Syncro Conversion - 3.3L (Seattle, WA)

[wwVanayakagon]

Ok everyone out there... I did the search and did not find what I am looking for exactly. Maybe I did not dig deep enough, don't choke me for re-posting a covered subject if I am

First Time Poster here. I have owned Vanagon's since I was 17 and had No idea this forum existed. I am glad I found it. Why?

I just bought a 1986 Syncro van after getting my old 1981 van stuck so many times. I bought it locally and less than one month after my purchase, Boom Engine throws a rod.

Correct me if I am wrong but I am looking at 4-5k locally for a rebuild and on here I am reading that conversions can be done for 6-8k.

That is a no brainer. I have to have a new engine so why not invest now. I started calling around and I could not find a single place around seattle that was in this price range.

The shops I called around here were 10k + and that is with you providing the engine. I am I off somewhere. Help me out. Here is what I know. I have never done conversion pricing or research. I have a nice syncro that I love and am willing to invest into, but not for that amount.

What should the Pricing be for a 3.3 l conversion around seattle, wa?
What should the Pricing be for a standard re-build around seattle, wa?
What shops are recommended for the conversions?

Any help is appreciated. I need to get this van back to life. It kills me looking into the front yard and seeing this every day.

[r39o]

What does http://www.smallcar.com want?
Did you try the yahoo groups subaru-vanagon list?
I don't know of pricing much, because I have only centered on the Ej22.
The labor (no parts) here in San Diego to do a EJ22 is $3K.

BTW: Your picture shows me why you blew an engine!!!
_________________
"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)

[tsombrero1]

I think $6K would be a "do it yourself" price for a 3.3 (SVX) conversion... tho you could get it down to $4-5K if you found a deal on an engine. The 2.2 conversion is much easier than the SVX. There is a yahoo group for people doing this, google around for "subaru vanagon" and you'll find all kinds of stuff.

I was in your position 6 months ago and opted to get my 2.1 rebuilt at Wolfsburg MW in Ballard because I don't have the space to do the job (Subaru or otherwise) myself. If I had a garage to park in for 6 months, well, I'd totally do the SVX thing.

I'm happy with the rebuild. As best I can tell, they do first-class work at Wolfsburg.
_________________
Tennessee Sombrero

1988 Westy, Syncro-nated
2003 Aprilia Caponord (now with Jif)
Atari 2600
1970 Earthbound Humanoid

[Christopher Schimke]

Small Car gets $8950 plus the cost of the motor to do the conversion. If you add up the bits that they sell to do the installation, they roughly come out to about $3300 not including cruise control or air conditioning bits. So if you spend $2000 on a motor (easily doable), $3300 on known parts and figure $500-1000 on incidentals, you could do it yourself for around $6000 more or less depending on your motor cost and the incidentals.

Do you have the capability to do the conversion yourself?
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[tds3pete]

Tell me about the van.

I sold my white synchro here in Seattle about 7 years ago. I was the 2nd owner, and it was originally purchased new in Bellevue.

I am just curious if you bought mine. If so, I could give you some history.

Best of luck with the new engine.

Pete
_________________
'58 Westy camper-come and gone
'73 Westy-bought new in Holland,now gone
'86 Syncro weekender-come and gone
'79 Westy...Oscar
'95 Eurovan Camper/5 spd...Marsha Mellow

[klucz]

Might as well factor in bigger brakes too.

[ratfarmer_vw]

Or, you can always pick up another VW engine from someone that has done or is about to do a Subaru conversion.

I am still working on my conversion here and there.

[psych-illogical]

As others have indicated, the $6-8K you've heard is more in line with the do-it-yourself approach. Add shop labor if you don't have the know how or shop space and $9 or 10K is probably about right. Best of luck.
_________________
83 1/2 Westy waterboxer
'57 Beetle-sold
Coupla '81 BMW motorcycles (R80G/S; R100RS)
'96 BMW R1100GS

[Fox]

Northwest Connecting Rod is the best in Seattle as far as rebuilding your current engine.

[Raynor Shine]

Dude- small car conversion price is fair considering the work involved & it will be done right. I still call them for advice.

After mine was completed, my guy told me based on the work they had to do, it would easily be a 10K conversion with the engine. What I found is it's not the engine itself or the install, its all the hoses, lines, harness, ps, oil pumps/ gaskets that made the price jump.

however, now that its in, I could never go back!

[lagomorph]

I'd be willing to take on the conversion.
I live near small car in Tacoma, and have a shop space large enough to fit the van.
My labor would be less than small car, but it would take me a little longer, as I'd be doing it in my evenings/weekends.
I've got plenty of swaps under my belt, just not vanagon ones.

[wwVanayakagon]

Thanks for the feedback everyone...

tds3pete, I bought the Van from a couple in seattle who bought it from the 2nd owner. I am pretty sure this is your van. Most of the maint. was done in Bellevue and around the local area, I think there were some repairs in there from the other side of the mountains too. I will dig through the records when I get home and tell you the names and dates of some of the repairs so you can see if it is yours.

