Camping trip wasn't to be, clutch issues. (resolved update)

Batan · Last edited by Batan on Mon Oct 31, 2011 5:52 pm; edited 3 times in total

Well, we were going to go on a 4 night camping trip starting today. Got the bus cleaned inside and out, packed the spare parts neatly, organized everything, got the food in, clothes, new bedding for the bus, went to liquor store 2 blocks from home to get the camping booze and... something went wrong.
There is quite a vibration going on though the clutch pedal in neutral if the clutch pedal is not pushed in. If pushed in, it goes away. Seems to shift ok, but slips. It vibrates enough to shake random things up front, e-brake lever and such. I recently replaced the cable and the clevis pin. Lubed it well, adjusted freeplay, checked the sag on the bowden tube and everything was fine. Just checked bowden tube and the freeplay and all seems well. I tried making it tighter or looser to see if it makes a difference and not really, it does not.
It sounds awful lot like this case:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=405365&highlight=clutch+vibration

And now that I think of it, after I replaced the cable, everything was smooth like butter, then the last time I drove it a couple of days ago, it seems that the pedal was not as smooth anymore but it was faint enough to think it could have been in one's head.
Another note is that the clutch is newish and the release bearing has been replaced very recently during the engine reseal.

I guess I'm happy it happened a few blocks from home and not during the 5-6 hour drive to the campground. Confused

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'69 Riviera Bay
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ned · Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:08 pm Post subject:

Bummer. Well maybe this will make you feel a little better. I just got back from a 4 day to Big Sur and the weather was great, The food was good and the surf was just so so... Now do you feel a little better? Smile

SGKent · Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:14 pm Post subject:

you will need to pull the motor and check

flywheel tightness
pressure plate
driven disk
TO bearing mounting

When your check your pressure plate, if it is a 3-finger style get rid of it and get a diaphragm style. Since you have a 1969 it should be a quick job to do especially if you take up BusDaddy's offer.
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busdaddy · Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:14 pm Post subject:

That's terrible news, sounds like the pressure plate is coming apart, want to bring it by for a look?
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Batan · Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:32 pm Post subject:

Thanks guys. I figured pressure plate was the suspect too unless there's something that can cause this string of events that I'm not familiar with. Busdady, that would explain the chatter I'd get often on a steep hill while engaging the clutch.
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'03 20th Anniversary GTI
'74 Super Beetle
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Mountain Minstrel · Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:02 am Post subject:

skid · Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:13 pm Post subject:

Awww no that sucks! Where were you going to go?
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aeromech · Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:28 pm Post subject:

Drop the engine, throw in a clutch, put it back.... and go camping. Get 'er done.
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RatCamper · Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:38 pm Post subject:

busdaddy · Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:45 pm Post subject:

I had that set up for this very morning, as luck would have it I'd just made room in the shop yesterday, we were going to hit it hard and he would have been on the road by noon.
Batan decided to take thier motorcycles instead and deal with the bus when he returns, he said the clutch was slipping pretty bad and didn't want to attempt the 25 miles to my place right now. Lucky it happened close to home and the weather is nice for bike camping.

I suspect the diaphram spring in the pressure plate is broken, the pressure plate may be coming off the flywheel but he says there's no odd noises other than the beating of the clutch pedal up front. I was just in there a few months ago and the PP and clutch looked fairly fresh and not an off brand IIRC, it'll be interesting to see what happened in a few weeks.
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RatCamper · Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 3:02 pm Post subject:

Batan · Posted: Mon Aug 22, 2011 10:15 pm Post subject:

Update

Pulled the engine tonight, and sure, the pressure plate has partially collapsed. Looks like broken fingers, although there's nothing visibly broken, just obviously visibly screwed. lol

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

The out of round plate started the collar on the disc:

Flywheel has orangy colour to it... not sure if this is how it;s been all along or if it's the consequence of the clutch problems. It's nice, shiny and smooth otherwise:

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'69 Riviera Bay
'03 20th Anniversary GTI
'74 Super Beetle
Badzak Creative – Still and Motion Pictures

Batan · Posted: Mon Aug 22, 2011 10:37 pm Post subject:

As for the camping trip, we lost one day/night but ended up camping for three. As for the ride, I stayed true to the aircooled and borrowed a friend's car. Not a Bus to camp in, we had to minimize the camping equipment, but I can't feel too bad for myself considering that the drive between Vancouver and Okanagan is a pretty good one.

The packing job, lol!

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'69 Riviera Bay
'03 20th Anniversary GTI
'74 Super Beetle
Badzak Creative – Still and Motion Pictures

blue77bay · Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 12:05 am Post subject:

OHH man what a bummer,you had to slum it in an ole 911 instead of your bus Laughing

,well at least you got to go camping
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aeromech · Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 7:13 am Post subject:

Did you notice much of a difference in performance between the two vehicles?

Haha, nice friend you have there.
_________________
Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound

gordonzo · Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:27 am Post subject:

You were south of my neck of the woods. Where is that camp spot?

Couldn't you just have borrowed the engine from that Porch and take the bus? Laughing

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Batan · Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 12:15 pm Post subject:

Haha, yes a slight difference! The campspot is by #3 in Summerland.
_________________
'69 Riviera Bay
'03 20th Anniversary GTI
'74 Super Beetle
Badzak Creative – Still and Motion Pictures

2VWs1BMW · Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 5:53 pm Post subject:

love it! Although I don't see any liquor in the trunk. Laughing

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Batan · Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:28 am Post subject:

Batan · Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:21 am Post subject:

Another update, this time with frustration. Evil or Very Mad

Got the pressure plate and the clutch disc from this kit from CIP:
http://www.cip1.ca/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=VWC-211-140-025-BKIT

went to install it yesterday and realized that the clutch disc in that kit is a RIGID disc, not sprung. The picture shows a sprung disc. Rolling Eyes

If you click on "add to cart", it will say rigid disc but I missed it. Anyway, I got the pressure plate and the disc from the kit as the throw out bearing is new and the things have been apart when the engine was resealed. The clutch was near new too but as you can see in the pictures, the plate collapsed. Anyway, my used disc seemed fine so I decided to go with that.
Got it assembled today and had a friend help me to get the motor back in. After the motor was bolted on, I went in to check the clutch pedal and it was HARD. I was like wtf, did they sell me a race pressure plate? The pedal also doesn't feel right, it doesn't really have that progressive spring feeling of a clutch pedal. We adjusted it and it seems that all of the travel of the clutch lever happens in the first 1/2 of the pedal travel. The motor is not hooked up yet but just by turning it by head in and out of gear, it might not be engaging either. I double checked the part number on the box and it seems right.
The only odd thing was that I tried to compress the pressure plate on the bench by putting some of my weight on it and I could not. Bentley mentions potential clips that partially hold the plate pressed for installation(to be removed after the installation) but I could not find anything on there.

_________________
'69 Riviera Bay
'03 20th Anniversary GTI
'74 Super Beetle
Badzak Creative – Still and Motion Pictures


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Camping trip wasn't to be, clutch issues. (resolved update)
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