TheSamba.com :: View topic - Bought 85 Joker Jubilee to drive home from Chile, now dead.

Thu Jan 02, 2014 8:52 pm

All your advice is recognized and appreciated.

When this first happened, my first thoughts were toward engine replacement. After assessing the cost and time involved (and the difficulty of accomplishing this in a foreign country where my language skills are week), I have decided to repair the existing engine. I have identified an expert here in Chile that has rebuilt numerous waterboxer engines and is confident that my case should be relatively straight forward. The difficult thing is that he is 7 hours north of me and I will simply ship the engine away and get it sent back once restored and resealed. This takes my participation out of the equation which is a little sad, but there will still be plenty of work getting the engine back into the van and reconnected to all the systems. I will keep this thread updated on my progress.

The mechanic in the santiago area doing the work is Juan Pablo and he has a website at: http://www.westfaliachile.cl/

Thanks again for all the help.
Ben

Thu Jan 02, 2014 8:58 pm

Ben

I think you are making the right decision. Let me know if you need assistance communicating with Juan Pablo. Reading his website, it looks like he is the right guy for the job.

Also, once the engine is reinstalled and van is drivable, it wold not hurt to take it to Juan Pablo for a full inspection/look-over before you depart on your way up home.

Thu Jan 02, 2014 9:09 pm

Good ideas everyone.
Many thanks for all the valuable advice.
I feel lucky to have found Juan Pablo (and TheSamba!).
Ben

Thu Jan 02, 2014 9:25 pm

Given your descriptions, I would also stick with the WBX. If you think things are difficult now, adding a Subaru or Ford to the situation would more than likely add unknown complications and consequences. I don't think there are any official VW dealerships in Chile but there are in neighboring Argentina. Amongst others is a dealership in Buenos Aires, a potential source of a longblock or peripheral parts for your rebuild idea. Try email [email protected] as a source for parts closer than U.S.

Have a decent digital camera? I would photograph the hell out of your existing installation with wires, hoses, nuts, bolts etc. As with any machine of that age, there have perhaps been modifications along the way and you might need to reconnect for things to run right. I am sure your mechanic will benefit by referencing photographic help.

Good Luck and try to enjoy your travels.

Thu Jan 02, 2014 10:34 pm

There is plenty you can do while the engine is being repaired. I wouldn't just sit around waiting. There are some simple, very important jobs you could be getting on with. First I would make sure your coolant system is functional as best as possible. Flush the hell out of it, flush it again and back-flush! inspect radiator for weeping leaks and cracking in hoses etc. The engine will be gone for quite a few weeks so, brakes could be inspected and simple repairs and replacements made to help you stop a little quicker on those roads down there. Just bleeding the brakes may give you some bang for your buck. Just these two things alone could be serviced with general/universal parts found at most car part stores/junk yards and DIY stores.

Good luck and keep smiling :). You will have a great story to tell one day.

Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:51 am

You can order a proper exhaust and new clutch kit while you wait. Inspect and re-pack your cv joints too.

Jon

Fri Jan 03, 2014 7:00 am

I got to agree, there are a lot of things you can do while you wait on your engine.

How about some of these:
resealing gas tank
replacing fuel lines
have a close look at your tires and make sure they are not passenger car tires
Inspect Shocks and suspension linkage
wash out the engine bay
service the transmission
flush brake and clutch fluids
inspect all electical
clean all your grounds
work on your fridge

Oh how the list goes on :lol:

Fri Jan 03, 2014 7:03 am

madspaniard wrote: <snip> Also, once the engine is reinstalled and van is drivable, it wold not hurt to take it to Juan Pablo for a full inspection/look-over before you depart on your way up home.

YES YES YES!!!! This is a fantastic idea and a good trip to start feeling more confident in your machine!

I would of course ride around town a bit before venturing for the 7 hour journey.

