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crankshaft dimensions
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caslor
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:03 am    Post subject: crankshaft dimensions Reply with quote

ok here is one question that i want to made, as i dont know-find the correct meaning of the word '' lapped ''

i have measure an old crankshaft i had in order to use it in my low cost 1600cc engine.

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in my bentley manual says that the dimensions i take with my micrometer is in the 1st undersize and are in in lapped chart.

i wish i could use the crankshaft without machine work as this would reduce the cost.

lapped = the final measure before need undersize

or

lapped = need undersize when you reach this measure


(again sorry for my english )
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Dale M.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My calculations seem to indicate your crank has been reground .010th (.254mm) undersize on main and rod bearings....

Standard rod journals are 2.1644 to 2.1653 (54.98 to 55.00)

Standard mains 1 through 3, 2.1640 to 2.1648 ( 54.97 to 54.99)

Standard main #4, 1.5739 to 1.5748 ( 39.98 to 40.00)

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Nater
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Compliments of Lazy8Parts:



1200cc-1600cc Crankshaft & Bearing Information (May 1960 On)



Std. Rod Journal = 2.164"

The Crankshaft Main Bearing Journal closest to the Flywheel is Journal # 1 and is the Thrust Bearing.



Std. Main Journals # 1, # 2, & # 3 = 2.164"

Std. Main Journal # 4 = 1.574"



Journal Bearings # 1 & 4 are one piece and install on the Crankshaft

Journal Bearings # 2 & 3 are two piece and install in the case halves



To determine if a 1200cc/1600cc case has been align bored, measure the outside diameter of the rear main bearing shell:

If the case is Std. The dia = 2.559"

If the case has been bored + .020" The dia = 2.579"

If the case has been bored + .040" The dia = 2.599"

If the case has been bored + .060" The dia = 2.619"

If the case has been bored + .080" The dia = 2.639"



If you donít have the one piece Rear Main Bearing Shell, you can measure the thickness of one of the # 2 or # 3 Main bearing Halves.

(To use this method, you have to know if the Crankshaft the bearing came from is: Std., .010", .020", etc. & adjust the following dimensions accordingly).



If the Crankshaft is Std. The thickness of the # 2 or # 3

Bearing shell Half in a Standard Case = .2065"

If the case has been bored + .020" The Shell measures .2075"

If the case has been bored + .040" The Shell measures .2085"

If the case has been bored + .060" The Shell measures .2095"

If the case has been bored + .080" The Shell measures .2105"



To determine if a 1200cc/1600cc case thrust has been cut, measure the width of the Case Rear Main Bearing Saddle:

If the Thrust Bearing is Std. The Width = 0.8655"

If the Thrust Bearing is - .040" The Width = 0.8255"

If the Thrust Bearing is - .080" The Width = 0.7855"



If you are trying to determine what oversize bearings to get for a crankshaft and don't have immediate access to the case, but have the old crankshaft complete with bearings, you can easily determine if a 1200cc/1600cc case thrust has been cut, by measuring the Thickness of the "Outer" Rear Main Bearing Thrust Flange:

If the thrust is Std.

The Outer Rear Thrust Flange thickness is 0.0965"



If the thrust has been cut to -.040"

The Outer Rear Thrust Flange thickness is 0.1365"



If the thrust has been cut to -.080"

The Outer Rear Thrust Flange thickness is 0.1765"
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caslor
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

my question is if i can use the crankshaft with the dimension i measure with new bearing sets without grinding ...

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


i know that my crankshaft is in the first undersize and has 2 more...
also i know that my engine case has no more undersize left.... is in the forth undersize...

the word ''lapped'' in the chart above is the maximum wear that the crankshaft should have before regrinding again to the next undersize level ???

if someone could explain me the word '' lapped '' ....

thanks
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got "Plastigage"?

Specs are pretty good.... Plastigage and trial assembly will be final judge on if things are "good"...

http://engineparts.com/motorhead/techstuff/brgclear.html

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caslor
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes i have bought on ebay before some months 3 package of green plastigage Wink

i couldn find no one here in my country to sell them..

- so i can test with plastigage the rod bearings and the one main bearing (the other cant be test with plastigage as are in one shape ... right? )

-as far as i know a measure of 002'' is the best .. right?

-anything more or less will be bad right?

the main bearings and rod bearings will be new (forget to tell that sorry )
thanks and for the link
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1432
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nater,
these numbers can't be right, is this the way they are written in your manual?


if the Crankshaft is Std. The thickness of the # 2 or # 3

Bearing shell Half in a Standard Case = .2065"

If the case has been bored + .020" The Shell measures .2075"

If the case has been bored + .040" The Shell measures .2085"

If the case has been bored + .060" The Shell measures .2095"

If the case has been bored + .080" The Shell measures .2105"
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caslor
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you see in the pictures.. they are from official service manual (1966-1969)
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1432
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

caslor,

The picture only gives diameters, nothing is shown on bearing shell thickness.
The numbers given show only .001" gain in thickness for every .020" increase in main bore diameter--- clearly wrong, just curious as to whether this is in print somewhere or just a mistake in posting.
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caslor
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

this pictures taken from :

''VOLKSWAGEN
OFFICIAL SERVICE MANUAL
SUPER BEETLE,BEETLE & KARMAN GHIA 1966,19667,1968,1969

BENTLEY PUBLISHERS''

as i cant understand well the technical words in order to see if i can use the crankshaft as it is.. i will go to a machine shop to examine and 99% regriding it Sad
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Problem seems to be data on this site....

http://lazy8parts.com/air_4_crankshaft_spec.htm

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caslor
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dale M. wrote:
Problem seems to be data on this site....
http://lazy8parts.com/air_4_crankshaft_spec.htm
Dale


nice site but is not that i need...
i know in what condition is my crank case...

i just want to see if the crankshaft... only the crank shaft.. is ok to use it without regriding it !!

the crankshaft is from an other engine so cant use the method of measure the thickness of bearings...

i dont think that machine shops measure like that the crank shaft to determine if must regrind or not...

i think this is the method that are using....

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caslor
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PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 4:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

here is something from the past Smile

Because i never take an answer that could understand (sorry but sometimes speaking a different language has that problems Smile )


so here i am asking something in theory,,,,

lets say that we have a crankshaft that is in the standard dimension and we want to determine if we need to get it for a regrinding or not

the standard main journal for # 1 is = 2.164" ok?

what is the tolerance for this measurement ?
what is the limit before we send the crankshaft for regrinding ?? or that is the limit and any number smaller than that is out of specification ??
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