As for the do it myself approach... I am not to scarred of ripping into projects over my head, although they seem to drag out when I just jump in without research. I pulled and installed a few 1.9l engines when i was a teenager but never broke the block to do the re-build myself. The only reason I am not interested in doing it right now, is because I am starting a new business and Time is what I am lacking right now, well a little money would be nice too

So long story short... I might just let her sit in the front yard for a month or two until I scrap together the cash to have either the engine re-built or a conversion done. I have like 4k right now to make repairs with but I kind of want to wait and see if I can save enough for a conversion which would just be soo nice.

Lagomorph: Although I would be stoked to save a buck on the job, I don't want to risk being the Guinea Pig. I have a buddy that has done a few engine conversions on cars, and he told me about his conversion experience on his Vanagon and how different it was. Apparently none of his prior conversions prepared him for the wiring adventure on the harness and lines that required modification. If you think you are really up to it, shoot me an email and lets talk turkey, but you are going to have to wow me with your knowledge of this process because I don't want just anyone wrenching on my little paddleCat.

[tencentlife]

As far as rebuilding the current motor goes, you may not have much to work with if it chucked a rod. Better make sure it hasn't opened a hole in the case as they usually do. Crank may or may not be reusable either.

[wwVanayakagon]

Thanks for that Heads Up Tencent, Of course to bad for me, there is a nice big fat gaaping hole in the case. bumdilly

I wish I would have spent more time checking this puppy out, but hey a 3k syncro aint that bad right.... Don't answer that... nobody. I already have a wife that is freakin out over this whole transaction.. Less than a month old ... Merry Christmas

So this is the reason for the conversion discussion... I figure If I have to buy a whole new 2.1l I might as well screw that and go for the big boy right?

I thought it would only be a little more but upon investigation, reading your responses, and a 1/5th of Black Strap, I now realize that I am kinda screwed.

Looks like she might be sitting in the front for a while...

[atarasi]

Hey neighbor, if you're looking for a decent 2.1 core to rebuild, let me know.

[mr_vanagon]

[wwVanayakagon]

I have read up and talked to a few VR6 converts and although it looks nice, the oil pan sits rather low for the syncro and the available modification's do not look as perfected as the Oil Pan mod for the 3.3 and 2.2 subie's ...

I could be way off but that was my initial impression.

atarasi - I am almost positive that I am not going to look for a 2.1 to re-build. It just seems like the pricing for that is only about 2-3k less than a conversion and I would gladly spend the extra cash for the added performance and reliability. However if for some reason I can't find a block and I am in a pinch I will keep your name on hand. Thanks for the offer, just so I know, what year was the 2.1 out of ... Mileage on block? Number of Rebuilds? Current Condition?

Unfortunatly there is another issue on the van that I was well aware of prior to the purchase, I just had no idea the engine was on the brink. There was no knocks, leakage, or signs of problems, but that all could have been concealed with a little cleaning...

The one thing I knew was bad was that the Drive Line needed to be balanced or re-built, and that is still an issue that I am going to have to resolve once I get her up and running. This is my first Syncro so I am sure hoping the the viscous coupling is in good condition since I have zero experience with that area of the van. Other than that the standard Vanagon stuff I am used to from my past van's and she is in pretty good condition. There is a little rust on the rain gutter and a little spot on the rear fender but I can fix those areas on my own.

Here to hoping I can get my paddleCat back up and running soon

[r39o]

For me, there are a few reasons I prefer the Suby. To the point, though, any of the VW conversions that utilize the an upright engine add two things I find not so good. One is that big lump of cast iron back there. It adds weight and thermal mass. Two are all the expensive and hard to find hoses.

Now, I am the first to say a VW engine in a VW is a good thing, but there are just so many points of concern that I am just all turned off to the idea anymore. In my case there will only be a few Vanagon specific hoses left in the van and the rest are common strait pieces or readily available, inexpensive others. Plus no (or little) plastic doo-dads in the system. I sure am liking using stainless piping. I hope that is not a mistake, but it sure seems bulletproof. Also, we ditch some of the more common little failure items out of the picture.

Yes I am a convert. I have seen the Suby in action for over 6 reliable years. The state of the art of the conversion rises from day to day. The SVX and EJ22/EJ25 are practically a bolt in these days. You do a few PM related things to the basic engine and it is good for a long time after that. Ya, I know, some people blow their Subys up too, but that is infrequent. When was the last time you heard someone had to replace their Suby heads for example?

Thanks for the read.....
_________________
"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)

[elwood91]

[Christopher Schimke]

I would agree with the N/A Subaru 2.5 having head gasket problems (although there is enough evidence that my agreement probably isn't necesary). However, the 2.2, 3.3 and (so far) the 3.0 are pretty close to bullet proof.

Check out this site on the 2.5 head gasket deal.

http://users.sisna.com/ignatius/subaru/headgasket.html
_________________
"Sometimes you have to build a box to think outside of." - Bruce (not Springsteen)

*Custom wheel hardware for Audi/VW, Porsche and Mercedes wheels - Urethane Suspension Bushings*
T3Technique.com or contact me at [email protected]