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The Volkswagen Ranch
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

My engine builder has “ bailed me out” of poor work by other “ professional” shops a couple of times…. We are both 70 now. I hope that the younger generation is finally going to see the light that a “ craftsman ( or craftsgal?)” is an alternative career to a software engineering degree. Good auto restoration
Shops are expensive and have a long waiting list. The same goes for other trades. We live in a small mountain town , and like other desirable towns outside of major cities the home prices are now absurd… but the contractors and workers, carpenters, plumbers…. Are the ones driving the new 60k fancy trucks while the tech graduates are looking for entry positions and are saddled with insane debt. Bob
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Amskeptic
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

VWsArent4Hippies wrote:
I think I missed the point. Are you looking for a pat on the back, or?



I am informing those who ask, and are considering the switch to Subaru power, that the air-cooled VW engine is a good reliable engine.


Again, I am not taking credit for anything but following the directions and enjoying humdreds of thousands of miles of reliable running. Yes, I want to inform people who are considering what engine to use, to continue considering the engine that the car came with.

If you need further clarification, just ask.
Colin
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69BahamaYellow
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 6:11 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

I've rebuilt all kinds of engines over the years, and the VW type 4 is still my favorite. 50+ years in existence and they're still cool.

If internal combustion engines ever become extinct, a VW type 4 is the one I want in my shop one day to show my grandkids what they used to look like. Well, that and a couple of choice 2 stroke examples;)
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skills@eurocarsplus
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:42 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

typ914 wrote:
Hay Skills let me know next time you have a good running type 4 for sale! I might even drive up to Ct from the Atl to pick it up!


this is the problem. I had a list of "yo bro, when you get a good engine in let me know" folks who when reached out to, ghosted me.

they are all dumpster bait at this point unless the owners want to deal, and many don't


Amskeptic wrote:
VWsArent4Hippies wrote:
I think I missed the point. Are you looking for a pat on the back, or?



I am informing those who ask, and are considering the switch to Subaru power, that the air-cooled VW engine is a good reliable engine.


did you also inform them that with some good shopping and DIY they can do a swap for around 10k or less, have real FI and 170 horsepower?

hard to argue with the subaru route when a brand-fucking-new short block is 2k

https://parts.subaru.com/p/subaru__/Engine-Short-Block/49223006/10103AB390.html

you can't even buy a 1/2 way decent set of heads for a T4 for that money.

every swap I have done the folks drive the buses more after the fact than they did with a T4.

i don't care what people do...but you have a guy like SGKent who has rebuilt an engine 87 times and he's still not happy with it. I have a lot of respect for Steve and I can tell you he'll never have an engine that will make him happy because the engines were just born to be mediocre at best...and no matter what you throw at them, they WILL sweat oil from somewhere.

and yes, I still have a stock bus and it's fine for what it is, but there is nothing like doing 70 at 2700 rpm's and being able to hear your kids whisper in the back seat with the heat on and getting 24 mpg's
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gprudenciop wrote:

my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese.......
[email protected] wrote:
most VW enthusiasts are stuck in 80's price land.

Jake Raby wrote:
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public.

Brian wrote:
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history
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Shonandb
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:51 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

skills@eurocarsplus wrote:
but there is nothing like doing 70 at 2700 rpm's and being able to hear your kids whisper in the back seat with the heat on and getting 24 mpg's


Smile
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Manfred58sc
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 10:41 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

Of course a determined and resourceful owner/mechanic ( and face the truth, these days you better be both) can squeeze a good experience out of 50 year old obsolete platforms. Most owners will have a better experience with a Suby conversion and be able to source parts. Traveling on a ACVW is really getting dicey, how much of your space do you want to commit to extra parts?

It can be done but most owners will quickly demure to "fuck this" or just drive it to the "car show".

The curtain fell long ago and the final act is being played out behind the scenes.

Oh, they all fucking leak oil
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blue72beetle
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 10:46 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

Amskeptic wrote:

that the air-cooled VW engine is a good reliable engine. * **




* Just not in a bus.
** If you like fixing it all the time.


