TheSamba.com :: View topic - Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others?

Mon Dec 08, 2014 7:46 pm

raoul mitgong wrote: Hey 61scout, I like the gauge, makes trouble shooting things one step easier. Any worry about the it being the new weak point in your fuel system?
-d

Nah, I'm not concerned about it being a weak point... it will all seal up tight and from there really never move. Be wise to carry an extra plug in the tool box of course, but that gauge is designed specifically for fuel and permanent installation. It is indeed convenient for trouble shooting, but I'd still hook your shop gauge up for diagnostic work. Kinda like the difference between a tape measure and calipers, they both measure, but one is way more accurate and sensitive.

-Kevin

Sun Dec 14, 2014 12:35 pm

Assembled GoWesty fuel rails.....

Dave

Sun Mar 29, 2015 6:50 pm

My gowesty fuel rails, after maybe a month of actual use, have already started to weep slightly. I assembled them according to the directions and used the locktite..etc. they didnt leak or weep when i first installed them nor after the test runs. I checked them once every few trips to be sure. Now, today, they have a small amount of weepage around the end caps. I shoulda bought the van cafe version for a little more. They are leak tested. I put the plastic rails back on. They werent leaking anyway and they arent now. Next fuel line change, im switching to the van cafe version. The gowesty version is 60 bucks down the drain.

Sun Mar 29, 2015 7:07 pm

One of these on each side and four barb fittings, what's the big deal?
If you must have all four fittings point the same way, use ells on the ends.
http://www.amazon.com/Threaded-Ports-Connect-Manifold-Splitter/dp/B00AKVFMP2
Or this one and plug the ends.
http://www.amazon.com/Amico-Pneumatic-Manifold-Splitter-Turquoise/dp/B00843USU2

Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:14 pm

Before I tapped into this thread but very recently I chose the VanCafe ones because I did have some concern about the Gowesty ones potentially leaking in time. More money for sure but for me personally any threat at all of leakage ... well ... that's a real bad location for a leak. So, I traded more money for hopefully peace 'o mind.

Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:38 am

I just purchased the van-cafe version also, and they lowered the price to be competitive with GW for a pair.

VC: 1 threaded connection per rail, at the billet end cap. Total = 2

GW: 5 threaded connections per rail. Total = 10. Too many places that can leak for my comfort.

Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:36 am

Gowesty quickly agreed to refund my fuel rails. They are on their way back to the Golden State. Not opting to preassemble and pressure test them before selling them may have been a money issue for them or something. I would say that they are a risky purchase after this experience. Imagine if someone who doesnt obsess over their engine compartment burned up their van in my situation. I would have to say (in my opinion of course) that the vancafe rails are clearly the best and safest choice.

Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:48 pm

I replaced my rails with the gowesty rails. Did the locktite etc..

Only have driven van little since replacing ( other things needed worked on) and they are weeping from end cap..........
Not impressed at all.
Took off old ones as preventive only to find the new ones issue...

Have just sent them a email asking What they will do to address....

Looks like should of gone other route without the end plug....

Will put old ones back on

:( .........

Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:49 pm

They look nice and sturdy and like they will be perfect.

But the weakest link is Always an issue...........

Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:22 pm

imo, the Van Cafe design having less threaded joints is inherently safer, but it is not the best design.

I have a set, but have not installed them yet...

The problem with the V-C and GoW designs is that both retain the little stub hoses that connect the manifold to the injector.

Modern fuel rails have eliminated that weak link.

Further, there is still the seemingly superfluous fuel return line on each manifold. More rubber hose to overheat and potentially fail.

I am thinking that the best design is one that totally eliminates the half-assed elements and is not a manifold, but a TRUE fuel rail.

A fuel rail would connect directy to the injectors.
I would go a step farther and rout the fuel regulator out of the engine bay totally, and above the left wheel well to the left of the transmission area. That way if you get a leak, it won't be spraying all over the exhaust pipes.

And connect it all with teflon lines overbraided with stainless steel and AN fittings. Some 914 guys actually did this

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=82144

Tue Apr 21, 2015 12:22 am

leathersmyth wrote: I replaced my rails with the gowesty rails. Did the locktite etc..

Only have driven van little since replacing ( other things needed worked on) and they are weeping from end cap..........
Not impressed at all.
Took off old ones as preventive only to find the new ones issue...

Have just sent them a email asking What they will do to address....

Looks like should of gone other route without the end plug....

Will put old ones back on

:( .........

