| Author |
Message |
david_594
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2006
Posts: 484
Location: Columbus, OH
|
 Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 3:00 pm Post subject: Megajolt DIY Programmable Ignition Install on a type1 |
 |
|
So for those who don't know, Megajolt is a DIY programmable crank fired ignition system which uses Ford EDIS ignition components used on many of their vehicles from the 1990's. Megajolt gives you a 10x10 ignition map to work with. One axis being the RPM range of the motor, and the other being either a TPS value or vacuum(boost signal) via a 2.5bar map sensor.
The kit I am using is is the Megajolt Lite Jr. V4.0 with vacuum control. This unit is the programmable controller that you build yourself. Beyond that I picked up the EDIS control module and ignition coil used off ebay for relatively litte money.
In a Ford, the ignition is timed off the crank via a 36-1 tooth wheel mounted on the crank. The pulley would normally have 36 teeth with 1 tooth missing at 90 degrees BTDC which is used to time the ignition even. Coping the idea of someone who came before me, I modified a heavyweight 5# steel pulley to simulate the teeth. What I did was a drill a hole every 10 degrees on the outer edge of the pulley such that the material left between the holes would function as the pulley teeth.
In the image you can see the holes at every 10 degrees and at about 2 o'clock you see the two connected holes to create the "missing tooth." The missing tooth was actually placed at 110 degrees BTDC so pickup could be placed at a 20 degree angle to avoid interfering with the generator pulley.
And then today I finally finished up the mount for the VR sensor:
Gallery link
Now all thats left is a bunch of wiring and finding a good mounting location for the coil and control modules.
Haven't gotten this far yet, but I figure my ignition curve will look something like this:
_________________
1968 westy weekender
2000 jetta tdi
79 vespa p200e |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
El_Güero
Samba Member
Joined: August 02, 2006
Posts: 573
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 5:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
how about a fan belt  ?? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
RatCamper
Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2008
Posts: 3305
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| El_Güero wrote: |
| how about a fan belt ?? |
Looks like that some major thick V belt pulley. I can see what looks like a groove at the back.
The pulley looks a lot less intimidating than the Ford cogwheel sensor disc.
this is very interesting and something I may play with one day. DIY is the only way I go 
_________________
Vehicle: 1975 Special order delivery walkthrough panel based pop-top camper (LCA / Sunliner). Motor: Nippon 1.8L Single port Wasserboxer, Transmission: 3 rib 002. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
david_594
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2006
Posts: 484
Location: Columbus, OH
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 3:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
So after a couple more months I am finally back to working on this.
Picked up some new EDIS plug wires from a 1990 v6 ranger to use with my setup and will hopefully finish fabbing up my mount for the ford ignition coil. Along with some replacement spark plugs that weren't missing the little screw on tip so they will actually work with the ford wires.
I'm trying to make my bracket such that it will mount to the stock holes in the shroud where the original coil was hooked up. After that all that will really be left is getting some shielded wire to connect the devices and finding a mounting point for the EDIS control module and the programmable megajolt module.
_________________
1968 westy weekender
2000 jetta tdi
79 vespa p200e |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
RatCamper
Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2008
Posts: 3305
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 4:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Sweet. I couldn't remember the name of this EDIS. Glad the thread came back. Seems like a great way of sidestepping a lot of issues. If it or something like it has hot-switchable maps via the state of an input I'm pretty much sold. It'd be a great way of avoiding the primary issue of running a dual fuel setup.
_________________
Vehicle: 1975 Special order delivery walkthrough panel based pop-top camper (LCA / Sunliner). Motor: Nippon 1.8L Single port Wasserboxer, Transmission: 3 rib 002. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ned
Samba Member
Joined: June 28, 2004
Posts: 1574
Location: Arroyo Grande Ca.
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 4:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I am curious as to what end this whole thing creates. It seems that you have taken something simple and made it complicated?
Or am I missing it? Ever heard of Rube Goldberg?  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
RatCamper
Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2008
Posts: 3305
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 4:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ned wrote: |
I am curious as to what end this whole thing creates. It seems that you have taken something simple and made it complicated?
Or am I missing it? Ever heard of Rube Goldberg? |
You missed it. I know it doesn't seem it but it's taking something complicated and making it simple.
What we have here is an Electronic Distributorless Ignition System.