Some of you people (that like fiddling with your AFM every time you cross state lines or repairing your valve train with plumbing parts) need to understand that some of us don't.
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typ914
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 10:47 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

[quote="skills@eurocarsplus"]
typ914 wrote:
Hay Skills let me know next time you have a good running type 4 for sale! I might even drive up to Ct from the Atl to pick it up!


this is the problem. I had a list of "yo bro, when you get a good engine in let me know" folks who when reached out to, ghosted me.

they are all dumpster bait at this point unless the owners want to deal, and many do

Skills, I get it. I am picking up parts to now to rebuild a type for the 78 I just bought. Hopefully in the future you can do me a conversion.
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buckswilde
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

skills@eurocarsplus wrote:
buckswilde wrote:
There are still plenty of type 4 and type 1 cores out there that are in great shape for rebuilding. At least in my area.


problem is getting people to actually buy them.

I have scrapped more good running T4's than anyone I know. Between doing a pre-pull video, compression test etc it was near impossible to get anyone to pay 700-900 bux for a complete (but used) turn key engine.


At that price, of course.
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Jivermo
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

VWsArent4Hippies wrote:
I think I missed the point. Are you looking for a pat on the back, or?


Yeah, you really did miss the point, didn't you? And you sure as hell missed the time of hippies, too.
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Amskeptic
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 4:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

skills@eurocarsplus wrote:
there is nothing like doing 70 at 2700 rpm's and being able to hear your kids whisper in the back seat with the heat on and getting 24 mpg's


Well sure, skills, that's what my other cars are for.
Colin

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The Volkswagen Ranch
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 5:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

Amskeptic, good point! My Odyssey is for everything else EXCEPT GOING OFF ROAD AND CAMPING! Tried it once, nope. Love my bus for what is is for. Bob
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skills@eurocarsplus
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 11:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

Amskeptic wrote:


Well sure, skills, that's what my other cars are for.
Colin


wonderful Rolling Eyes

the bus is a great adventure vehicle and is lacking in the power and reliability department for the 'modern' family.

dad would just rather hammer deck screws thru his toe nails than set points and valves, let alone do an oil change. mom and the kids don't think breaking down is "fun" either

mom doesn't want heat.... that no matter what, stinks like a slant 6 running thru an old sock.

adding a/c is taking the much needed 10 horsepower and tossing it out the window.

yea, there are some hard core old school owners left....great. i'll whip past them with the a/c on thank you very much. of the 20+ swaps i have done, every single one of them wants to treat it like a Toyota and just put gas in them. That is what I do. they just want to add gas and go and that is what they pay for
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gprudenciop wrote:

my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese.......
[email protected] wrote:
most VW enthusiasts are stuck in 80's price land.

Jake Raby wrote:
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public.

Brian wrote:
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history
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orwell84
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 6:47 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

skills@eurocarsplus wrote:
Amskeptic wrote:


Well sure, skills, that's what my other cars are for.
Colin


wonderful Rolling Eyes

the bus is a great adventure vehicle and is lacking in the power and reliability department for the 'modern' family.

dad would just rather hammer deck screws thru his toe nails than set points and valves, let alone do an oil change. mom and the kids don't think breaking down is "fun" either

mom doesn't want heat.... that no matter what, stinks like a slant 6 running thru an old sock.

adding a/c is taking the much needed 10 horsepower and tossing it out the window.

yea, there are some hard core old school owners left....great. i'll whip past them with the a/c on thank you very much. of the 20+ swaps i have done, every single one of them wants to treat it like a Toyota and just put gas in them. That is what I do. they just want to add gas and go and that is what they pay for


Lol. Having lovingly restored the stock heat, it does smell like ass…if we are being honest. Even with a squeaky clean heating system it’s still pulling air through the engine compartment. No engine compartment in any car ever smells good. The missus complains about it. When it’s cold enough to need it, it doesn’t bother me. If you are staving off hypothermia and shit your pants, you are grateful for the added warmth and not inclined to complain about the smell.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 8:01 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

Just took my 69 Bus for an early morning rip to the next town (50 miles one way). It was 18 outside at 7am and I'm headed up the state highway bundled up, wool blanket on my lap, seeing my breath with every exhale. An admirer pulls up next to me in his early 2000 Honda , looks over with a smiling thumbs up. The thumb wavers and falls when he sees my breath as I look over, smile gone, and he hits the gas. Not so cool anymore...

