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Country Doc1 Samba Member
Joined: August 14, 2011 Posts: 30
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Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 11:46 am Post subject: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Hi to all, thanks in advance for any advice!
I have an 89 factory TD Vanagon that now has a 1.9AAZ, and the starter clutch drive is starting to slip when it's hot. I have had some people tell me that the rebuilds use aftermarket clutch drives which fail within a few years, and that it's better to rebuild the original Bosch one.
I also spoke to a rebuilder in the Finger Lakes area who recommended consider a Mahle starter instead of a rebuild, as a direct replacement option, but I can't find any reference to a Mahle starter that is a compatible fit?
For reference, the PN he suggested was Mahle MAH-MS285.
Thanks!
dc |
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crazyvwvanman Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2008 Posts: 9935 Location: Orbiting San Diego
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Country Doc1 Samba Member
Joined: August 14, 2011 Posts: 30
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Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 1:06 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Yes, that's the only internet page I could find - I'm just not sure it would actually work, given that I can't find any reference to it on thesamba or other Vanagon places? (The starter shop seemed to think it would). |
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crazyvwvanman Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2008 Posts: 9935 Location: Orbiting San Diego
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Sodo Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007 Posts: 9610 Location: Western WA
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Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 2:12 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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While you're under the van, optimizing....
it's a good time to ALSO delete that satanic front transaxle ground strap
and upgrade to a proper eqpt ground from the starter case to the chassis.
Someone told me the diesel bolt head is in a recess and to do this you need to procure a longer bolt+spacer. I've never seen a diesel starter bolt. _________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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Country Doc1 Samba Member
Joined: August 14, 2011 Posts: 30
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Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 2:37 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Ah, thanks! That looks like the Mahle would fit. The rebuilder felt it was a better option than the reman Bosch ones - maybe I'll go that way.
Thanks for the tip on the ground strap
dc |
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crazyvwvanman Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2008 Posts: 9935 Location: Orbiting San Diego
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Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 4:06 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Diesels are different. The two 19mm headed starter bolts are not a great place to add a ground over to the chassis.
Other spots are better IMHO.
I've replaced a bunch of diesel van starters but have never run into a Mahle branded one.
It seems lots of old big "names" now sell asian parts so I'd hesitate to pay much for the Mahle without knowing where the current supply comes from.
You can buy new diesel starters from asia for $75+ and they seem to last as well as some rebuilt ones.
Mark
Sodo wrote: |
While you're under the van, optimizing....
it's a good time to ALSO .....upgrade to a proper eqpt ground from the starter case to the chassis.
Someone told me the diesel bolt head is in a recess and to do this you need to procure a longer bolt+spacer. I've never seen a diesel starter bolt. |
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Gnarlodious Samba Member
Joined: September 28, 2013 Posts: 2323 Location: Adobe Jungle USA
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Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 4:36 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Good time to upgrade to the SR28X gear reduction starter. It'll cost more but be way better. It is smaller so easier to install, and less heavy so you won't bash your brains in if you drop it on your face. I put in a Genuwine new Bosch starter in 2008 and it is still going strong. Worth every dollar. _________________ Vanagon ’83 diesel AAZ w/Giles injection, 5spd 4.57R&P+TBD and a '78 diesel Rabbit |
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ALIKA T3 Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2009 Posts: 6357 Location: Honolulu,Hawaii and France
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Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 10:41 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Gnarlodious wrote: |
Good time to upgrade to the SR28X gear reduction starter. It'll cost more but be way better. It is smaller so easier to install, and less heavy so you won't bash your brains in if you drop it on your face. I put in a Genuwine new Bosch starter in 2008 and it is still going strong. Worth every dollar. |
X is for rebuild. Same at VW's.
SR28 is the late T3 diesel starter. I'm not sure you can find genuine Bosch these days, the market is plagiued with chinese junk, the aluminum housing is made of sugar and internals much cheaply made, plastic parts that don't withstand a lot of heat...