It eliminates the distributor, so no vac advance, no mech advance weights, no points, no rotor, no distributor cap.
What we are left with is something which doesn't suffer from mechanical issues like timing scatter, lag and hysteresis in advance, points wear, electrical losses via the rotor, timing drift etc.
It is also easy to set the advance curve you want without needing to fiddle with weights, springs and ported vacuum.
Unless you count the timing wheel (or drilled pulley in this case) there are no moving parts in the ignition system.
_________________
Vehicle: 1975 Special order delivery walkthrough panel based pop-top camper (LCA / Sunliner). Motor: Nippon 1.8L Single port Wasserboxer, Transmission: 3 rib 002. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
david_594
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2006
Posts: 484
Location: Columbus, OH
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 6:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ned wrote: |
I am curious as to what end this whole thing creates. It seems that you have taken something simple and made it complicated?
Or am I missing it? Ever heard of Rube Goldberg? |
The stock distributor that tries to accomplish its magic via springs, swinging weights, and vacuum diaphragms would surely win out in the rube goldberg category.
As ratcamper said, this device does timing with zero moving parts, accurately, subject to no wear, with a modern coil setup, and while being fully adjustable based on vacuum(load) and RPM's. It benefits from 25+ years of innovation in ignition system technology compared to the stock setup. It also has dual mapping capability that can be manually changed on the fly via a switch, or automatically based on a sensor input(temp sensor probably being most common).
Tonights pictures:
So this is what came off:
And this got mounted up:
Used a 3/4" x 1/8" piece of angle iron cut to length and drilled so it can be attached to the stock coil mounting holes. Then welded on 2 bolts point straight out, that the ford coil slides on over allowing it to be secured in place.
Plugs got replaced with some new NGK B7HS because I needed someone with the little screw on caps still in place. Plug wires were Autolites(from advance auto parts) originally for a 1990 v6 4.0 ford ranger (so I have 2 extra). I was going to get wires for a 4 cylinder escort, but no one had them in stock and these were only $3 more.
Next step is to get some shielded wire to connect the VR sensor to the EDIS controller, and then wiring that to the coil. Without the megajolt wire in, it will run in a limp mode at a fixed 10 degrees BTDC so I should at least be able to start it.
_________________
1968 westy weekender
2000 jetta tdi
79 vespa p200e |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 52269
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 7:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| I think the Borg have taken over your engine. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ned
Samba Member
Joined: June 28, 2004
Posts: 1574
Location: Arroyo Grande Ca.
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 10:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| OK I guess I did miss it. Good luck. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jim Bear
Samba Member
Joined: March 25, 2006
Posts: 670
Location: Watkinsville, GA
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:52 am Post subject: curiosity |
|
|
I am curious to see what others have to say about this. I would have thought some of the heavy hitters would have a comment or two. Or, is this just a new idea that is too far from stock to be considered? I have only a slight working knowledge of the mechanics and/or physics involved in the ignition process and would be interested to hear what others say...
_________________
"You're either on the bus, or you're off the bus." ~kk
'85 Vanagon Westy - George In the Stable 2020-?/'74 Weekender - Ophelia In the Stable 2007- ?/'69 Beetle Convertible - SOLD 2017-2020/'67 Beetle - September SOLD 2013-2016  /'67 SO42 Westy - Sage SOLD 1996-2001 /'69 Transporter - Baby Blue SOLD 1995-1995/'72 Westy - Nelly - SOLD 1990-1995--STOP FRACKING |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jeff Geisen
Samba Chaplain
Joined: December 21, 2004
Posts: 1928
Location: N.W. Georgia
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
... I am far from a heavy hitter, however I will comment. That ignition looks expensive an a bit difficult to get repair bits for at the local F.L.A.P.S.
That is an impressive lookin' system, though.
I'll just continue to dance with the one what brought me...
(Ya may wanna hold onto those "old" parts, bro)
_________________
I Corinthians 4: 1 thru 5
‘63 ragtop - ‘68 single cab
Last edited by Jeff Geisen on Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:35 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 52269
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
It would be nice to have a programmable timing set up, verses dealing with a pile of springs, weights and vacuum diaphragms which very few of us have. Don't know if you could change the timing while the engine was going down the road or on a dyno, but that would allow from quick easy comparisons of power, engine vacuum, head temps, etc.