I've never run the heat because I also don't like my Bus smelling like ass.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 8:15 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

My bus and beetle both have excellent heat that doesn’t stink like ass. Just did a 1000+ mile trip in my bus through 3 states, 3 snow storms and my heat was excellent! Also got a total of 19.75 MPG on that trip. Sure it’s not 24, but I did get several tanks of 21.5.

As far as getting heat quickly, I find that using a Kats VW-15 oil heater does wonders.

Minus valve “checks,” I treat my ACVWs just like my Nissan p/up. They all get premium fuel, I check the oil during each fill up, I change the oil every 3000 miles and rotate the tires every other oil change.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:08 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

I wonder since the OP is traveling around and doing "driveway" rebuilds, who's checking the case to make sure it doesn't need machining and if it does... who's doing it? How is the case being cleaned?

I use a local machine shop to measure, aka blueprint, the case and run it through a pressurized hot tank to thoroughly clean it.. even a brand new case gets checked and cleaned.

It's cheap insurance.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 10:38 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

skills@eurocarsplus wrote:


this is the problem. I had a list of "yo bro, when you get a good engine in let me know" folks who when reached out to, ghosted me.


Fuck em. Should of been there. Laughing



skills@eurocarsplus wrote:


did you also inform them that with some good shopping and DIY they can do a swap for around 10k or less, have real FI and 170 horsepower?

hard to argue with the subaru route when a brand-fucking-new short block is 2k


but there is nothing like doing 70 at 2700 rpm's and being able to hear your kids whisper in the back seat with the heat on and getting 24 mpg's




True that. Especially if you are a Gen Xer and just want to drive a reliable, powerful, quiet rig.

I like my set up. But not for long hauls and not to think it will be completable the whole time, because its not by my estimation. But its still nice when compared to others and what they choose to live with. Cool
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Amskeptic
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 10:59 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

blue72beetle wrote:
Amskeptic wrote:

that the air-cooled VW engine is a good reliable engine. * **




* Just not in a bus.



My engines are just in buses. I have never lost an engine on the road. Again, not because of any modifications or special specs. Two of the three buses I currently own have factory engines at 112,650 miles and 156,000 miles. They are fine. They are driven all over the country. They all have done Death Valley in July.

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I am not claiming that it is because of my special cam or oil cooler or jetting or exhaust system. They are stock engines and they work fine.
Colin


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:12 am    Post subject: Re: Engine Rebuilds Reply with quote

orwell84 wrote:
Having lovingly restored the stock heat, it does smell like ass…if we are being honest. Even with a squeaky clean heating system it’s still pulling air through the engine compartment.



Do you have the plastic disc that surrounds the thermostat cable as it comes up to the thermostat lever? Did you caulk the rear tins and alternator plate where the factory did? All grommets in place?

I originally thought it was to keep the hot undercar air away from the fan. But I did an experiment in 2007 crossing Texas in 107* heat, where I stripped off the foam seal, took out the rear tins, ran with the deck lid open, and the engine temperature did not care! It only hated pulling up the spark plug boots.

So why was VW going so nuts with the sealing of everything, the oil fill pipe grommet, the fresh air pipe grommets, the plugs and grommets on the front tin, the stupid little plastic disk around the thermostat cable?

Well, in 1971, Consumer Reports darkly intimated that your children would die of monoxide poisoning if you turned on the heat in a VW bus. They went to the ends of the Earth to keep the air fresh in the engine compartment and even today, we miss so many of the little details. My 1978 Bus has good heat and smells fine. The 1977 Westy smells bad only when cold and backing up, it was repaired at the right rear corner after a hit, and I just can't figure out where the exhaust comes in.
The 1970 heat smells fine .... after winning the battle with lousy exhaust gaskets.
Colin
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