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finster
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Joined: May 26, 2012
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Location: not far from the madding crowd
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 Posted: Fri May 31, 2024 8:58 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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given the state of the factory in 45/46 I think there's going to be variations in procedures as the situation dictated and therefore hard to give definite dates of change.
hopefully we will find out more about this car now that it is being restored.
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RUNKLE
Samba Member
Joined: July 19, 2014
Posts: 5148
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2024 12:06 pm Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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Thank you for posting this image of the rear window pressing. Obvious the five finger pressing overlaps the three finger pressing, so is to figure out when was the introduction of the three finger pressing is going to be a challenge, if not impossible.
| finster wrote: |
view of the rear window fingers on the mexican car
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Type 1
1950 Standard - 1959 Ragtop - 1961 Ragtop two fold - 1964 Sunroof
Type 3
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wagen19
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2007
Posts: 200
Location: germany
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2024 1:39 pm Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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| RUNKLE wrote: |
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Thank you for posting this image of the rear window pressing. Obvious the five finger pressing overlaps the three finger pressing, so is to figure out when was the introduction of the three finger pressing is going to be a challenge, if not impossible.
| finster wrote: |
view of the rear window fingers on the mexican car
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Sorry, it seems, now it gets really confusing.
5 finger pressing is older than 3 finger, that should be clear, if not, please look for pics in the gallery.
For me, it´s more the big question, when the newer 3 finger pressing appeared first.
Overlap: who really knows, but that´s also possible. Thinking of the lack of large steel rolls or pieces and therefore needed welded outerskin-roofs, late 45, early 46 (?) it´s only a idea, WOB used the available steel material to press old-style 5 finger inner sheets for stock and combined these older sheets later with one-piece outerskin roof, or mixed the old 5- and new 3-finger inner sheets.
Reconditioned cars:
bodies or new spare-part bodies, when ever set on a especial pan, can confuse this discussion here
Restaured cars:
rather new faked bodies. I´ve seen patched split bugs with 5 fingers inside and 3 fingers outside, in front the louvres. It´s also possible to fake for 2-screw striker-plates.
Let´s look for:
> when came the newer 3-finger-pressing first? VIN-number, body-number?
> overlap 5-fingers <=> 3-fingers???
> last car with 5-fingers, VIN-number, body-number?
Reconditioned cars:
How to identify a factory-reconditioned car?
How many of them were assembled?
Is here a birthcertificate of a reconditioned car known?
Kept the reconditoned cars the VIN of the used old frame?
Was the old-style welded-on VIN-tag replaced or added on newer frames after Oct 47?
What about cars twice or more often reconditioned by factory?
Is there a documentation about factory-reconditioned cars and their (new given or changed) VIN- and frame-numbers?
Who really knows...
Good night, Klingone |
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RUNKLE
Samba Member
Joined: July 19, 2014
Posts: 5148
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2024 1:58 pm Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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| wagen19 wrote: |
| Sorry, it seems, now it gets really confusing. |
No confusion here, five finger pressing came first, followed by the three finger pressing.
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Type 1
1950 Standard - 1959 Ragtop - 1961 Ragtop two fold - 1964 Sunroof
Type 3
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wagen19
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2007
Posts: 200
Location: germany
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| Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2024 1:08 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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| RUNKLE wrote: |
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| wagen19 wrote: |
| Sorry, it seems, now it gets really confusing. |
No confusion here, five finger pressing came first, followed by the three finger pressing.
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That´s what I meant!
Looking for details in the first 5- or later 3-finger area,
The 11´46 with 5-fingers, (late version) bent low end steg, has no holding rails in luggage compartmen and so no openings for them, to hook in.
I found out, in the 4´48 sparebook, they are listed the first time.
They appeared at body number A 15 751. So the sheet must have from that time on, till 09.Feb 1949 the 2 openings to hook in. The rails had the number 802 775, but it goes on.
ET 4´48: Holding rall 802 775, from body A 15 751 (to A 44 220, 09.02.49)
ET 6´49: Holding rail 802 775 a, from body A 44 221 (09.02.49)
ET 9´50: Holding rail 11 802 775 a, (probably the same as 802 775 a)
>> At least, there are pics in the gallery for following pressing-versions:
1.) 5-fingers, (early version), middle steg fully rounded low end, without openings for rails
2.) 5-fingers, (late version), bent low end middle-steg, without openings for rails, (late 46 to body A 15 750)
3.) 5-fingers, (late version), bent low end middle-steg, with 2 openings for rails, from body A 15 751 to ? (47 or 48 ?)
4.) 3-fingers, with 2 openings for rails (car late 47 (?) and (all ?) 48 to body A 44 220, Feb 49)
5.) 3-fingers, without openings, from body A 44 221, 09.02.49 on
So the change from 5 to 3- fingers must be at least after body A 15 751.
Not visable at the 11´46 is a cable to the interior light-opening. Are there 2 little holes for the mouning screws? |
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Martin Southwell
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2010
Posts: 1060
Location: Bath, England
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| Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2024 4:38 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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In a nutshell, we still have no idea when the change from 5 'fingers' to 3 occured!
I must confess to considerable confusion regarding the rest of the information supplied. I know 'steg' is 'step' in English, but what are the rail & openings refered to? Is rail or opening where the carpet tucks into? What's bent low?
eg. bent low end middle-steg, with 2 openings for rails, |
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finster
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Martin Southwell
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2010
Posts: 1060
Location: Bath, England
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| Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2024 3:03 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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| Any info on these 2 cars please? I've always thought a Notek light on a Beetle, however correct, looks ridiculous. |
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finster
Samba Member
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| Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2024 6:12 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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^ they're part of the hausmann collection
I prefer the notek mounted centrally on a beetle
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finster
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Posts: 9241
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| Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2024 4:14 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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muddy militracks event this year
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"we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect... |
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finster
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Posts: 9241
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| Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2024 3:41 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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dec 45
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Vabalistas
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Joined: May 04, 2011
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Location: Lithuania
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finster
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| Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2024 4:53 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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thanks vabalistas - a '43 type 60 in norway. last on the road in 66 and was owned by the current owner's father in 48-9
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EverettB 
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finster
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Posts: 9241
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| Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2024 7:41 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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some more drooltastic photos of that dec 45 type 51
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Martin Southwell
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2010
Posts: 1060
Location: Bath, England
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| Posted: Sat Jun 15, 2024 10:50 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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There is a vey nice Kubel for sale here on Samba at the moment https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2688900 but something that looks odd, is the angle of the windscreen, which in one of the sales pictures looks almost vertical. Generally there is a noticable backward slope on a Kubel windscreen. Has the windsreen not been locked in the correct position here?
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T2_681
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Joined: October 08, 2018
Posts: 91
Location: Czech republic
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2024 1:01 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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I do not know, Martin. The windshield seems to fit the removabele windows as well as the roof yet I admit that it looks slightly more vertical.
Seems to be indeed very decent restoration but the fenders/wings have incorrect shape as in most cases and the rear ones are placed wrongly with the front end too low. This low placement would be correct for the early short rear fenders but not for the long version which was more or less flush with the door sill, not the the door sill seam. I do not understand why restorers do not pay more attention to this particular detail. |
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finster
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2024 3:58 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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the same car seen at the recent flanders gathering. I was thinking the same about the side windows fit...
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"we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect... |
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finster
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Joined: May 26, 2012
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2024 4:00 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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_________________
"we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect... |
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finster
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Posts: 9241
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2024 4:48 am Post subject: Re: Present Day Photos of KDFs, Kubels and Schwimmers |
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video...
https://www.facebook.com/reel/471411108751289
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"we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
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