Bay Window Bus Buyers / Spotters Guide FAQ

[MrBreeze]

This will be a work in progress, please feel free to pm me with anything you wish to add.

From www.busdepot.com :
1968-1971 Bus & Westfalia Camper
The second generation of the Bus was introduced in 1968, and included a long list of mechanical and ergonomic improvements over the older Splitty (along with a new nose, which some people liked more and others less). The early years of the "bay window" bus used a Beetle drivetrain (1600cc upright motor, also referred to as Type 1). The advantage of this motor is that parts are very cheap and easily available. The drawback is that it's somewhat underpowered for such a heavy vehicle as a Westfalia camper, resulting in a slower top speed and reduced engine life as compared to later models. Of these years, '71 is the most desired because it has a more-powerful dual-port motor and power front disc brakes (although many earlier models get upgraded to dual-port along the way). The camper interior for these years was very functional, but basic compared to later models. It included an icebox, sink (with manual hand pump), a sofabed, a rear-facing passenger seat, and plenty of cabinetry. Options like stove and fridge were not yet available, and sleeping facilities were limited to two adults and two children (as opposed to the later models, which slept two adults in the poptop area rather than just one child). This interior layout was used until 1974 with only minor changes.

1972-1973 Bus & Westfalia Camper
These were the first years for VW's new "pancake" engine, originally developed for the commercially ill-fated Type 4 sedan and also used on the Porsche 914. (Outside of the U.S., the old Beetle engine remained an option until the early 1980's.) The Type 4 engine is considered by many to be VW's finest air-cooled motor, more powerful than the bug motor with no sacrifice in reliability or gas mileage. Also, many items can be serviced without removing the motor (heads, alternator, pushrod tubes, etc.) The new Type 4 drivetrain was to be refined over the years; these early versions had smaller engines (1700cc) and clutches than later versions, so the improvement over the earlier 1600cc versions was minimal.. The '72 lacks an engine hatch, making access to the new, larger motor difficult.

1974-1975 Bus & Westfalia Camper
By now VW was starting to optimize their Type 4 motor. Displacement was increased to 1800cc, and in '75, fuel injection and a larger clutch were fitted. The Westfalia interior, too, became more modern. The poptop was redesigned to fit a full double-bed up top rather than just a child's cot (now 4 adults could sleep comfortably). The front seats got headrests, the sink got a convenient electric pump, and more options were offered (fridge, gas stove, dual battery, etc.) These were the first years for the brightly colored plaid upholstery.

1976-1979 Bus & Westfalia Camper
These last years of the bus were its most modern. The motor was now at 2 liters, the biggest it would ever get (although horsepower stayed roughly the same as the 1.8). Also, in '78, it got hydraulic lifters, eliminating the need for valve adjustments. The camper interior was redesigned, and in fact resembles the version that would stay around straight through 1991. A much roomier layout was achieved by placing all the cabinetry behind the driver's seat, leaving open space behind the passenger seat (which now swiveled to face rear).

Shopping Tips for 1968-1979 Bus & Camper
Rust is the big problem with campers of this era, especially in snow prone areas (due to the use of road salt). Think very carefully before buying a rusty bus. Unlike a Bug, floor pans, fenders, etc. are not easily replaceable. Rust at the front axle beam is a common, and very expensive, problem. Also look for rust under the sliding door (can cause the door to fall off), inside the wheel wells, on the rocker panels, front floors, and steps by the front doors. Rust under the windshield seal is also common, but can be repaired without too much difficulty unless severe (although the windshield must be removed). The Type 4 motors tend toward valve seat failure if overheated. Make sure all four cylinders are running strong; take a closer look if one is weak. (One tight valve can also be a sign of a dropped seat.) Minor oil leaks are the norm; on a Type 4 motor, most can be repaired with the engine in place. Other common (but relatively minor) problems are horn, four-way flasher switch, gas guage, and electric sink pump failures. Also, be warned that the heater in a Bus is only marginally functional in below freezing weather (unless equipped with a gas heater).
- Thanks Ron @ www.busdepot.com for permission to reprint

[notchboy]

Everrett allowed this thread to be open to help explain all the camper manufactures and variations.

It seems there is a new camper ID qustion posted every other day. Here is everyones chance to get it all posted in one place.

Let's start with the most common first.

Westfalia Campers 68-79. Please post any pics, buyers guide tips, variations and stock colors.
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[Mal evolent]

Link to the timeline:

Bay window timeline

Why I only looked at a '73 or later bus:

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73 Beetle Baja, Ghia front brakes, Type 3 rear brakes, 2220 ( 94 X 80 ), Weber Progressive, Bosch SVDA, '97 Mustang seats

Baja Bugs for Volkswagen Virgins: Index

[bay window dude]

ummmmm.... that timeline is wrong....
i know that-
1972 had an alternator
1971 had oval tail lights
and
1973 had the turn signals up high, not down low
thats all that i noticed... there may be more, i don't know...
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1972 Westfalia Weekender - Sold
1965 Chevrolet Corvair Convertible - 110 PG - Sold
1970 Westfalia Weekender

[notchboy]

vw76westy wrote:
68-many expensive one year only parts
but all these parts give it a real nice look

69-70 still have the wide 5 lugs & drums in the front

71 last year type 1 first year disc brakes
71 last year with round brake lights & seperate reverse lights

72 everything is one year only(just about), expensive & hard to find
72 first year with a type-4 engine last year with rounded bumpers
also the first year with the ugly ass large brake/turn/reverse lights in the back