Well that makes 2 leaking from the same spot. 1 more and its a trend... :?

Wed Jun 17, 2015 4:18 pm

Does anyone have the injector spacing, and bolt hole retainer dimensions handy?

Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:48 am

I used GoWesty's fuel line kit, but went with Van Cafe's fuel rails:

Didn't like the idea of GW's screw-in fittings. :?

keithwwalker wrote: Does anyone have the injector spacing, and bolt hole retainer dimensions handy?

:x Had I seen ^that before the job, I would've taken some measurements!

Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:23 am

It's been about a year since the last post - is there any more feedback on the Gowesty fuel rails (good or bad)?

Fri Jun 10, 2016 1:02 pm

boy, if gowesty cant make a leak tight tapered pipe thread, what else cant they do right? this should not be rocket science, did they tap the threads too deep, not enough threads, failure to use pipe sealant or teflon tape??? Good grief, quailty control sure sucks.

the best solution i have found is to use the one piece type IV pipe type rails, no joints no leaks

see link... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1931939

The Machinist wrote: This sounds interesting. I searched for a picture of the 914 rails, but couldn't find one. I would like to see what they look like to see if I can improve the design on mine.

see the link above for a photo of the rail.

Fri Jun 10, 2016 1:33 pm

bluebus86 wrote: boy, if gowesty cant make a leak tight tapered pipe thread, what else cant they do right? this should not be rocket science, did they tap the threads too deep, not enough threads, failure to use pipe sealant or teflon tape??? Good grief, quailty control sure sucks.

The set I put on my van is right as rain. They come disassembled, so I would assume there is a good chance it is installer error if there is leaking.

Fri Jun 10, 2016 5:51 pm

I'm of course not saying i'm incapable of making an error, but I know I didn't. The threads on these things are pretty course. Go westy didn't even question the refund either. Im past waterboxer rails at this point now that im running an ej22.

Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:04 pm

t3 kopf wrote: I'm of course not saying i'm incapable of making an error, but I know I didn't. The threads on these things are pretty course. Go westy didn't even question the refund either. Im past waterboxer rails at this point now that im running an ej22.

pretty course threads? is the pitch different than the mating part? I would assume these are tapered pipe threads, either metric or american (NPT) maybe you tried to put a metric fitting in a NPT part or the otherway around? they wont seal properly if mixed up

how many threads are in the hole? does the fitting bottom out in the hole (ie run out of thread) if so that is what is wrong. tapping to deep or drilling to large a hole will make a poor seal for sure..

keithwwalker wrote: imo, the Van Cafe design having less threaded joints is inherently safer, but it is not the best design.

I have a set, but have not installed them yet...

The problem with the V-C and GoW designs is that both retain the little stub hoses that connect the manifold to the injector.

Modern fuel rails have eliminated that weak link.

Further, there is still the seemingly superfluous fuel return line on each manifold. More rubber hose to overheat and potentially fail.

I am thinking that the best design is one that totally eliminates the half-assed elements and is not a manifold, but a TRUE fuel rail.

A fuel rail would connect directy to the injectors.
I would go a step farther and rout the fuel regulator out of the engine bay totally, and above the left wheel well to the left of the transmission area. That way if you get a leak, it won't be spraying all over the exhaust pipes.

And connect it all with teflon lines overbraided with stainless steel and AN fittings. Some 914 guys actually did this

probelm i see with this design is if the rubber seal of the injector to manifold softens, or otherwise fails or if the bolt for the rail comes loose, or bracket bent, the thing could leak at the oring

Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:27 pm

bluebus86 wrote: boy, if gowesty cant make a leak tight tapered pipe thread, what else cant they do right? this should not be rocket science, did they tap the threads too deep, not enough threads, failure to use pipe sealant or teflon tape??? Good grief, quailty control sure sucks.

Considering GoWesty sends out their fuel rails disassembled, part of that quality control is put onto you, the buyer.

Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:38 pm

kamzcab86 wrote: bluebus86 wrote: boy, if gowesty cant make a leak tight tapered pipe thread, what else cant they do right? this should not be rocket science, did they tap the threads too deep, not enough threads, failure to use pipe sealant or teflon tape??? Good grief, quailty control sure sucks.

Considering GoWesty sends out their fuel rails disassembled, part of that quality control is put onto you, the buyer.

unless of course it is poorly machined or designed. I wonder what was meant when the poster siad the threads where course or something to that extent?????? does he mean they are the wrong pitch or the finish is too course as in rough?