I would go the Tdi way. SR0408X with adapter plate. _________________ Silicone Steering Boots and 930 Cv boots for sale in the classifieds.
Syncro transmission upgrade parts in the Classifieds.
Subaru EJ22+UN1 5 speed transmission
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=416343
Syncro http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...num+gadget |
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valvecovergasket Samba Member
Joined: October 10, 2018 Posts: 1491 Location: pnw
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Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2023 7:48 am Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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i just went through this on our tdi swapped van
it had the original starter, i took it to my local rebuilders and they decided itd be easier to replace with a new bosch unit
it was bosch part number 001 110 009
its smaller than the really big original starter, and appeared to not be too exotic or tough to get since they only charged me something like $130 for it.
i looked into the tdi swaps but it seemed like the juice wasnt worth the squeeze considering how cheap this one was. _________________ MegaSquirt resource - SpitfireEFI.com
gone, but not forgotten: '83 tdi westy - swap thread |
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ALIKA T3 Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2009 Posts: 6357 Location: Honolulu,Hawaii and France
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Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2023 11:01 am Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Looks like it was used until recently on Polaris machines. Interesting!
Found them rebuilt only though.
https://www.motorcityreman.com/booe00st1.html
Quote: |
Description: Starter
OEM(s): Bosch, Hatz, Lombardini
Voltage: 12
Power: 1.6kW / 2.14HP
Rotation: CW
Starter Type: PMGR
Number of Teeth: 9
Gear OD: 1.146in / 29.1mm
Mtg Ear 1 Hole: 10mm Unthreaded
Mtg Ear 2 Hole: 10mm Unthreaded
Notes:
Lombardini Diesel Engines on Hatz Applications
Replaces:
Bosch 0001109009, 0-001-109-009, 0-001-110-042
Used On:
Arctic Cat 700 Diesel 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015
Massey Ferguson 700 Diesel 2007, 2008
Piaggio PORTER Daihatsu / Lombardin
Piaggio QUARGO Daihatsu / Lombardin
Polaris Brutus 1000 HD PTO 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018
Polaris Ranger 1000 Diesel 2015, 2016, 2017
Polaris Ranger 1000 Diesel Crew 2015, 2016, 2017
Polaris Ranger 1000 Diesel HST 2015, 2016, 2017 |
_________________ Silicone Steering Boots and 930 Cv boots for sale in the classifieds.
Syncro transmission upgrade parts in the Classifieds.
Subaru EJ22+UN1 5 speed transmission
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=416343
Syncro http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...num+gadget |
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valvecovergasket Samba Member
Joined: October 10, 2018 Posts: 1491 Location: pnw
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Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2023 7:39 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Granted, I haven't started the van yet as I'm wrapping up a suspension and brake refresh but it sure popped into the stock spot like it was meant to go there.
And I trust these guys they've been really good with oddball custom stuff and all they do is alternators and starters. _________________ MegaSquirt resource - SpitfireEFI.com
gone, but not forgotten: '83 tdi westy - swap thread |
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westyventures Samba Member
Joined: December 29, 2004 Posts: 2306 Location: Oregon Outback
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Posted: Tue Jun 06, 2023 11:18 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Ditch the antiquated starter and upgrade to the TDI starter, using the adaptor plate available from T3 Technique. Self-supporting nose too so no more interference issues with larger clutch setups including the dual-mass. |
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Country Doc1 Samba Member
Joined: August 14, 2011 Posts: 30
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Posted: Thu Jun 08, 2023 1:54 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Thanks Karl, unfortunately missed this post before ordering the Bosch SR28X. |
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crazyvwvanman Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2008 Posts: 9935 Location: Orbiting San Diego
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Posted: Thu Jun 08, 2023 8:45 pm Post subject: Re: Diesel Vanagon starter - replace or rebuild? |
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Hopefully the SR28X you receive will be the newer type gear reduction version.
Bosch ships large older type and compact newer type under the same rebuild number.
Mark
Country Doc1 wrote: |
Thanks Karl, unfortunately missed this post before ordering the Bosch SR28X. |
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