TheSamba.com :: View topic - Distributor gear installed 20 deg off TDC

Sun Aug 19, 2012 6:20 pm

I'm rebuilding my engine and am trying to reinstall the distributor gear. The Bug Me videos say to turn the crank to TDC. I watched the valves on cylinder 1 to find TDC. I also have a pulley with angle markings that indicate I am at TDC. The video then says to point the groove toward the rear fuel pump stud and the "small end" toward the pulley side. I assume thats referring to the small side of the offset groved surface. I drop it in, shake the crank shaft a bit to get it to drop all the way in where I can put the distributor all the way in. But, the video says that groove should now be flat and parallel with the front face of the engine. Mine is about 10 deg off. I have to rotate the crank about 20 deg to get it to the same position the video indicates. Is this correct, or am I a tooth off? Is this close enough that I can adjust it after its running?

Sun Aug 19, 2012 6:43 pm

Heres one thread for a start. There are a lot more in this section if you want more info.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3...ar+install

Sun Aug 19, 2012 7:59 pm

I've read a few of those threads and immediately get lost. I hope if I keep reading it will eventually sink in. But basically, I get the same configuration as that poster. I honestly don't know if I have EI or what "009" is.

Sun Aug 19, 2012 8:08 pm

EI...ELECTRONIC IGNITION
009...009 DISTRIBUTOR, no vacuum advance

Sun Aug 19, 2012 9:11 pm

I just looked again. At TDC my distributor drive lines up with the grove pointed toward the rear fuel pump stud. Like the diagram from that other thread, but rotated the other direction. His points toward the forward stud. Mine to the rear stud. I also searched based on the markings on my distributor. I have the 009 no vacuum advance. There are bumps on the plastic, but I'm not sure what each one represents. How do I know if it's electronic ignition?

Every time I try to reseat it in a different position, it binds up and is difficult to remove again. Had a hell of a time getting it out in the first place. I've only been able to get it all the way down twice. Once in this position. Once with it pointed toward the forward fuel pump post.

I should add that I actually have a 1971 VW bus engine in my 1966 bug. Does that make a difference?

Sun Aug 19, 2012 9:42 pm

With the dist in, at TDC what "o'clock" is the rotor pointing? 1,2,3,4,5 Oclock?

Mon Aug 20, 2012 8:47 am

:idea: Mory heavens the world is coming to an end if the rotor is not pointing at the slot on the dist body or things lined up with the pully at TDC.

Why have an ulcer for no reason. The drive gear has 12 teeth thus 12 possible spots for #1 to be pointing at. Each tooth is 30 degrees to the left or right depending on how/where the gear was dropped inside. Engine will still run smoothly as it is NOT prejudiced on the setting.

The factory/book is NOT the Bible and is only a guideline to look at.

Bring the pully to TDC and the rotor will be pointing at #1 or #3...thats it.

Rotate the dizzy (no no) I mean the dist so the rotor lines up with the nearest cap/wire location and move the wires in the 1-4-3-2 firing order.

Engine will run good or pop at the carb or fart out the exhaust. If that happens then reverse #1/2 and #3/4 wires and try again.

Look at things in a simple way and not with a why do things happen to me attitude.

Mon Aug 20, 2012 1:59 pm

I think HRVW. is tryng to say dont make installing the drive harder than it needs to be. I'm using a converted type 3 engine and the drive is not in the correct spot for a type 1 engine. Not a problem I bring number one up to TDC. and install my bosch 010 and where ever the rotor is pointing is now number 1 TDC. put the cap on and plug the wire into the cap above where the rotor is pointing and install the other 3 wires in the correct firing order. Set your timing to your year spec. and drive away and enjoy.

Thu Aug 23, 2012 5:18 am

Wow, HRVW, I didn't know asking a question equated to having a woe is me attitude. I'll keep that in mind.

My only real concern/question was whether or not there was possibly an obstruction inside the crank case causing teeth to not mesh together. It would really have sucked to reinstall my motor only to have to tear it apart again because of a bur or chipped tooth. While troubleshooting I had rotated the pulley and thought I felt something impinging. It must have been a dry spot because now it rotates just fine. Everything is back together again. I reinstall it back in my bug tomorrow.

Thu Aug 23, 2012 5:47 am

Just another tip...

Install the distributor drive while you have the case halves apart. I install the crank, then the lifters and cam in the left side, rotate the crank back to #1 TDC and install the distributor drive. Once it's in install the distributor and lock it down while the rest of the build continues.

Easier to see if something doesn't "feel" right and change things if need be.

Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:27 am

:) Sorry..... nothing intended towards any "Oh Me thing" it's just that I have heard the "what the hell did I do wrong this time" from many customers in the past......no reflextion intended (little humor)

We do make our mistakes (yours truely included) and learn from others.

Like a poster said always install the dist towards the #1 spot of choice ( I have the rotor pointing towards #1 cyl or the crank bolt).

Reason is this........there is a 90 degree difference between a vac dist and the 009 thus if you were to exchange them in your engine #1 will change either towards #1 cyl or to the crank bolt......learning experience for some.

This why so many post a problem with the notch on the dist body and the #1 being different all the time and the engine runs rough using the notch as a focal point.

While I'm on a run here the dist drive gear having 12 teeth determines where #1 will/can be pointing. Being a steel gear it rides against a BRASS gear on the crank and being brass have seen a slight burr that would ride the drive gear upwards popping the dist and engine stopping.

Mistake made is assembly of an engine w/o the drive gear and then later trying to install the gear and the spacers will chew the brass gear. Spacers need to be put in first and then the gear put inside (hopefully in the right direction for #1). This problem could very easily have been avoided if the gear was put in while the case was split.

Seem to recall long blocks being sold w/o the drive gear installed leaving the buyer to do his own thus the headache for some.

I always installed the gear in my motors with a note "DO NOT TURN ENGINE OVER W/O DIST INSTALLED". Still once in a while one would come back with the engine locked and I had to loosen the drive gear and check the Brass gear for any damage.

Depending on wear Brass gears are reusable....they need good inspection.

Have rebuilt over 1000 engines thus have seen a lot of the problems and end results after tearing them down.

SORRY for the long post.........I did have good intentions in mind.

Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:52 am

Thanks. The distributor did pop up a little bit, but I could hold it back down with a finger and prevent it from popping up. Is that still ok? I figure a little friction on the gears caused it to stick and pop a bit. Once the oil is in and the distributor is locked down, I didn't think I would have any problem.

Also, the video I have says there's a spring between the drive gear and the distributor. I can't find any spring in my bin of parts after my tear down. I asked a local imports store and they couldn't even find a spring. It doesn't make much sense to me that it has a spring because it doesn't look like there's even any room for one. Does it really need a spring?

Thu Aug 23, 2012 12:39 pm

It's officially called an anit-chatter spring I believe.

Here's one from AC.net

http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Distributor-Drive-Spring-Anti-Chatter-Spring-p/111-105-233.htm

And here's a thread on the subject.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=477240

For a few bucks I'd get one. That or find a shop that deals with VW local and see if they have one laying around.

Thu Aug 23, 2012 1:58 pm

:idea: Everyone at one time or another has had a problem with a bolt and nut where the end thread on the bolt has been damaged and the nut will not g o on so we use a file to clean the end thread.

The brass gear being spiraled can have the lifting effect when the leading edge is bent being brass. The bent edge will lift the drive gear upwards toward the dist. The spring is needed and very important to have installed.

I have seen this problem in the past......then again some engines w/o the spring ran okay....go figure.