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Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:14 pm

This compressor is pretty awesome. It is a V4 5hp 60 gal unit and after all the discounts I got from Lowes because of all the trouble I had with this order, it came out to about $1050 shipped to me. I think the original price is $1300.

Right now i'm just prepping the body in preparation for paint next week. Its just been too humid and wet here. Can't wait! Next update will be with paint on the main shell. I'll paint the fenders and doors within the next couple months.

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:59 am

Don't need much words to describe what happened over the weekend. Big hurdle right? Wrong, just got another setback. While I was rubbing the paint after color sanding on the roof portion, I found what seems to be solvent pop on the lower layers of the clear. Its just a billion little pinholes in certain areas on the roof in stripes. I know I had this problem while spraying the smaller panels on the inside of the truck and frunk, but at that time had thought it was due to contamination of my air. Now i'm thinking its because the PPG DBC 9700 black was still gassing off when I sprayed the clear. I have read that its the slowest drying color. Anyone know if thats true and can confirm my assumptions? This is the exact products and procedure that I used.

Products
DP90LF - 2 parts epoxy: 1 part Catalyst: .5 part reducer
401 Catalyst
PPG DBC 9700 Black - 1 part base: 0.75 part reducer (DT870)
PPG 2021 Clear - 4 parts clear: 1 part hardener: 1 part reducer
PPG DT885 reducer
PPG DCX61

Garage Enviro
Temps around 78 degrees @ 9:00am
Humidity around 61%

First sprayed the DP90LF and let it sit for about 2 hours before spraying the first coat of base. I let it flash for about 15 mins and sprayed the second coat of base. I waited about 30 mins before laying down the first medium wet coat of clear. Second coat of clear went on about 20 mins later. The second coat did not flow as well, so I had some decent orange peel. Let it sit over night with a garage temp of 82 degrees and started color sanding at 10:30am.

I plan to wet sand the clear until the pinholes are gone with 800 grit. i'll then touch up places that I burn through with base and then clear coat again with 2 coats. However, i'm going to wait several hours to let the base coat dry (if I had to spray) before clearing. I'm also going to over reduce with 1.5 parts to let the clear flow better.

Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:52 pm

I normally use DRR 1170 (or 1160 or 1180 depending on the shop temp) reducer with Deltron paint (color on the labels match, or at least used to) when doing BC/CC painting. I've also used Deltron with DT 870 and added DCX 61 with it before, but it was a maroon reddish color, and I didn't have an issue (other than the fumes getting to me from the DCX).
Other than that, It sounds like you're doing everything correctly. If you need to though, you can wait on shooting the clear up to 24 hours.

I do have to ask, was ALL of the black base flat before you cleared it? If not, then it was still out gassing, and probably due to using the DT 870 instead of DRR 1170.

As a side note, I should mention that I use DT 870 as a reducer for K-36, and for when I'm shooting Concept (DCC paint).
I hope this helps.

Tue Sep 27, 2016 9:58 pm

Way to keep hammering away at it, my man..

Setbacks are part of the process, as we all know.

Sounds like you got a good game plan to keep moving forward..

Wed Sep 28, 2016 11:30 am

Bob - On the P-sheets I have say to use the DT line of reducers so thats what I went with. I can't remember if the base was still wet or not when I sprayed the clear. I just remember waiting about 30 minutes before spraying the clear. I'll inquire about the DRR reducers.

Clatter - Thanks! I just have to keep pressing on after all of these setbacks. Guess its a good learning experience.

Well I sprayed the interior portion of the passenger door last night using the other method and was able to spray with minimal orange peel. The base had a nice dull appearance when I came back to spray the clear after about 2 hours. Followed the exact same procedure when spraying the over reduced clear. Before spraying the second coat of clear, I dabbed my finger on some clear that was on masking tape and it was just slightly tacky and left a matte image of my finger. Figured this should be a good time to spray the second coat, which was about 15 minutes after. I'll find out today to see if I have solvent pop again. If I do have solvent pop, then there's something wrong with my spraying or the clear. I'm hoping I just waited long enough before spraying the second coat of clear.

Bob - When spraying the second coat of clear for 2021 (if you've sprayed it), do you wait until the touch test doesn't leave a mark or just leaves a matte image of your finger? This time around I made sure the clear dried a little more and left a matte image of my finger when I touched the masking tape.

Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:29 pm

I missed the part that you were using DBC 9700. Sorry about that, as my morning coffee hadn't kicked in yet. I normally use DBU 9700, which uses the DRR reducer.

I'll be honest, the last time I shot 2021 clear, was also the same time I shot that DBC Deltron, and that was a few years ago.
I normally use 2082 Stratoclear, with either 2084 or 2085 activator, as it lays down a touch thicker and with less dry spots than either the 2002 or 2021 clears do. Lately, I've been shooting a lot of Nason clear (Dupont). I really like how it lays down, and sprays out. The only drawback to it, is that it gets everywhere with a tacky overspray, so you need to cover everything you don't want a layer of clear on.

Wed Sep 28, 2016 10:11 pm

I see. Thanks for the info. Looks like the door i shot has a lot less solvent pop, but i still do have some. I called the manufacturer rep and was told that i should try to over reduce the clear with a 4:1:2, which should bring down the solid content and chance of solvent pop. I sprayed some test cards tonight with that mix. Ill check on it tomorrow morning to see if i still get solvent pop.

I really like how the nason clears spray too! Although, i only shot smaller motorcycle panels so i just used a spot panel clear. My local nason dealer was telling me about the 475-00 clear which doesnt need a reducer so it drastically reduces the chance of solvent pop, if any. Im just wondering how well it flows out. At $200 for 2 gallons rts, i might just scrap the 2021 for this nason!

Fri Sep 30, 2016 5:54 am

supersuk wrote: I see. Thanks for the info.

I really like how the nason clears spray too! Although, i only shot smaller motorcycle panels so i just used a spot panel clear. My local nason dealer was telling me about the 475-00 clear which doesnt need a reducer so it drastically reduces the chance of solvent pop, if any. Im just wondering how well it flows out. At $200 for 2 gallons rts, i might just scrap the 2021 for this nason!

I've been using Nason 498 clear. It works good on both DBU and Dupont products. In fact last summer I used it over my custom mixed DBU paint on my Notch. This was after I used it on a friends work truck (that sees Michigan winters), along with using it over Nason paint on my winter beater. At $120 rts a gallon (gallon of clear, and a qt of activator), I'm willing to experiment with it. It's basically a 4:1 mix 2 component clear like PPG's Stratoclear, but it actually lays down like shooting Deltron. One thing I have found with it, is that you can lay it down, wait a day, then wet sand it with 320 or 400, then throw another coat on it, and it lays down almost like glass (almost no orange peel).

Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:14 am

FWIW, I have shot the Nason clear twice,
First time it didn't flow, but ran.. runs through orange-peel.. :?
My Ace painter friend kind of laughed, because he is of the opinion that shooting Nason clears is a black art, and different than others.
Being able to lay down Nason clear is a point of pride for him.

Guess it's cheap enough you don't mind sanding it out? :wink: :lol:

Oddly enough, a year later, I did it again, (newer formula) and it worked perfectly.
Best paint I ever shot.

Now, all this means beans, cause I'm a Newb <----Capitol 'N',
But it might mean that Nason clear ain't so bad any more...

Fri Sep 30, 2016 10:24 am

Solvent popping is from the gasses trying to get out . I always wait 30 to 45 minutes between coats. Humidity & temp can really mess up paint jobs. I like to paint in the evening, less humidity, more time to spend on the process. When I sprayed my square I spent the better part of 1 day in the booth. Between base coat & clear coat. Gave me some quality time with the car.

Fri Sep 30, 2016 11:39 am

eyetzr wrote: Solvent popping is from the gasses trying to get out . I always wait 30 to 45 minutes between coats. Humidity & temp can really mess up paint jobs. I like to paint in the evening, less humidity, more time to spend on the process. When I sprayed my square I spent the better part of 1 day in the booth. Between base coat & clear coat. Gave me some quality time with the car.

Yup. I usually wait an hour before shooting clear over base color. I think the PPG P-sheets even call that out as well, but then most of my P-sheets are from the early to mid 90's.

Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:00 am

Ok, so i called the manufacurer rep and they told me there was a problem with my batch! Hallelujah!!! From what I understood from the conversation is that the clear was setting up way too fast causing the solvent pop. Well i already got the nason 475-00 and sprayed it tonight. It sprays exactly how the 2021 sprays, so its most likely a high solids clear. You pretty much spray it on how you want it to look. I used the high temp activator this time so its taking a little longer than i hoped to get ready for the second coat. Prolly 30 mons between coats before it got tacky to the touch. Well heres hoping to no solvent pop! Lol

Ill get pics up tomorrow.

Mon Oct 03, 2016 12:44 pm

I forgot to take pictures of the main body after spraying it, but I think I dodged a bullet with this one. The nason 475-00 clear is really thick and has to be sprayed like how you want it to look. It is nearly impossible to spray a med wet coat of it without heavy orange peel using either my 3M Accuspray gun (1.4 tip) or Sharpe Finex FX3000. I had to lay down a wet coat to look decent on the first coat. I let it flash off for about 30 minutes since I was using the high temp activator in my 81 degree spray temp. Sprayed the second coat when the first was tacky. It looked beautiful when I left the booth to go eat dinner. Came back about 2 hours later to what appeared to be big bumps on the surface of the paint. I was worried that I had the solvent pop issue again....

Well, came back to it the next morning to see what happens when I wet sand it down and polish it. Turns out, it turned into really heavy orange peel. I wet sanded a small portion of the worst orange peel and polished it to find a really nice finish. Funny thing is that this only happened to the main body of the car. On the under side of the trunk and frunk lids, this didn't happen! How strange is that.

Called Nason to see if I can reduce the clear since the P-sheets don't say anything about reducing. Their technical support guy (Todd) said I can reduce up to 10% to help it flow out more and spray thinner layers. This should help with orange peel. I can't believe i'm having so much problems with clear coats only on the VW! I've painted so much stuff before and never ever had a problem. This VW must be cursed.

Under side of trunk lid after painting with Nason 475-00

Under side of frunk lid after painting with Nason 475-00. Notice the runs by the hood emblem area. Easy to sand out and buff. Got some dust in it cause I didn't blow out good enough.

Tue Oct 04, 2016 11:19 am

Got a call from the paint rep and they told me they will be replacing all the materials that I had to waste to redo the paint on the VW! So a full gallon of clear, a full gallon of base, and a full gallon of epoxy. I now have more than enough product to finish the project and I don't have to sink more money into the paint job. Win for me!

Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:47 am

Painted the top of the Frunk, Trunk, and Passenger door last night and the outcome was awesome. Followed the recommendation of reducing the Nason 475-00 clear by about 5% after activating and it worked awesome. The product flows out good with very little orange peel. However, I do have a fair share of dust since I didn't filter one of the fans. Oh wells...let the pics speak for themselves.

I did some bad masking on one area of the door and basically missed a sliver. What is the easiest way of fixing this? I've never did this kind of paint repair before... Do I just apply base in that area and then clear only a small section or does the entire door have to be recleared?

Thu Oct 06, 2016 9:40 am

I'd probably wet sand the entire door skin (with either 320 or 400), shot the color where you need it, and clear the entire area (spot and door skin). I only say that, as you might find blending the clear on the door a challenge/problem. Keep in mind that it might turn out looking really good too. :wink:
So far, everything looks sweet. 8) Nice job.

Thu Oct 06, 2016 12:10 pm

supersuk wrote: This VW must be cursed.

It IS a black Fastback after all...

-but-

YOU ARE KILLIN' IT, Bro!

Can't wait, can't wait, can't wait to see mine black and shiny like that one day..
Thanks for the inspiration!

Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:02 am

I'm having problems lining up the gap between the rear fender and door for the driver side. Seems like i'm missing a shim or something. Did the type 3's ever use shims for the door or do you have to "adjust" the hinge mounting point on the body?

Tue Oct 11, 2016 2:18 am

supersuk wrote: I'm having problems lining up the gap between the rear fender and door for the driver side. Seems like i'm missing a shim or something. Did the type 3's ever use shims for the door or do you have to "adjust" the hinge mounting point on the body?

No shims. You'll have to adjust the door to get the gaps how you want them. If needed, you could always make an aluminum shim (or 2) to add behind the hinge. I've done that before.

Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:22 am

I'm assuming in order to adjust the front to back gap of the door, you have to actually bend the mounting points on the car? I've used one of those big lever things that attach to the door latch on modern doors to adjust doors before. Kinda the same process for the type 3s?