TheSamba.com :: View topic - Engine break in procedure and break in oil

Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:31 pm

I need to break in my 1914. I have read several topics and more opinions on the best way to go ab3out this. Does anyone have a good procedure I could easily follow and a recommendation on how much and for how long I should keep my break in oil in?

It was recommended I use 1 quart then 4 quarts (1.5 extra oil sump and 2 oil coolers along with a remote oil filter) of 10/30 Kennedy Titanium for the break in and keep it in there for 500 miles. But that seems to contradict what I have been reading.

So, here are the specs.
1914
Engle 110 cam
Duel Weber 40s
009 dist
8.5 to 1 compression
Large valve heads
Chrome moly push rods

The trans is a close ratio 1 thru 3 with a tall 4th. This is all sitting on a 63 type 1.

Any help would be appreciated

Thanks

Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:45 pm

You can do that. Man, your engine sure needs a lot of oil! I would use the least expensive 5W30 I could find probably "Castrol". And add a bottle of ZDDP (I used lucas zddp oil additive) then after the first 500 miles go to your preferred oil. You probably don't need all that oil cooling stuff on that engine. I don't know though the W-110 cam did make an engine run a little hot. Sounds like an engine combo for driving across the high desert in the summer. Some of the guys here on the Samba swear that you should change the oil after the cam break-in run of 20 minutes at 2000 rpm. You won't need extra sump or extra oil cooler on a Dog House engine driving in the cool air of the coast.

Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:49 pm

I used google and searched "break in oil zinc"
The top results were
comp cams break in oil
royal purple break in oil
valvoline vr1 racing oil
lucas zddp oil additive
and lucas break in oil

And you know, any of those would probably work.
Everybody thinks it's a conspiracy but I swear to god it's not.

Kennedy is dead, kendal is not dead, it became Brad penn

Brad penn would be a good choice.

Also, joe gibbs, of course, and amsoil

I'd use VR1

Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:58 am

For cam break-in:

Don't use oil too thick or too cold. I had a cam failure from this on my dry sump engine. Not enough oil spraying off rods when too thick/cold even when at 2k revs. This happened in 38 degree weather, leave the oil in the house days before first fire and I like 5w-20 till the cam is broke-in, then I dump it. Adding ONLY one quart for a deep sump and a 1/2 quart on a stock sump engine of Kendal nitro 70 which is also a cheap way to add more ZDDP, it has three times more ZDDP than regular oil and is $4. The oil I use is cheap chevron 5w-20 dino or whatever you like.

With the car level I like overfilling the engine with oil until the oil just starts leaking out the rocker boxes to submerge the cam in oil. Could not do this on my dry-sump engine, scavenge pump worked too well. This way you can let the engine idle if you want. If your car has extra filters or long oil lines you should re-check level after you have oil pressure. I have never had a cam/lifter failure when I've done it this way. The heat generated by the rough machined cam and lifter surfaces can score the parts and then it snowballs, the excess oil keeps them cool. Many opinions but this is what works for me.

Dan

Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:26 am

If you're going to drain the oil after cam break-in (some do), i would leave off the sump and by-pass the coolers (but keep it filtered), it would mean a lot less oil "wasted"...

I use straight Premium 10W or 20W dino oil for break-in, it used to have enough ZDDP, don't know if it still does, though,...

Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:22 am

The oil factor covered, an engine builder has told me that he runs the engines for like 10 minutes...let it cool down then another 10 minutes let it cool down then another 10 minutes. Drain out oil then proceed to driving like you stole it, after adding the proper amount of oil and the typical routine maintenance.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:56 am

gt1953 wrote: The oil factor covered, an engine builder has told me that he runs the engines for like 10 minutes...let it cool down then another 10 minutes let it cool down then another 10 minutes. Drain out oil then proceed to driving like you stole it.

That's more along the lines with what I would do. There's quite a bit of material in the oil from the cam, and various other things wearing in. You could still run the type of oil you used for your initial break in for a few hundred more miles if you want too, but I would change it, and put fresh in after the 3rd 10 minute run. And these running periods are not at idle, but at around 1500-2000 rpm. It's also a good idea to spin the engine over without any spark plugs to make 110% sure you have oil pressure before you actually start the engine. I personally would buy a cheap mechanical gauge from the local parts store to monitor pressure if you don't have one in the car. I personally wouldn't beat on it till the rings are nice, and seated, but engine building shops dyno fresh engines after break in every day.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:52 am

Oil is dirt cheap compared to blowing up a new engine. Brad Penn makes a 30w break-in oil and so do a few other companies. If not use Valvoline 10W-30 VR-1 racing oil. DO NOT break the engine in with 20W-50. I fill all the way to the top full mark on the dipstick then another 1/2 qt. for break-in. Read the directions supplied with all new Engle cams on proper break-in. 1500-1800 RPM for 20-25 minutes. After initial engine break-in allow the engine to cool completely 8-10 hrs. to allow the engine to normalize. Change oil and adjust valves. Tune the carbs and set the timing. After the first 15-20 miles and carb tuning you can hammer down and drive it like you stole it. You DO NOT need to baby the engine the first 500-1000 miles. Change oil and adjust valves again after 300 miles and again at 1000 miles. Then go to regular maintenance.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:12 pm

