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69’nDAN Samba Member
Joined: July 17, 2020 Posts: 23 Location: California
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 1:39 pm Post subject: Crankcase Vent Help |
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Is there a better way to route my crankcase ventilation? Worried that this configuration will make a mess.
Thanks |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 2:53 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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I would try to keep the hose going downhill back to the breather at all times so any oil that gets in the line goes back downhill Make sure there is a flame trap in the setup to prevent a backfire from blowing up the crankcase. CO, unburnt HC and O2 can be explosive. A better option would be to collect a working oil bath air cleaner. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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richparker Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011 Posts: 6983 Location: Durango, CO
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 5:52 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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Run the hose on top of the alternator between the carb and the fan housing. Although I’ve run breathers on the bottom of the air cleaner before, I prefer the top. _________________ __________
’71 Westy build
Adventure thread
’65 Deluxe Build
’63 Deluxe Build |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51153 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 6:01 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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So many things in that pic say "it's going to run like ass", lousy aircleaner with no preheat or noise abatement, vacuum advance hose on wrong port, chrome alternator pulley, just to name a few, aye yae yae! _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16971 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 6:04 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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As Steve said… the way you’ve laid out that breather hose, it will eventually fill up with trapped oil and stop working.
Also, x 2 on getting an original air filter _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50352
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 7:37 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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You fancy after market oil filler/crankcase breather greatly restricts the passage of the blowby gases resulting in increased crankcase pressure, the original style functions much better. |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16971 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 8:14 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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Yes. Go back to an original breather vent to avoid oil leaks due to increased breather pressure _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 8:25 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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don't forget to install the rest of the tin either if you want a cool running engine. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16971 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 10:16 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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Here’s the deal. If you pull the breather hose off your oil filler spout and look at the inside diameter of the fitting the hose is connected to, you will most likely find that it’s substantially smaller than the original breather port. This reduces flow and increases breather pressure which in turn creates oil leaks. Ask me how I know? _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50352
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 10:45 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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aeromech wrote: |
Here’s the deal. If you pull the breather hose off your oil filler spout and look at the inside diameter of the fitting the hose is connected to, you will most likely find that it’s substantially smaller than the original breather port. This reduces flow and increases breather pressure which in turn creates oil leaks. Ask me how I know? |
I bought one of these fillers, blocked off the original hole and drilled a new hole on the upper side for a 3/4" NPT fitting and installed it. I had wanted one of these because I could install it pointing rearward a bit to make adding oil easier in my '73 Thing. What I found is that the oil use went up markedly, I presume this is because of the lack of baffles, but I haven't yet tried putting the original filler back on to see if the oil use goes back down. The engine has good compression and no history of oil use, but has huge end play. |
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metahacker Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2010 Posts: 692 Location: san.diego
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Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:24 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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Wildthings wrote: |
What I found is that the oil use went up markedly, I presume this is because of the lack of baffles, but I haven't yet tried putting the original filler back on to see if the oil use goes back down. The engine has good compression and no history of oil use, but has huge end play. |
i've used the same filler as well and found that this material, commonly sold as "breather filter" media, stuffed into it was very effective.
i just wish i could remember the name of the material.... i bought a bag of it for cheap....
but, either way, buying it as a Wix/Purolator "breather filter" from an auto parts store/amazon/summit/etc is still a $2-7 deal.
the only drawback was oil filling was slower.
i know old ferrari v12s used copper scouring pad type stuff...and hot rod guys (e.g. HAMB forum) typically use stainless brillo pads.....
the idea of something that's essentially plastic wool seemed the least scary to me, though
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/purolator-cran...lsrc=aw.ds
https://www.amazon.com/Purolator-B20016-Breather-F...amp;sr=1-1
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/purolator-cran...lsrc=aw.ds |
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richparker Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011 Posts: 6983 Location: Durango, CO
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metahacker Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2010 Posts: 692 Location: san.diego
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Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:29 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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your engines sound like they are well put together with nice ring seal
let me take the bus on a couple road trips i can fix that pretty quickly :) |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:34 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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the pads etc are a flame trap. That is their main purpose. If a backfire happens, it prevents the flame from reaching the crankcase. You throw it away when it gets cruddy and restricts flow.
Here is one you might find in a typical air cleaner
_________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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richparker Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011 Posts: 6983 Location: Durango, CO
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Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:34 pm Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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metahacker wrote: |
your engines sound like they are well put together with nice ring seal
let me take the bus on a couple road trips i can fix that pretty quickly |
I have Total Seal rings in my bus engine and Grant rings in my beetle engine
Once you drive my bus, you won’t want to go back to yours. _________________ __________
’71 Westy build
Adventure thread
’65 Deluxe Build
’63 Deluxe Build |
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69’nDAN Samba Member
Joined: July 17, 2020 Posts: 23 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 9:14 am Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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Sounds like without installing the original air cleaner/oil bath, that my best option would be to...
-keep the breather hose on a downhill slope towards the oil filler.
-install a flame arrestor in the oil filler against the baffles.
-bore out the current oil filler fitting to a 3/4" NPT to limit flow restriction.
Thanks everyone for the insight! |
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69’nDAN Samba Member
Joined: July 17, 2020 Posts: 23 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 9:18 am Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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busdaddy wrote: |
So many things in that pic say "it's going to run like ass", lousy aircleaner with no preheat or noise abatement, vacuum advance hose on wrong port, chrome alternator pulley, just to name a few, aye yae yae! |
This engine hasn't been put on the bus yet as I am still going through some things on it. As someone who is relatively new to this VW stuff, I appreciate the pointers. |
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69’nDAN Samba Member
Joined: July 17, 2020 Posts: 23 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 9:20 am Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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SGKent wrote: |
don't forget to install the rest of the tin either if you want a cool running engine. |
Yes, the rest of the tin will eventually make it back on. Engine is currently sitting on a bench until its ready to go in the bus. Thanks! |
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69’nDAN Samba Member
Joined: July 17, 2020 Posts: 23 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:37 am Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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metahacker wrote: |
Wildthings wrote: |
What I found is that the oil use went up markedly, I presume this is because of the lack of baffles, but I haven't yet tried putting the original filler back on to see if the oil use goes back down. The engine has good compression and no history of oil use, but has huge end play. |
i've used the same filler as well and found that this material, commonly sold as "breather filter" media, stuffed into it was very effective.
i just wish i could remember the name of the material.... i bought a bag of it for cheap....
but, either way, buying it as a Wix/Purolator "breather filter" from an auto parts store/amazon/summit/etc is still a $2-7 deal.
the only drawback was oil filling was slower.
i know old ferrari v12s used copper scouring pad type stuff...and hot rod guys (e.g. HAMB forum) typically use stainless brillo pads.....
the idea of something that's essentially plastic wool seemed the least scary to me, though
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/purolator-cran...lsrc=aw.ds
https://www.amazon.com/Purolator-B20016-Breather-F...amp;sr=1-1
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/purolator-cran...lsrc=aw.ds |
So you just stick this down in the filler neck against the baffles? Just one of these pads or do you fill it up? |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50352
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:47 am Post subject: Re: Crankcase Vent Help |
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These are designed to keep oil from fouling the air cleaner element. The air cleaner element is what serves as a flame trap where these are typically used. Not sure how VW vented the crankcase into the air cleaner on dual carbs, but on some of their EFI engines the blowby ends up in the S-Boot with no effective flame trap. |
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