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dereke
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 154
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 Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 11:22 am Post subject: daily driver |
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hi, im planning to build an engine : 78x90.5/ 9.1 cr / 42 x37 heads and engle 120 or fk8. do you think this engine will survive 100,000 miles before rebuilding it again? thanks
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67stang302
SBS Hit Squad
Joined: February 08, 2005
Posts: 1236
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| Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 11:55 am Post subject: |
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Same question multiple threads is frowned upon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=213303
I like the combo but that is just me
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67jason
Samba Member
Joined: August 28, 2005
Posts: 4741
Location: behind my back feet - Pittsburg CA
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| Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:23 pm Post subject: Re: daily driver |
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| dereke wrote: |
hi, im planning to build an engine : 78x90.5/ 9.1 cr / 42 x37 heads and engle 120 or fk8. do you think this engine will survive 100,000 miles before rebuilding it again? thanks
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if built right it should last over 100k, (though i personally would keep the cr at about 8:1-5 or so) but there are alot of factors that need to be addressed to make this happen. one of the most important things to do when building an engine like this is to balance, balance, balance all the rotating parts. not only does this help promote longer engine life it allows for a smoother running engine. also matching all the componets that you will use into a viable combo will help. but be aware though that the bottom end should last for quite a lot of milage, the heads most likely will need freshing up (and possibly the rings). this may happen at as little as 40 or 50k, but if it is a quality built engine it should go longer before needing any headwork.
i wouldnt expect a first time do-it-yourselfer or a mass produced engine from an engine "assembler" company (JCS, GEX and dozens of others out there) to last 80-100k+.
a 78x90.5 engine with fk-8 cam and some 1.4 rockers and some weber 44s is usually considered a decent daily driver engine when done right. perhaps you should contact any of the big time professional builders out there (there is a thread floating around here that lists some of the very best) and get them to either build your engine or to provide you with support so you can do it your self.
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dereke
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 154
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| Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 6:21 am Post subject: |
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| hi, thanks. will you give me an idea where to go? i mean best engine builder near in san diego? or serano's is a good choice also?thanks |
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Glenn 
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 80117
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 6:23 am Post subject: |
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It won't last 100k without needing some work.
Go with a milder cam, smaller valves and single springs and it might make it.
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vwracerdave
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004
Posts: 15602
Location: Deep in the 405
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| Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 8:36 am Post subject: |
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The largest daily driver engine I would build and expect to get 100,000 miles.
78X90.5 = 2007cc
40X35.5 valves with dual springs
Engle FK-7 cam
8.0:1 compression
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Bruce
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Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17639
Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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| vwracerdave wrote: |
The largest daily driver engine I would build and expect to get 100,000 miles.
78X90.5 = 2007cc
40X35.5 valves with dual springs
Engle FK-7 cam
8.0:1 compression |
I would agree with that. Engle W-120 and 8.5:1 too. |
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Mark898
Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Tecumseh, Michigan
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| Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2007 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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Hi I am building the same 2007cc combo. I have a few questions. I am having a problem picking a carb setup hpmx 40mm or 44mm kads with chokes. I have the fk7 already. Please help with cam gears straight cut or stock. Thanks this is the first time building an engine and posting.  |
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Bruce
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Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17639
Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2007 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Mark898 wrote: |
| Hi I am building the same 2007cc combo. I have a few questions. I am having a problem picking a carb setup hpmx 40mm or 44mm kads with chokes. I have the fk7 already. Please help with cam gears straight cut or stock. |
Neither. The build quality of the HPMX is crap, and dual singles don't make as much power as dual duals or have the driveability.
You are better off with Weber 40 IDFs or better yet, Dellorto 40 DRLAs.
Use stock cam gears, that is all you need. Spend the $100 you save on straight cut gears on a proper engine balancing job.
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craigman
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Joined: March 28, 2004
Posts: 2425
Location: redding
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| Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2007 7:32 pm Post subject: |
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I have to disagree.....
Kads are one of the MOST driveable carbs out there. Very easy to set up compared to a Dell or a Weber. Pretty much, set it and forget it! And their not as sensitive to altitude change as Webers or Dells.
I think most people will agree.
Now i will say that they will NOT make as much HP as a good set of Duals, but for the newbie you just can't beat them.
Just my $.02 worth.
