TheSamba.com :: View topic - "Sled" Tin vs. HD Pushrod Tube Protectors

Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:16 pm

I've been reading a lot about these "sled" tins lately and to be honest I've never had or taken apart an engine with them on it.
My most current build I used these HD pushrod tube protectors which needed to be slightly modified to fit but they are nice
http://www.appletreeauto.com/push-rod-tube-protectors-chro-pr-868.html

My question is how important are these commonly missing tins for cooling purposes and are these PR tube covers a bad idea to put in place of them?

I'm trying to diagnose an overheating problem which I would assume is from a cruddy aftermarket fan shroud but I'm looking at everything it could potentially be.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:30 pm

The pushrod tube protectors are generally used for offroad and open engine compartment vehicles. For a stock vehicle, it's go with the factory tin.

Yes, they are important.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:40 pm

All I see is a waste of $35. The sled tins are there for the long term health of the motor. As Jimmy 111 put it, "As your speed increases the sled tins keep the air pressure under the car from overcoming the fan (as much as 2psi under the car). They need either heater boxes or block off tins to be functional." A car that seems to run fine around town but overheats on the highway (when the under-car air pressure is higher and the fan doesn't generate enough pressure to push the spent cooling air into the airstream) should be checked to see all the factory cooling tin is in place. They will protect the pushrod tubes from small road debris. If the bottom of the motor needs more protection (an offroad car?) then a skid plate is in order. Think of it this way; if the motor didn't need them the factory engineers wouldn't have put them there.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:42 pm

Glenn wrote: The pushrod tube protectors are generally used for offroad and open engine compartment vehicles. For a stock vehicle, it's go with the factory tin.

Yes, they are important.

It is for a beetle though its anything but stock.
It is a very low car which is why I chose them. My girlfriend hit a rock in the road kicked up by a plow truck in it before and it ended up causing some big PR tube problems.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:45 pm

ALB wrote: All I see is a waste of $35. The sled tins are there for the long term health of the motor. As Jimmy 111 put it, "As your speed increases the sled tins keep the air pressure under the car from overcoming the fan (as much as 2psi under the car). They need either heater boxes or block off tins to be functional." A car that seems to run fine around town but overheats on the highway (when the under-car air pressure is higher and the fan doesn't generate enough pressure to push the spent cooling air into the airstream) should be checked to see all the factory cooling tin is in place. They will protect the pushrod tubes from small road debris. If the bottom of the motor needs more protection (an offroad car?) then a skid plate is in order. Think of it this way; if the motor didn't need them the factory engineers wouldn't have put them there.

That is something I've never heard before and it could very well be contributing to the cooling problem as it happens mostly on the highway at about 60mph+
I really appreciate you posting this, I will acquire the proper stock tins and get them in place.
Now what about these block off tins? I'm not running heater boxes.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:47 pm

Well, stock sleds are no lower than the case and if you have a deep sump, that will be the lowest point on your engine.

And modified engines need them even more that stock.

BTW, if you're running J tubes you need the industrial tins to close off the tin.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:58 pm

Thanks Glenn. I've never even seen those block off tins offered. Must not be looking hard enough.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 4:02 pm

If you really need protection just use type 181 skid plate and sled tins and block off plates.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 4:02 pm

Berg sells reproductions.
http://www.geneberg.com/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=7400&x=0&y=0

Mine are real Type 126 tins.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:16 pm

Always try to use as much stock tin as you can. The sled tins are great but unfortunately, they do not fit with many (actually most) aftermarket exhausts.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:18 pm

henrym wrote: unfortunately, they do not fit with many (actually most) aftermarket exhausts.
Then don't buy one that doesn't fit. If people stop buying crap, they'll change the design.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 7:22 pm

Almost Alive wrote:
That is something I've never heard before and it could very well be contributing to the cooling problem as it happens mostly on the highway at about 60mph+
.

what is overheating? the oil or the heads? timing could be an issue...

Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:44 pm

Glenn wrote: henrym wrote: unfortunately, they do not fit with many (actually most) aftermarket exhausts.
Then don't buy one that doesn't fit. If people stop buying crap, they'll change the design.

The Berg pipe is directly under the cylinder head...radiating heat into the head: not good IMO, in some applications.

Other aftermarket headers place the J-pipe into the sled area where air is flowing over the J-pipe...simply trim the sled tin as needed and you're good to go :)

Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:53 pm

neil68 wrote: The Berg pipe is directly under the cylinder head...radiating heat into the head: not good IMO, in some applications.
Actually the industrial shields are between the header and the had which keep the heat from reaching the head and keep the air that's flowing over the head to exit out the rear.

This is the exact same setup that was used in the Type 126 industrial engine and the 1973 VW Thing engine.

Fri Feb 26, 2010 9:03 pm

neil68 wrote: The Berg pipe is directly under the cylinder head...radiating heat into the head: not good IMO, in some applications.

Other aftermarket headers place the J-pipe into the sled area where air is flowing over the J-pipe...simply trim the sled tin as needed and you're good to go :)

having the pipe more up under the engine interferes with the ability to use the thermostat. that is more of a negative than the possibility of radiant heat from a j-tube. with the industrial shields like Glenn runs, the original plenum formed at the bottom of the engine is retained, and I'd bet radiant heat is not an issue...

Fri Feb 26, 2010 9:53 pm

Glenn wrote: Berg sells reproductions.
http://www.geneberg.com/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=7400&x=0&y=0

Mine are real Type 126 tins.

So where can I get those tins Glenn? From the dealer?
I called Gene Berg and wouldn't you know it, they're closed on Fridays.

Whats a Type 126 anyway

Sat Feb 27, 2010 12:04 am

bugninva wrote: Almost Alive wrote:
That is something I've never heard before and it could very well be contributing to the cooling problem as it happens mostly on the highway at about 60mph+
.

what is overheating? the oil or the heads? timing could be an issue...

I wholeheartedly agree, there are other factors to consider; but if you have the above situation and are missing the sled tins it's the first thing to fix.

Sat Feb 27, 2010 6:24 am

damicotile wrote: So where can I get those tins Glenn? From the dealer?
I called Gene Berg and wouldn't you know it, they're closed on Fridays.

Whats a Type 126 anyway
I doubt any dealer would have them.

Call Berg on Monday.

A Type 126 is an Industrial engine. Usually used to power air compressors, water pumps and other not automotive machines. Hence they need no heat.

Sat Feb 27, 2010 7:33 am

Quote: I doubt any dealer would have them
I remember seeing a template for making them on this site. I saved it but can't find it now. :?

Sat Feb 27, 2010 7:48 am

Here's another place to get them.

http://www.awesomepowdercoat.com/Industrial_Shields.html