Kind of a cool way to do it with just drilling the correct size holes to duplicate the teeth, but still looks Borgish to me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
david_594
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2006
Posts: 484
Location: Columbus, OH
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Jeff Geisen wrote: |
| ... I am far from a heavy hitter, however I will comment. That ignition looks expensive an a bit difficult to get repair bits for at the local F.L.A.P.S. |
All told, the install should cost me a bit under $200 in total. And outside of the programmable controller, the EDIS controller and the ignition coil are both readily available at local auto parts places. They were used on 4 cylinder fords from 1990-1993 and v8 fords from 1990-1997.
_________________
1968 westy weekender
2000 jetta tdi
79 vespa p200e |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jeff Geisen
Samba Chaplain
Joined: December 21, 2004
Posts: 1928
Location: N.W. Georgia
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
... right on.
_________________
I Corinthians 4: 1 thru 5
‘63 ragtop - ‘68 single cab |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dragonbyu
Samba Member
Joined: November 27, 2005
Posts: 127
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 1:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| I really like the idea of this and have been researching it for a bit now. My only concern for the way you drilled the pulley is that you haven't chamferd the holes you drillled. It looks like you have a burr around the holes which could potentially tear up your belt. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
david_594
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2006
Posts: 484
Location: Columbus, OH
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 1:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| dragonbyu wrote: |
| I really like the idea of this and have been researching it for a bit now. My only concern for the way you drilled the pulley is that you haven't chamferd the holes you drillled. It looks like you have a burr around the holes which could potentially tear up your belt. |
Here is a better picture of the pulley:
Makes it a little more clear how the pulley is shaped, and that the the groove for the belt is completely untouched by the holes.
_________________
1968 westy weekender
2000 jetta tdi
79 vespa p200e |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
VWDruid
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2008
Posts: 1192
Location: Boca de Ratones FL
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 2:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
for $25 on ebay you can get the EDIS 4 shipped.
the megajolt is the most costly part of the setup $160
that equalizer pulley with the holes drilled in to it, is a cool idea but I would have had it all balanced.
I have read a few sites and you can run this thing on any thing with a crank pulley.
http://nwdubproject.org/blog/diy/edis-for-acvw/
_________________
70 Westy, 2027cc "dual DRLA 40 m140 i55 wjdoc a165 p33 v30 "w100 straight cut 040 polished heads 1.25 rockers 1.5 A1sidewinder supertrapp muffler trans 091 coil SUM-850500 CDI universal svda Pertronix
http://www.storyofstuff.com/
It's not the straight cut gears It's the T.A.R.D.I.S. engine.
wanted Chameleon Circuit |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
david_594
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2006
Posts: 484
Location: Columbus, OH
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 3:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| VWDruid wrote: |
for $25 on ebay you can get the EDIS 4 shipped.
the megajolt is the most costly part of the setup $160
that equalizer pulley with the holes drilled in to it, is a cool idea but I would have had it all balanced.
I have read a few sites and you can run this thing on any thing with a crank pulley.
http://nwdubproject.org/blog/diy/edis-for-acvw/ |
You used to be able to buy the megajolt as a DIY kit that you soldered together yourself for only $90. Unfortunate its no longer available, as it was an easy assembly.
I thought about having the pulley balanced, but for the RPM's my bus is running, I doubted it would be much of an issue. If I did one for a more performance oriented motor I would definitely have it balanced along with the rest of the rotating mass.
If this project worked well, my next step would be to build a full FI motor using mexican EFI components and megasquirt.
_________________
1968 westy weekender
2000 jetta tdi
79 vespa p200e |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
david_594
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2006
Posts: 484
Location: Columbus, OH
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
A little more progress.
Cut a small piece of aluminum for mounting the megajolt controller and the EDIS control module to.
Also picked up some shielded cable for connecting the VR sensor to the control module, and for the connection from the EDIS controller to the megajolt.
All that remains is adding a relay and running power and ground to both controllers, and then running the power and 2 signal lines from the EDIS controller to the ignition coils. And lastly running a vacuum line from the manifold to the MAP sensor in the megajolt.
How the engine bay currently sits:
_________________
1968 westy weekender
2000 jetta tdi
79 vespa p200e |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