Fri Jan 03, 2014 10:03 am

Hammy1 wrote: You can order a proper exhaust
That *is* a proper exhaust he's got, just not the US/Canadian-market one most people are familiar with.

From ETKA, exhaust system for 1985 1.9l, engine codes DF,DG,EY,GW:

Sat Jan 04, 2014 10:12 am

Thanks again for all the useful ideas and advice. Absolutely...during the rebuild I will focus checking, cleaning, improving many of the other systems.

A quick update:

-Yesterday my local mechanic helped me remove my engine. The process was fast as we had an opportunity to ship the engine to Santiago for a very low price...if we could get it out, boxed and to the truck in ~3 hours. We did it and there was only one ground bolt that broke located on the left head.

-The engine is now boxed and on its way to Santiago to be rebuilt/sealed by an experienced waterboxer mechanic.

-During the dismantle, I became increasingly concerned about getting it all back together again as the engine (as many are) appears quite different than the ones in the Bentley. Because my engine is the euro-factory carburetor (25? Pierberg), I have no reference to tell me if everything is done right. Does anyone know where to get manuals for carbureted vanagon engines (esp. online)? All this said, I am sure there are some customizations that were done (wires that do not connect to anything...) And what is the pump(?) between the oil tower and the distributor?

-I know the best thing is to just put this back together in the same manner as when I took it apart...but I worry that some of the existing system if a little slap-shot and I want to trust in the system. Any advice for improvements are welcome.

Here are a whole slew of engine photos to discuss:

Engine Overview after leak, but before dismantled.
Photo #1

Here are four images that are closer-up on the pre-dismantle engine.
Photo #2

Photo #3

Photo #4

Note large airfilter and two strange disconnected tubes in the elbow between filter and carb cover. What were these for?
Photo #5

First image during dismantle
Photo #6

Further dismantled:
Photo #7

Photo #8

View of left side of engine. Note that the temp gage sender is disconnected and there is no place for the temp sensor as shown on the Bentley cooling diagram 19.8.
Photo #9

Further dismantled:
Photo #10

Carb from above. The mechanic suggest the choke did not look like it was working and there were a few wires that were not connected to anything.
Photo #11

Location of sheared bolt. What is tubing and device in lower right? Also what is device between oil tower and distributor? Coolant pump/thermostat for carb? That was all it connected to.
Photo #12

Here is more cooling plumbing for the carb (?) Is this custom? It is pretty corroded inside and the temp sensor (?) looks rusted in. The upper, shorter flexible tube went into the carb. The lower, longer metal pipe looks like it connected down to the heat exchanger tubing.
Photo #13

End of transmission...looking good?
Photo #14

Thanks again to all that help. I am learning so much from all of you.

Take care,
Ben

Sat Jan 04, 2014 11:27 am

Hi Ben.

Part between alt. and dist.: fuel pump. (edit) Part in RH of 12th image has an oil pressure switch and oil line so may be meant for an oil pressure gauge. Small hoses not connected at air filter are likely for the EVAP charcoal filter valve.

There appears to be two coolant temp senders. One in middle of image two and one in lower RH of image 9.

I'd suggest doing a visual inspection of wiring with electrical tape over it. This may be low on the list of things to do but worthwhile if the tape is easy to get at.

If you search clutch, transmission, or bell housing here, you should find info on some clutch housing checks you can do.

Sat Jan 04, 2014 11:36 am

the coolant going to part on carb likely has to do with the choke. Yes. Searched "vanagon Pierberg carb image" and found info. i.e.

http://onemanspanner.wordpress.com/2011/06/13/pierburg-2e3-on-a-vw-vanagon/

http://www.gowerlee.dircon.co.uk/2E3type.html

double check against model # of yours.

Did you keep the carb? (rebuild, reseal time?)

Sat Jan 04, 2014 11:37 am

Great ideas. I will certainly do the electrical clean-up.
I will number my photos to make responses easier.

