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Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:53 am

bugdust wrote: The pan when it was fresh

The pan after being outside for 8 months. The lighter color is paint overspray from using the pan as a workbench. Right after this I put a coat of Rustoleum on top.

It is still sitting outside and still has water sitting on it. :cry:

Whats the beam? that still looks good! powder coat?

Tue Jun 07, 2011 4:46 pm

I just read all 14 pages and was left laughing at Lee's comment, "and in the end, nothing worked." Great! So much for worrying about getting the right or wrong thing. Rust wins. It is just a matter of when?

Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:35 am

I patiently waited to reply-

Rust isn't going to dissolve and go away. It has to be completely removed no matter what you cover it with. The only way to properly prep is with this followed by some epoxy...

http://www.zendextool.com/speedblaster/

Chemicals are snake oil.

Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:03 pm

Good torture test, but as some have said, some things were not really applicable, especially the chlorine. I would've soaked it in gasoline, brake fluid, and salt water. I also would've attached it under a car somehow and driven with it a while. Maybe shot it with a BB gun for a chip test.
Anyways, one thing I like is that Rustoleum performed really well. I don't know why people knock it so much. We have a staircase at work that leads up to a parts room. Just a simple metal stair case. Sees hundreds of feet a day. It's been painted in Rustoleum Rusty Metal primer for years and it still looks as good as the day it was installed (long before I got there). The stuff is tough. I'm not saying you should paint your whole car with it, but some Rusto primer and black on the floor pans goes a long way.

Wed Jan 04, 2012 11:51 am

Lee. wrote: Lee. wrote:

Here is the orientation of the panels.

I'll make sure to label each picture from now on.

I found the panels and tossed them in the trash last weekend. Here's the final pic....In the end, after 5 years, nothing worked. :lol:

from the looks of the results it looks like the rust bullet did the best.

Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:45 pm

Just bought rustoleum rusty metal primer. $11 per quart, $5 in the spray can. I didn't see the price in there earlier. Considering how it faired, it is the budget winner. I have to agree though, that all these products look like fool's gold. I plan to keep mine in the garage, and certainly out of the pool! My Toyota will have to sleep outside...

Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:18 pm

my vote would be for the rustoleum, when i worked in steel erecting, that was what we used to paint all of the beams when we were done connecting and/or welding (this was 18 yrs ago).

i loved the effort of the experiment, but i would have used little ( 4" x 4" ) plates so that the metal would be completely surrounded by each product separately. that way rust wasn't coming from behind or beside, or even when the product from beside failed it can't creep over/under.

all of these may have passed, or been closer, even without prep.

no matter what prep was used, we are only treating the SURFACE, not changing the composition of the metal. ANY exposed/untreated metal is a open door.

for cavities some of y'all have good ideas such as drill & spray/fog something in ( i'll be using waxoyl ).

BUT glad someone tried 2 do some kind of comparison so armchair experts ( like me, lol ) & others w/experience could chime in also.

hope i gave some insight, or feel free to just ignore me, thats what my ole lady does :lol: !

Thu May 31, 2012 10:27 am

Guys, just wanted to correct a discrepancy in the picture orientation:

My 2 c. -Y.
Lee. wrote:

Here is the orientation of the panels.

I'll make sure to label each picture from now on.

I found the panels and tossed them in the trash last weekend. Here's the final pic....In the end, after 5 years, nothing worked. :lol:

Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:52 pm

I first sanded and removed rust with a steel bristle wheel on my high speed die grinder that i bought from Harbor Freight tools for $12.00

I used a product that I bought at ACE Hardware called Ospho but you have to be careful handling it since it is Phosphoric Acid and can burn skin.. after letting it dry 24 hours for the entire floor of my '67 Bug. I used POR15 from Eastwood.

After that was all dry Chris Vallone from ClassicVW Bug suggested a deadening material called Quick Roof which i bought at Home Depot for $16.00 for a 25 foot roll.

Just look at the photos so you can see the process:

STEP 1 BEFORE OSPHO:

STEP 2 AFTER OSPHO:

STEP 3 AFTER POR 15:

STEP 4 QUICK ROOF DEADENING MATERIAL:

[img]http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa300/zechrah/2003%20MERCEDES%20BENZ%20C240/MY%201967%20VW%20BUG%20PROJECT%20%202012/QUICKROOFDEADENINGMATERIAL1.jpg[/img

This is a good Seam Sealer that you can buy at Home Depot for less than $5 bucks and it's paintable:

Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:52 pm

The.Kudu.Horn

How did that sound deadener from Home depot work out? I'm looking to do the inside of my bus

Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:23 pm

Javyd wrote: The.Kudu.Horn

How did that sound deadener from Home depot work out? I'm looking to do the inside of my bus

It is a good product.. I am very pleased... i have used Dynamat before and it is the same product type..
$16.00 per 25 foot roll worked great for me .. i did the complete rear, floor, door panels front and rear as well as the kick panels with 4 Rolls. $16.00 x 4rolls = $64.00 not bad at all.

Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:56 pm

Coming back here, even though I am a very adamant supporter of Rustoleum, I will say that Masterseries has it beat in one category: it sticks to ANYTHING. Literally, anything. I painted it on smooth metal and it sticks, just takes more coats to get it on. I've painted it over the glue stuff, rust, tar, chip guard, filler, unprepped paint, mud, you name it, Masterseries will stick to it. And stay stuck to it. Stuff is amazing. But you should still clean and prep as good as you could. Just some stuff, like the adhesive used on the roof, does not want to come off.

Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:56 am

I have read through this topic exhaustively. My Question is which is the best Metal Prep technique and chemical?

I understand this may vary with circumstances. Also there are always multiple ways to skin a cat.

I used Jasco Paint and epoxy stripper to remove paint down to bare metal. The stuff works great but it's nasty stuff. Make sure to have PLENTY of ventilation it releases carbon monoxide a silent killer.

I also used a 4" razor blade, a grinder and wire wheel for the little left over tough spots and Eastwood soda blaster for the hard to get at places. I can't stress how useful the razor was, it really works well to get a all the excess paint off cleanly.

My metal has been left in very good shape, smooth, smooth finish. Except for the rusty spots :)

So I have MetalPrep79 and Picklex20. I am considering using both. First the MetalPrep79 to clean the Metal since this has to be washed off right away.

Then the Picklex20 and according to the manufacturer this can stay on for a bonding surface.
Is this true? Can Picklex20 just be left there?

Picklex20 also claims you do not need to sand or scuff the metal before application of paint/primer adhesion. Is this true or recommended? Would anyone advise on the procedure with picklex20?

My process has been - panal by panel.
1. Remove Paint to bare metal - Jasco->Razor->Wire wheel->Soda Balster
2. Remove or cut out rust
3. Apply MetalPrep79 then wash and dry surface, fix rust, reapply and clean
4. Not yet done but thinking??? Picklex20 for metal etch and protection. No scuffing necessary???
5. Rust bullet - Seems to be the longest lasting and most durable after test
6. Prime sand Prime sand - not yet sure what to use over Rustbullet???
7. Paint - this I will not be doing I plan to take it to a Pro.

Wed Oct 03, 2012 10:58 am

I tried to read every post. But you do no that por 15 does not have UV protection... Sitting in the sun would be kinda unfair.

Cool test though.

Thu Oct 25, 2012 8:25 am

i just moved from south carolina to ny with a 63 bug in pretty decent shape. ive got the body off the pan and cut out the old floor pans. its just the backbone chassis and nothing else. ive wire wheeled all the paint off to reveal a completly shiny surface, no rust whatsoever. what chemical/ process should i use to prepare the chassis for por 15/eastwood?
also what prep do the floor pans need?
thansk

Thu Oct 25, 2012 10:52 am

cannonfodder4j wrote: i just moved from south carolina to ny with a 63 bug in pretty decent shape. ive got the body off the pan and cut out the old floor pans. its just the backbone chassis and nothing else. ive wire wheeled all the paint off to reveal a completly shiny surface, no rust whatsoever. what chemical/ process should i use to prepare the chassis for por 15/eastwood?
also what prep do the floor pans need?
thansk

You need to prep the panels with metal-ready (POR15), or whatever the eastwood equivalent is. Otherwise you'll have problems with the paint sticking to the shiny surface. Just make sure to follow the instructions the manufacturer provides. I tried to cut corners and skipped prep before I POR'd parts of my bus and ended up having to strip it all off.

Tue Mar 05, 2013 8:37 am

The toughest part of rust treatment is never knowing the long term results of your efforts, so when I was stripping down the side of my bus on the weekend I was actually quite excited to discover a bunch of small areas that look to have been previously treated with a phosphoric acid product (highlighted with red in the photo below).

Given how I'm pretty sure the paint job is at least 10 years old, I was VERY impressed to see that the rust hadn't returned at all. There were a few very small brown spots, but I believe that was because I ripped the "converted" rust off while stripping the paint.

I should also mention that it was only sealed with what looks like rolled on house paint and no primer, and I believe spent the last decade mostly sitting outside. After seeing these results, I'm going to use Rust Mort + sealing primer for all my remaining repairs.

Hope this helps other people!

Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:37 pm

I think a great man once said, "rust never sleeps"

Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:48 am

Do any of these rust treatments play well /not play well with topcoats? My dad told me of using Rustoleum on his car (years ago) and then painting over top of it with auto paint (1-part?), but the solvents in the topcoat pulled up the Rustoleum.

Can an epoxy (or other) primer act as a sealant/barrier between these treatments and whatever I go with as a topcoat? Or do I need to know what I will use as a topcoat first and then choose a primer and rust treatment that all work together?

-Larry, paint noob.

Mon Mar 03, 2014 9:57 am

The Rusto is enamel, and things like cellulose and acrylic paints will shrivel up if applied over it.