www.scalautoparts.com |
Is this the kit you bought?
https://socalautoparts.com/product/wide-5-ball-joi...kit-69-77/ _________________ 1972 2.0L Porsche 914 Autocrosser
1973 2017 VW Thing
1974 2.0L Porsche 914
1986 Skateboard
2004 7.4L Roadtrek Versatile
http://www.cassidy-online.com |
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Hot Rod Harp Samba Member
Joined: March 02, 2008 Posts: 186 Location: Englewood, New Jersey
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 5:21 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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I bought my kit in 2017 for less and it included the master cylinder.
AC Industries # 401520.
That looks like the same kit less master cyl. _________________ 74 Thing 1600DP
76 Westfalia 2.0L FI
69 Beetle 1500SP sold
88 Goldwing GL1500/6 sold
RinTinTin in Waldorf Astoria 1956 |
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chris914x181 Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2008 Posts: 53 Location: Sunny San Diego
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:44 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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Hot Rod Harp wrote: |
I bought my kit in 2017 for less and it included the master cylinder.
AC Industries # 401520.
That looks like the same kit less master cyl. |
I called SoCal Imports and talked with them. They said that their calipers and pads are specially made for them. I'm not sure if they don't want me to know that they're really Rabbit/Jetta calipers & pads or that they changed their source since you bought yours. That's not a deal breaker for me. I probably won't be driving the vehicle enough to wear out a set of pads in my lifetime. lol
If I go with any of these kits, does anyone know which rims to get? Is there a certain offset and width to get so they'll properly fit a stock suspension? I like the stock looking open centers. I'm going to paint them black without center hubcaps anyways. _________________ 1972 2.0L Porsche 914 Autocrosser
1973 2017 VW Thing
1974 2.0L Porsche 914
1986 Skateboard
2004 7.4L Roadtrek Versatile
http://www.cassidy-online.com |
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Hot Rod Harp Samba Member
Joined: March 02, 2008 Posts: 186 Location: Englewood, New Jersey
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Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 1:29 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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These are the wheels I used 15" x 5.5", 3 3/4" back spacing.
https://www2.cip1.com/acc-c10-6621-smsl/
Used with 205x70R15 AT tires no rubbing anywhere
STOCK SMOOTHIE 5X205MM 5 BOLT STEEL WHEEL
PAINTED SILVER - 15X5-1/2 (3-3/4 INCH BACK SPACING)
HUBCAP SOLD SEPARATELY (1 INCH WIDER THEN STOCK) _________________ 74 Thing 1600DP
76 Westfalia 2.0L FI
69 Beetle 1500SP sold
88 Goldwing GL1500/6 sold
RinTinTin in Waldorf Astoria 1956 |
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74 Thing Samba Member
Joined: September 02, 2004 Posts: 7390
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colin_peggy Samba Member
Joined: August 31, 2011 Posts: 19
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Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 5:33 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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I too am using the AC Industries front kit from SoCal ,also used it for a previous “ wide five” dune buggy both front and rear. Easy instal no issues, feel that it’s value for the $$. |
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chris914x181 Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2008 Posts: 53 Location: Sunny San Diego
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2023 10:37 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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I wanted to say thanks for everyone's help!
I'm going with the conversion kit from Socal Imports, 15" X 5.5" stock style steel wheels with stainless hubcaps from Cip1, and Yokohama Geolandar all terrain tires 205/70R15. Pretty much Hot Rod Harp's setup. Except with these rims and hub caps.
https://www2.cip1.com/acc-c10-6621-mb/
https://www2.cip1.com/acc-c10-6678-sskdf/
When everyone goes to larger rims and tires what do they go with for a spare? From my measurements I think I might be able to fit the Yokohama Geolandar tire in there. But I'm not completely sure. _________________ 1972 2.0L Porsche 914 Autocrosser
1973 2017 VW Thing
1974 2.0L Porsche 914
1986 Skateboard
2004 7.4L Roadtrek Versatile
http://www.cassidy-online.com |
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Hot Rod Harp Samba Member
Joined: March 02, 2008 Posts: 186 Location: Englewood, New Jersey
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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2023 5:35 am Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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I also converted from lug bolts to lug nuts and M12 studs to aid in tire mounting. Tires are heavy to hold and thread the lug bolt.
_________________ 74 Thing 1600DP
76 Westfalia 2.0L FI
69 Beetle 1500SP sold
88 Goldwing GL1500/6 sold
RinTinTin in Waldorf Astoria 1956 |
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Hot Rod Harp Samba Member
Joined: March 02, 2008 Posts: 186 Location: Englewood, New Jersey
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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2023 2:31 pm Post subject: Re: Front Brake Conversion to Disc Brakes |
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One other note...the 205/70xR15 is 26.3" tall whereas the stock 185R14 is 25.5" tall.
The 0.8" difference so the speedometer is still close to accurate. _________________ 74 Thing 1600DP
76 Westfalia 2.0L FI
69 Beetle 1500SP sold
88 Goldwing GL1500/6 sold
RinTinTin in Waldorf Astoria 1956 |
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