I like the monkey's method.
I'll keep this in mind a few months from now when I do my startup and break in :)

Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:13 pm

gt1953 wrote: The oil factor covered, an engine builder has told me that he runs the engines for like 10 minutes...let it cool down then another 10 minutes let it cool down then another 10 minutes. Drain out oil then proceed to driving like you stole it. ??? :shock:

Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:55 pm

It amazes me how complex everyone makes such an easy process.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:40 pm

I use quacker state high millage,or another cheep oil for the first run in they claim it has more zinc in it. run for 30-40 minutes max above 1500 rpm, varrying the rpm,set timing&carbs as close as possiable, then change oil&filter. let it fully cool. adjust the valves when cool, then run for another hour adjust the carbs(drive around and give it a few good loaded runs at part to full throttell.but not max rpm,) after the hour to 1.5 max i change the oil & filter again. let it cool. go for some more trips and have fun change toe oil after another 1.5 hours.let it cool. after about 5-8 full heat&cool cycles it should be ready for just about any thing.I usualy do and recomend to all engines I build that they have 4-5 oil changes withen the first 100-200 miles.( the first week for me) oil is cheep and fast to do.and lots of dibris are in the oil, you do not want that stuff in the bearings rasing the oil temps and eating stuff up.ALL NEW ENGINES have debris in the oil, hell you should see a new crate motor that was never run just spun on a test jig.the oil pans have a nice layer of mettell on the inside bottom.they engines are shiped without oil, there spun up and if the load is close to what it should be the oil gets drianed and they go in a crate for sale. all testing can be done with out ever running the engines. piston rings wearing on the cylinder walls are most of the debris in the oil.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:16 pm

Danwvw wrote: You can do that. Man, your engine sure needs a lot of oil! I would use the least expensive 5W30 I could find probably "Castrol". And add a bottle of ZDDP (I used lucas zddp oil additive) then after the first 500 miles go to your preferred oil. You probably don't need all that oil cooling stuff on that engine. I don't know though the W-110 cam did make an engine run a little hot. Sounds like an engine combo for driving across the high desert in the summer. Some of the guys here on the Samba swear that you should change the oil after the cam break-in run of 20 minutes at 2000 rpm. You won't need extra sump or extra oil cooler on a Dog House engine driving in the cool air of the coast.

Thanks for the info. I think the oil coolers are overkill but they came with the car. I have often considered removing one or even both.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:17 pm

jfats808 wrote: It amazes me how complex everyone makes such an easy process.

Do you have a simple process I could follow. I am a big fan of keeping it stupid simple.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:21 pm

vwracerdave wrote: Oil is dirt cheap compared to blowing up a new engine. Brad Penn makes a 30w break-in oil and so do a few other companies. If not use Valvoline 10W-30 VR-1 racing oil. DO NOT break the engine in with 20W-50. I fill all the way to the top full mark on the dipstick then another 1/2 qt. for break-in. Read the directions supplied with all new Engle cams on proper break-in. 1500-1800 RPM for 20-25 minutes. After initial engine break-in allow the engine to cool completely 8-10 hrs. to allow the engine to normalize. Change oil and adjust valves. Tune the carbs and set the timing. After the first 15-20 miles and carb tuning you can hammer down and drive it like you stole it. You DO NOT need to baby the engine the first 500-1000 miles. Change oil and adjust valves again after 300 miles and again at 1000 miles. Then go to regular maintenance.

I have left over Kendal oil from my before I blew up my 1904 and was going to use that along with the royal purple for break in. Then I will be switching to the VR-1 Oil. Thanks for the info.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:22 pm

modok wrote: I used google and searched "break in oil zinc"
The top results were
comp cams break in oil
royal purple break in oil
valvoline vr1 racing oil
lucas zddp oil additive
and lucas break in oil

And you know, any of those would probably work.
Everybody thinks it's a conspiracy but I swear to god it's not.

Kennedy is dead, kendal is not dead, it became Brad penn

Brad penn would be a good choice.

Also, joe gibbs, of course, and amsoil

I'd use VR1

Kennedy is dead. Thank you for the info.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:43 pm

well, I figured by kennedy you meant kendall, which since 1997 is called Brad Penn, and now called penn grade1 but it was a bit of a stretch.

kendal name is just a zombie brand used by conoco.
I have no idea if it's any good. Do you?

Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:11 pm

Kendall Titanium is what came in the original engine that was build in Campbell and the guy really likes it. The only reason I got it was mostly due to liking to keep the same oil in the engine.

Now that I have a new engine and after talking with Jeff at Kaddie Shack he highly recommended the VR-1 and mentioned he was going to have an article in Hot VW's in the near future regarding 6 oils he had tested.

Thanks again for your input about engine break in.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:31 pm

Cool :D
I have seen ZERO problems traced to VR1, and it is also cheap and available in whatever viscosity you need.

Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:21 pm

True about the oil. Let me ask you this (modok) do you have a preferred engine break in method???