Where are you putting your temp sensor |
Oil relief plug |
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23% |
[ 9 ] |
Drain plug |
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18% |
[ 7 ] |
oil pressure idiot light hole |
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10% |
[ 4 ] |
external cooler |
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28% |
[ 11 ] |
type 3 block off |
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18% |
[ 7 ] |
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Total Votes : 38 |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:59 pm Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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I am only interested in the temperature of the pool. It will be hotter than after the cooler(s) depending on what you have. In a water cooled vehicle the temperature is usually what the head is at, unless you have a Jag and in that case you may be measuring steam because of where the sender is. The temperature in the head is just before it leaves for the cooling system. In a VW that is the pool before the oil is sucked back up and sent thru the cooling system. So that is where I measure it. If the pool gets too hot it is time to add to the pool size (extended sump) or slow down.
In a late T4 the pool temp is higher than an early dual relief case. The reason is that on a late T4 the oil circulates thru the cooler, the excess dumps back into the pump and thru the cooler again. In a dual relief case the excess is dumped back into the pool. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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Dangib Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2011 Posts: 95 Location: pittsburgh
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 5:24 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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Ya sadly I don't have type 3 block off and I'm not planning on a external so my 3 bad options are idiot light oil relief or drain plug. what's the least terrible lol
I saw a CSP pic of a billet sump cover and it had the drain plug like recessed up in to protected it from getting crushed but cant find it for sale anywhere. |
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madmike Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2005 Posts: 5292 Location: Atlanta,Michigan
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 5:38 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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I have one inline after the oil coolers ,sorry about the filthy Motor ,but mine is 'driven'
_________________ 'Black Ice'Drag Buggy 'Turbo'
Rail Buggy 1915 turbo
76 Drag/Street bug 2180cc 'Turbo' 11:85 @113 mph"If I go any faster I'll burn up the Hamster" ,gets 28 mpg. also 10/09/22 11.90 @115 mph
"If I'm ever on Life Support,UNPLUG Me, Then Plug me back In see if that Works" |
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oprn Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016 Posts: 12714 Location: Western Canada
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 5:53 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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SGKent wrote: |
I am only interested in the temperature of the pool. It will be hotter than after the cooler(s) depending on what you have. In a water cooled vehicle the temperature is usually what the head is at, unless you have a Jag and in that case you may be measuring steam because of where the sender is. The temperature in the head is just before it leaves for the cooling system. In a VW that is the pool before the oil is sucked back up and sent thru the cooling system. So that is where I measure it. |
^^^Yes!^^^
The hottest point on the system is correct in my mind too. Actually that would be in the pushrod tubes I think coming back from the heads but that is not a practical place to put a sender at all. _________________ We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age) |
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boxer74 Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2011 Posts: 703 Location: Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 6:04 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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Lingwendil wrote: |
Oil filter housing, here's my way of doing it with a dual in/out filter mount. This also gets you a pressure sender port too-
No drilling or tapping required, all bolts together. |
I agree with this, hence why I copied it! _________________ 74 Super
84 Westy |
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Dan Ruddock Samba Member
Joined: October 25, 2012 Posts: 3594 Location: Sarasota, in my adopted state of Florida
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 6:05 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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I like the idea of two sensors, one very close to the outlet of the pump (sump temp) and one after the cooler right before oil is sent to the mains. I never use an active stock cooler on a performance build. This give more data. You can wire up a toggle switch to select which sensor you want to read. This way you will know if you need more cooler or not. |
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ZEKE65 Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2018 Posts: 334 Location: Right Coast, Florida
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 6:12 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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Type III block off plate mounting.
_________________ 1965 VW Sedan, 1968 C10 Step BB, 99 C5 |
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Tobias Bylund Samba Member
Joined: December 10, 2007 Posts: 202 Location: Varberg - Sweden
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 6:52 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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What about the sender/sensor, i find that the probe that goes into the line is to large, i would think it would reduce flow too much, has anyone found a 1/8"NPT sender with a thin or short probe?
I want to put my sender in the line that goes back into the case/main oil gallery so that i can see the oil temp that the main bearings see. The engine is EFI and i plan on using oil temp as the input for the warm up enrichment. Oh, and it is dry sumped so putting the sender in the oil tank is possible, but i think that it would be too unprecise and slow to react to changes in oil temp there |
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RWK Samba Member
Joined: June 24, 2009 Posts: 1348 Location: S.W. MI
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 7:34 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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Generally the sump is used to get oil temp, as in most other auto and ind. (hydraulics) applications use this also, oil will be hottest just after it leaves the components it just left and cooled, crank, cam, heads. Sump provides a large reservoir with an average temp of all oil, prior to cooling. _________________ 73 Type 181
63 Type 113
63 Type 261- 428 071
62 Type 241-378 025 178 530 |
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richierich Samba Member
Joined: December 23, 2004 Posts: 889
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 8:06 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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Have mine in external filter housing.
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richierich Samba Member
Joined: December 23, 2004 Posts: 889
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 8:21 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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..... _________________ Blah.....