73-up have the square like bumpers & front turn signals that are above the head lights
75-up are fuel injected(72-74 have dual carbs)
76-up have a stock 2.0 motor (72-73 are 1700 74-75 are 1800)
camper interiors........
68-71 top pops up in the back & has cots (not safe for children)
72 same but different color
73 simular top pops up in the front (still has cots on top)
74-up top pops up in the front & has a bed that can sleep 2 adults
74-75 the set up is different from a 68-73
76-79 has a different layout again

74 ca automatic was the first year & model with fi
75 all buses were fi


if you want it lowered, look for one that is already lowered
this is not a bug,most people get sticker shock when they see the cost
to properly lower a bus

read up on the sticky for lowering a bay
in order to avoid hack lowering jobs

what you need to decide is type-1 or type-4
if you decide on a type-4 then carbs or fi

wide 5 or disc brakes
early or late style bumpers & tail lights

in the end it wont matter because
you dont find the bus you want
the bus finds you

Thanks guys this was awesome info
and vw76Westy this would be great if the Mods stickied for the noobs to this forum, that was the info I was really lookin for.

73 and up had the frame outriggers underneeth the forward floor, rectangular bumpers and a crush zone in front.

I say find a basket case and make it your own. If you completely destroy it then no one can complain. It worked for me.
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[Tri-Bus]

68-72 Westy interiors mustard colored vinyl, 73 mustard colored cloth
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73 Westy

A VW team with a triathlon problem, or something like that....

[orange bus Bob]

disclaimer: the following describes the way these busses came from the factory, may have been changed by the previous owner. May not apply to other than busses built for the american market

73 is the last year for a gas filler door, the slider lock in the handle, and the lever type front door locks. 74 and later have an exposed gas cap, the slider lock below the handle, and lock knobs on top of the doors.

Although they look the same, 68-71 rear hatches do not interchange with 72-79 because the hinge mounting is different

68 thru 74 westies have the table hinged to the wall, 75 and later have the separate table and L leg, even though the 75 cabinets are similar to the 74.

Steering wheel shaft size changed in mid 74, early and late steering wheels do not interchange

76 and earlier seats do not interchange with 77 and later, the mounting tracks are different. Vanagon seats will fit in a 77 and later

76 and earlier front doors use an allen head mounting screw, 77-79 use a hex head bolt. they do not interchange.

72-75 had a simple heater box and muffler system, similar to a bug but with bigger parts. 76-78 had a more complicated system with u-turns and many more pieces, some of which are NLA. 72-75 system will fit if you have all the parts and the matching tin. 79 is similar layout to 72-75 but has different flanges at the head so does not interchange with other years

[Bisbeetle]

What year did the gas filler move farther back, to clear the sliding door? Was it the same time as they lost the cover flap? Or were there filler ports farther aft that had the flap?

[busdaddy]

[charley_alford]

@Mal evolent thanks for the detailed table..it is of great help

[homeslice007]

I am a newbie and explaining some points about the years really helps in my decision to pursue even looking for a vintage VW!

[STELLA68]

seems to me that this thread is labled a bit of a misnomer:
BayWindow Buyers Guide?

good compilation of info for type designation and differentiation:
maybe, BayWindow Field Guide?

or BaySpotting 101

point is, I think a comprenhensive thread showing:
exactly what to look for in a Bay;
recognising hacks;
how to roadtest a Bay;
guidelines on fair pricing;
the serious pitfalls of buying on lowest price alone;

etc. etc..

that would be the kind of thread I wish I read before making the jump on a first ACVW.. in all the 'hindsight' reading I've done on this excellent site it seems I picked a good one.

it would be an excellent resource for the conversant or the Noob alike.

what think you?

[Kursive]

Agreed. Here's some noob tips of my own for the sake of congruency..

1. Take someone who knows what they are doing.
2. Hope they know what they are doing.

[Chris Blackwell]

My son and I have been working on a 1969 panel for about four years. One of the first things we did after towing it home was purchase new brake parts. Imagine our surprise when we pulled the front wheels and discovered disc brakes. We reordered pads and parts for a 71. Was this the result of an earlier conversion or did some panels come with disc brakes? It also has 71-79 five lug rims with the round holes.
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71 Bultaco
59 Chevy Apache
69 Transporter
67 Beetle

[barefootwestie]

[mik0002]

Can anyone tell me what the differences are, if any, between the Westfalia pop tops from 1968 - 1973? Are they interchangeable or will they require modification? I have a '73 and am looking to put another pop top on it because the one I have is in bad shape. They all look and function about the same it seems, but I don't want to buy an earlier one if it's not going to go on easily. Any help is appreciated. Thanks.

[nathansnathan]

The wheel arches haven't been mentioned and have a big effect on the character of a bus.
early front and rear

The rears got bigger in 71

and the fronts got a lip in 72 on.

The earlies are kind of classic-looking, 60's-style. The later ones, a honkin' 70's style.

Also of note when considering year,
68-71 buses are female.
72 buses are hermaphrodites.
73-79 buses are male.

[hill]

Thanks to everyone who contributed detail for this thread. It focused my search for my next bus to a post-1972 model because of the front collision protecting structural changes and brought me to hope to find one with the camp equipment installed in the left side, though I'd have done without that feature if the bus spoke to me.

Yesterday I sent off a bank check for a beautiful '78 deluxe campmobile and am more excited than is befitting a person of my advanced years! I can hardly wait for it's arrival, and even sprung for enclosed shipment to keep my bus from harm in sandstorms as it rumbled along through the Texas badlands... [/img]

[Stuartzickefoose]

did you even look at it before you bought it? congrats!
_________________
Stuart Zickefoose

2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual

206-841-7324
[email protected]

[hill]