Craig |
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Mark898
Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Tecumseh, Michigan
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| Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:56 am Post subject: |
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| Thx guys for your input. I have heard this before, but its always better to get info from one sorce. Have not anything about HPMX carbs this is the first thing negative about them. They cost save compared to Webers may not be justified. Going with Kads may be the easiest way togo. Intill I learn more about tunning. Right now learning about the engine build is taking all my time and it has been fun. I will use a stock cam gear. My heads have dual springs will that shorten the life of stock gear or my engine? I have HD cam bearings. Thank You |
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Randy in Maine
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Joined: August 03, 2003
Posts: 34890
Location: The Beach
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madmike
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Joined: July 11, 2005
Posts: 5300
Location: Atlanta,Michigan
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| Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 8:01 am Post subject: |
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| Hey Mark, Save your$ and go to the Lansing show u can Get Great deals on Real webers, I'd go with 44's and straght cuts,probably get both for the price of the HPMX's,Madmike |
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Mark898
Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Tecumseh, Michigan
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| Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 9:40 am Post subject: |
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Wow 
HPMX what a hunk of junk. My wife works in Ford factory and used to put throttle bodies togather. She was in shocked at the poor crafsmanship! "That would never pass inspection in our plant" and this is our chinese competition. I forgot about the swap in Lansing, I will wait to see if thier are any there. Thx for the reminder. |
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Bruce
Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17639
Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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| craigman wrote: |
Kads are one of the MOST driveable carbs out there. Very easy to set up compared to a Dell or a Weber. Pretty much, set it and forget it! And their not as sensitive to altitude change as Webers or Dells.
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I've owned both and driven both many thousands of miles. Kadrons are excellent carbs. Great for a 1600-1776-1835. But this question is for a 2 liter, and Kads will seriously strangle such a large engine.
If Kads were so great, why don't they idle on all 4 cylinders? It is a characteristic of the design of a small plenum feeding 2 cylinders. Weber IDFs or Dellorto DRLAs will fire perfectly at idle.
As for driveability, Having driven both Kads and Dell/Webers, the Dell/Webers are better.
Kads not as sensitive to altitude changes??? bull$hit. It all depends on what your existing A/F ratio is before you change altitude. Removing x% of the oxygen will affect the A/F ratio equally on any carburator. NO VW carburator can compensate for altitude changes.
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Mark898
Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Tecumseh, Michigan
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| Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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Whats Up, Bruce
I see your point about the strangle hold those kads will have. Just about every one I talk to tells me to go with Webers. I already have a pair on a motor thats going into a 69 912, but its not done. It was run in at the builders and they tuned it. The motor I am building now is for a 69 Bug for a daliy driver. There sure is alot of screws on those carbs. But you have convinced me to do the same. Kads seemed to be easier to tune, and have more room under the hood. I guess i will have to dig in and learn how to do it with Webers. I have a Tech Manual. I have another question? Thank you. What is the difference between 44 IDFs and dell 40 DRLAs. |
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Bruce
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Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17639
Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Mark898 wrote: |
| .... There sure is alot of screws on those carbs..... |
It is all those screws that allow you to more precisely calibrate the A/F ratio over the whole driving range. 10 screws on a Dell/Weber, 4 on Kads.
Weber 44s are available new, Dellortos are used. IMO Dellorto DRLA is superior to a Weber IDF.
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| overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
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ernyb
Samba Member
Joined: February 18, 2007
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Mark 898 or MadMike, when and where is the swap meet you referred to that will take place in Lansing? I live nearby and would be interested in attending. Thanks, Eric. |
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craigman
Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004
Posts: 2425
Location: redding
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| Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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Good luck using the Webers!
Great carbs, but will take a LOT of tuning!
Be sure to do a lot of searching on how to tune them. There are PLENTY here on the site!
Good luck and have fun! |
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evilangel
Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2007
Posts: 28
Location: Merida, Mexico
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| Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="Bruce"]
| craigman wrote: |
NO VW carburator can compensate for altitude changes. |
Late model mexi bugs could. their 34-pict 3 carb had an altimetric system based on vacuum. Though this wasn't inherent to the carb itself, it worked pretty well. Just FYI, not trying to hijack or anyhing..
As a matter of fact i'm also planning the 2007 setup, and find all this extremely helpful...
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