Last edited by richierich on Fri Jan 20, 2023 4:48 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Zed999 Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2018 Posts: 1245 Location: UK
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2023 3:35 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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Dan Ruddock wrote: |
I like the idea of two sensors, one very close to the outlet of the pump (sump temp) and one after the cooler right before oil is sent to the mains. I never use an active stock cooler on a performance build. This give more data. You can wire up a toggle switch to select which sensor you want to read. This way you will know if you need more cooler or not. |
I like this idea too. Out of interest, how much cooler is your oil after cooling? I know, how long is a piece of string, just interested in how efficient "our" oil cooling can be. I'm a very silly person, my sensor is in the return flow from an outboard cooler before it circulates the stock cooler (type-4), so between 2 coolers. Oh dear. In my defence it was one of a zillion things in a complete resto. |
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Dan Ruddock Samba Member
Joined: October 25, 2012 Posts: 3594 Location: Sarasota, in my adopted state of Florida
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2023 6:08 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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Zed999 wrote: |
Dan Ruddock wrote: |
I like the idea of two sensors, one very close to the outlet of the pump (sump temp) and one after the cooler right before oil is sent to the mains. I never use an active stock cooler on a performance build. This give more data. You can wire up a toggle switch to select which sensor you want to read. This way you will know if you need more cooler or not. |
I like this idea too. Out of interest, how much cooler is your oil after cooling? I know, how long is a piece of string, just interested in how efficient "our" oil cooling can be. I'm a very silly person, my sensor is in the return flow from an outboard cooler before it circulates the stock cooler (type-4), so between 2 coolers. Oh dear. In my defence it was one of a zillion things in a complete resto. |
So far for me it is just an idea so I can't answer you question. I will be doing this on my current build at some point. |
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oprn Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016 Posts: 12714 Location: Western Canada
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:11 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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I have two different temp readouts and both of them have dual inputs and can be set to toggle automatically between the two probes.
As far as using the oil temperature as an input for mixture enrichment... my gut feeling is that it may be far too slow. Cylinder head temperature I think would be much quicker and more relevant to the fuel mixture needs of the engine. _________________ We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age) |
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Slow 1200 Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2004 Posts: 2105
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Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 3:18 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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maybe the oil relief location gives "wrong" temperature for the oil, but I'm more worried about the case overheating and warping than the oil itself to be honest. |
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Tobias Bylund Samba Member
Joined: December 10, 2007 Posts: 202 Location: Varberg - Sweden
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Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 3:31 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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oprn wrote: |
I have two different temp readouts and both of them have dual inputs and can be set to toggle automatically between the two probes.
As far as using the oil temperature as an input for mixture enrichment... my gut feeling is that it may be far too slow. Cylinder head temperature I think would be much quicker and more relevant to the fuel mixture needs of the engine. |
Yeah, i have the same feeling, especially when having the sensor in the oil tank, especially considering almost 9 liter total oil volume, thats why i was wanting to put the sender somewhere prior to oil gallery or in the return from the sump. The normal thing would be to put it in the coolant return, i dont really know how fast water heats up either though. The startup enrichment turns "off" quite quickly after it has started to see a temp increase, so it is not used for tuning/adjustment while running.
I have CHT as well, so i might use that as input. But i still want accurate oil temp readout. |
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Dangib Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2011 Posts: 95 Location: pittsburgh
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Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 4:32 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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Slow 1200 wrote: |
maybe the oil relief location gives "wrong" temperature for the oil, but I'm more worried about the case overheating and warping than the oil itself to be honest. |
Well put! Ya it might not be best location but it may suffice and for some be the only option at that time. |
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boxer74 Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2011 Posts: 703 Location: Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2023 5:57 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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boxer74 wrote: |
Lingwendil wrote: |
Oil filter housing, here's my way of doing it with a dual in/out filter mount. This also gets you a pressure sender port too-
No drilling or tapping required, all bolts together. |
I agree with this, hence why I copied it! |
Here's mine:
_________________ 74 Super
84 Westy |
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esde Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007 Posts: 5966 Location: central rust belt
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Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2023 7:13 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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A few years ago I did mess around with temp sensor location. I tried the sump, pressure relief, and oil filter locations. My recollection is that the sump read consistently higher than the filter mount. Interesting and unexpected was that the filter sensor is much faster to respond. Put a good load on the engine and the gauge would react 10-20 seconds later. With the sump location, any change in temperature took well over a minute to show on the dial.
The relief plug is an awful position. It's behind the piston so it doesn't get any real flow. Might as well just consider it the "average case temp" sensor.
I've kept it in the filter mount. _________________ modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
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vamram Samba Member
Joined: March 08, 2012 Posts: 7300 Location: NOVA
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Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2023 9:43 am Post subject: Re: Temp sensor location poll |
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esde wrote: |
The relief plug is an awful position. It's behind the piston so it doesn't get any real flow. Might as well just consider it the "average case temp" sensor.
I've kept it in the filter mount. |
I don't have a remote filter. What's best in this case? The sump plug? Front or rear relieve plugs...? Oil pressure switch? _________________ Eventually, "we are what we pretend to be.’”
Give peace a chance - Stop Russian-Soviet Aggression!!
'74 Super 9/16 - present, in refurb process.
'73 Super - 6/18 - Present - Daily Driver!
'75 Super Le Grande...waiting it's turn in line behind '74.
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Save the Supers!! |
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