Are FI beetles not preferred to purchase?

[mr matt]

Hi,
Considering buying a 1977 vw beetle, convert.
Notice it is FI,


As for my $ offer, are these less attracitve to buyers than the standard ( pre-FI) motors, do you think it impacts the cost of selling these cars?

Just wondering...
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1955 3-fold semaphore Oval beetle
1971 Convertible beetle
1977 Westfalia, FI, Berlin interior

[bsairhead]

[busdaddy]

Most prefer it, but there's always one or two in every crowd who "heard from some oldtimer" that FI was bad and had to go.
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[OTTO 1303]

Although I do not have any ACFI, it wouldn’t stop me.

Good Luck
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74 Super Sun Bug - OTTO
74 Super - DANZIG
74 Super - HERZOG

[Tom K.]

If parts are available to maintain the F1, then I would have no problem. I would imagine Mexico would gave tons of F1 parts.
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'91 Vanagon Westfalia
'70 Beetle Convertible
'71 Super Beetle Semi-Automatic: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=714131&highlight=
'65 Ghia: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=762478&highlight=

[busdaddy]

[mr matt]

OK, the responses kind of suprise me actually. Thought there would be a neg on the bug due to FI issues ( which I have heard of) as well as getting the parts, but Busdaddy had a good comment on that.

Not sure if tuneups would be more difficult on these.

Just a side thought, I know late buses had hydroylic lifters, never heard of a late bug having these....
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1955 3-fold semaphore Oval beetle
1971 Convertible beetle
1977 Westfalia, FI, Berlin interior

[busdaddy]

Tune up is valve adjust, spark plugs, points gap and timing, if that scares you run away.

Solid lifters unless someone has done something Mexican in there.
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Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.

Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
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[bsairhead]

[Root_Werks]

Wife drove a 77' Vert for years and loved it. I had a spare double relay and set of points in the trunk. Never needed them. Bug always started and ran nicely.

Vacuum leaks are your nemesis, L-Jet is very sensitive to them.

Nothing wrong with a carb'd Bug at all either.

Tune up for both (already stated) is about the same. Spark plugs in a FI bug are a little more challenging to get to.

-Dan
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When I set my timing, why do I flush, then take a pee?

[mr matt]

Thanks!

Been tuning up bugs for about 40 years... so no prob there.

Besides my camper, never personally seen a FI in a bug.. the things I've ben missing in life!!
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1955 3-fold semaphore Oval beetle
1971 Convertible beetle
1977 Westfalia, FI, Berlin interior

[BugCaster]

I think you may be right that the usual buyer might prefer carbs. It could be that they remember the beetle they had growing up and there were a lot more years of carbed beetles produced. So just by the numbers.
The other thing that might scare off buyers is that there is a lot more info out there on carbed cars on youtube, in books, etc.
I love my FI bug but for the most part all my learning about working on the fuel injection system came from either the orange manual or on this forum. .

[mr matt]

Yes, for me I grew up on carbs, not FI.
With FI's there are the black boxes..... can be tough to troubleshoot.

Am guessing the FI bugs have an AFM, like the buses do?
I've read on this site that if you do not due AFM adjustments during a tune up ( buses), then you are not really doing a a tune up.

So far in my bus, I leave it alone, seems to be fine.
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1955 3-fold semaphore Oval beetle
1971 Convertible beetle
1977 Westfalia, FI, Berlin interior

[busdaddy]

[Rob Combs]

Worth keeping in mind that if in SE PA, you have strict emissions standards as we do where I live (for `75 & up, anyway - not sure if you do in your part of the US), you might not be able to alter your induction system at all and still register the car.

Not saying avoid FI by any means, just understand that if you have strict emissions standards for that year vehicle, you may well be forced to fix whatever happens to it, regardless of how difficult it is to find someone who knows how to do it, lest you not get your plates the following year. And you won't have many power-adding options available, either.

I, for one, will not have a `75+ model year ACVW, at least in CA, for that very reason - not much flexibility available to you if you want to add displacement or cam beyond what the factory FI can handle, or if parts/mechanical labor supply to fix the FI system dries up.

With a pre-75, at least here (for now anyway), they're all carb, and we have multiple options. Including no-hassle upgrading to FI if we so desire.

Short story - know what you're getting into before you jump.

[mr matt]

Thanks to both of you -

Busdaddy, if I have the time I will try to find the post re AFM tuenup, these were people here who calibrated them, rebuilt them..but am in line with what you are saying..not to touch them. Right off hand was not aware...or did not think hard about it yet... but thanks.

Rob, very good point I will call today and check re: emmsion exemption for PA. I thought by 75 emissions no longer needed. I have my VW's listed as antiques, so they are exempt.
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1955 3-fold semaphore Oval beetle
1971 Convertible beetle
1977 Westfalia, FI, Berlin interior

[baldessariclan]

To me, the “desirability” of Beetles with FI engines is somewhat comparable to the “desirability” of Beetles w/ autostick transmissions. Both systems are less common and somewhat “novel”, as compared to the majority of other ACVW’s out there. And both systems, when working properly, can offer some advantages over the other more common “standard” fuel delivery and transmission configurations.

However, there’s also no denying that FI and autostick systems are significantly more complex and complicated as compared to carbureted or manual transmission equipped cars. They simply have more pieces and components, which all need to be in proper working order for satisfactory performance. Hence why I think many folk may be a bit more hesitant to deal with them.

Don’t get me wrong — there are plenty of FI and autostick fans and experts out there. Thus plenty of help available if you want to get one of these up and running. As noted in the previous post by Rob above, you just need to understand and accept what you’re getting into with these — good luck!
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1971 Standard Beetle — fairly stock / driver

baldessariclan -- often in error, never in doubt...

[mr matt]

Busdaddy,

quick search could not find the post I was recalling, however just to add to ones AFM library, this - outside of thesamba, was saved in my favorites....

https://www.itinerant-air-cooled.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=7761

Nice to see some Youtube videos on it, hopefully SGKent posted one. Have not watched any to see their accuracy, and not sure if I would know either way.
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1955 3-fold semaphore Oval beetle
1971 Convertible beetle
1977 Westfalia, FI, Berlin interior

[busdaddy]

Colins method of AFM adjustment is for buses, thier engines are worked to the limit constantly and can gain some head longevity by setting the system up a little richer, bugs never work hard enough to generate that kind of heat so the factory AFM setting is quite adequate.
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.

Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!

Слава Україні!

[bnam]

While I’ve not owned an FI ACVW, I did own 2 L-jet based FI Fiat spiders of that era. And, I liked them. They were not too difficult to set up correctly and once they were - they ran quite reliably.
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1971 1302LS Convertible (RHD) owned since '74
Click to view image
1965 Karmann Ghia Coupe - under restoration
1966 Fiat 1500 Cabrio (with 1600 Twin cam)
1952 Citroen TA 11BL