Sat Jan 04, 2014 11:50 am

.... and I will learn to count the images better. ;)

Carb rebuild parts **might** have interchanges with other VW carbs. Not likely, but if need be, you might find a resource for this? Just thinking ahead to parts availability.

Do any of the Bay buses use a Pierberg carb? I know the older engines used Solex carbs.

Neil.

Sat Jan 04, 2014 12:04 pm

Strange to see a twin barrel carb. I had a carb'd 1.9L in a DoKa years ago. It was a revised version of the Pict 34 as seen on late Beetles.

Tue Feb 18, 2014 8:39 am

UPDATE - Mid-Feb 2014
All vehicle info at the start of the thread. Note: we aim to fix the van in Chile and drive back to the states.

Thanks everyone for the help some time back. Here is our current situation and a plea for advice.

Over the last month, we have done the following...
-removed the engine, shipped to Santiago to WB expert.
-engine disassembled, blocks sent to expert to remove head studs.
-expert machinists, one after another, have attempted and given up on extraction. we are now preparing to work with a 5th machinist

-in the meantime, I have done lots of other improvements to the van as suggested (fuel lines, brakes, cooling system, etc.).
-I flew back to the states and bought parts (engine rebuild and others).

Now I am in a situation where I am losing confidence that the extraction will be successful. Options are:
-keep waiting and hope for the best. get the studs out. do the rebuild
-find a used, similar waterboxer in Chile. rebuild it.
-ship in a rebuilt waterboxer from the states
-purchase and ship in a conversion kit (subaru or bostig).

I want to make the rebuild work for a number of reasons:
-I have already invested a lot of time in this
-I have already invested ~$600 in parts (and a flight) for the rebuild
-Our vanagon is rare (commemorative Joker Jubilee edition) and bringing it back to the states with an original engine would make it more valuable in resale.

Is sentimentality preventing me from realizing that the engine can't be fixed?
Should I persevere and keep working with machinists to extract the studs?
If no...what is the best step forward to you?

Thanks!
Ben

Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:29 am

ben_in_bus wrote: UPDATE - Mid-Feb 2014
All vehicle info at the start of the thread. Note: we aim to fix the van in Chile and drive back to the states.

Thanks everyone for the help some time back. Here is our current situation and a plea for advice.

Over the last month, we have done the following...
-removed the engine, shipped to Santiago to WB expert.
-engine disassembled, blocks sent to expert to remove head studs.
-expert machinists, one after another, have attempted and given up on extraction. we are now preparing to work with a 5th machinist

-in the meantime, I have done lots of other improvements to the van as suggested (fuel lines, brakes, cooling system, etc.).
-I flew back to the states and bought parts (engine rebuild and others).

Now I am in a situation where I am losing confidence that the extraction will be successful. Options are:
-keep waiting and hope for the best. get the studs out. do the rebuild
-find a used, similar waterboxer in Chile. rebuild it.
-ship in a rebuilt waterboxer from the states
-purchase and ship in a conversion kit (subaru or bostig).

I want to make the rebuild work for a number of reasons:
-I have already invested a lot of time in this
-I have already invested ~$600 in parts (and a flight) for the rebuild
-Our vanagon is rare (commemorative Joker Jubilee edition) and bringing it back to the states with an original engine would make it more valuable in resale.

Is sentimentality preventing me from realizing that the engine can't be fixed?
Should I persevere and keep working with machinists to extract the studs?
If no...what is the best step forward to you?

Thanks!
Ben

You mentioned resale, so you were just going to flip it?

Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:41 am

No explicit plans to flip...but just considering that as an option as we already have 2 cars at home.

Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:44 am

ben_in_bus wrote: No explicit plans to flip...but just considering that as an option as we already have 2 cars at home.

Ya wear a parachute ya plan on jumping :wink:

Good luck with it all, bummer deal to be faced with these kind of choices right out of the gate. I won't tell you what I would do (see my sig :lol: )

Best of luck ahead for ya...