A Bluestar from Germany...

SyncroGhia · Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:19 am Post subject:

Hmmm,

I've just plugged 443.199.312 into ETKA and ETOS and that comes up as the Left engine mount bracket.

I'm after the part number from the right engine mount bracket? Maybe they got it mixed up?

Here's a screen print of the SA engine mounting setup.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

443.199.312 is used on many cars so if I have to change to that one, it shouldn't be hard to locate.

Thanks

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Fri May 25, 2012 1:36 pm Post subject:

Well the decision has been made.

The 2.2 AAN is going into Limey and the AVP ( 4.2 40v 360hp S8 V8 ) is going into the Bluestar.

I've driven the S8 daily for the last 3 weeks after having fixed the gearbox. I've enjoyed driving it but it's not a car I want to keep and I'm happy that the engine is good.

The fuel pump died last night so it's now in storage awaiting dismantlement.

If anyone wants any Audi S8 parts... Let me know.

I need to get Limey up and running first and then the Bluestar AVP conversion will happen, again with the 996 C4 gearbox.

I have looked again into the rear cushion and it's thinner that the stock one due to being an air conditioning cushion so I can raise the engine lid a little.

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:25 am Post subject:

Delivery from Germany Very Happy

This was cheap so I'm not fussed about the wear on the flywheel.

It's from an RS4 Audi V6 Twin Turbo and will bolt up to the 40V 4.2 V8 and uses the same timing ring.

At 12.7 KG, it's not light!

I just need to pull the engine out of the S8 now Wink

Oh, just a P.S. on the engine bar to sump clearance on the AAN... I sorted it by 'massaging' the steel sump so that it cleared the engine bar. Photos can been seen in the Limey thread.

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 2:54 am Post subject:

For those interested in Bluestar vans, this one I've just found on ebay is one of the very best that I've seen.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&am...472wt_1392

Makes mine look rather shabby Embarassed

The seller is nothing to do with me... I just keep my eyes open for nice original Bluestar petrol vans.

The diesel vans are always cheaper in Germany because of the emissions regulations now apparent in many city centres.

MG
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jabba · Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 4:59 am Post subject:

Hi Mike,
No way for me to open that link.

SyncroGhia · Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:46 am Post subject:

Jake de Villiers · Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:34 am Post subject:

Geez, that's beautiful! It looks to be brand new - the underside is just amazing.

'Reserve not met' at 13,250 Euros - no kidding, its a brand new van! Wink

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ajdenette · Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:47 pm Post subject:

I see one issue with that van, the female ends of the jumpseats are falling apart Laughing

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SyncroGhia · Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2012 6:42 am Post subject:

A small update.

I've now dismantled the S8, the engine and loom are ready for use.

The loom is simply huge and I expect that sifting through it will probably take as long as fitting the engine to the van.

I've added a little something to the front just to let fellow petrol heads know that it's not a slow VW van Wink

I can't really start the conversion until Limey is up and running but I can collect other parts and look at fitting things like dash clocks etc.

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 2:26 pm Post subject:

Right,

I finally got the V8 down south and have started marrying it up to the 996 gearbox.

Here's the first test fit.

As can be seen in the photo, the holes around the top line up perfectly.

The location dowels line up to the factory holes in the 996 bellhousing so no worries about it not being in line.

The hole at the top left without a bolt in doesn't have a threaded hole in the block and you can't add one as the cylinder is directly behind it.

The left dowel hole isn't drilled in the engine block but there is a threaded hole just above.

Having checked, I can drill through the hole with the dowel and tapp it for M12x1.75 and it'll work well.

The starter motor top bolt is again in line but the lower one isn't. This isn't a surprise but if I had tried fitting this up before having trimmed it for the 5 cylinder engine, I could have left the bolt hole on the bellhousing and drilled into the engine block with a new M12x1.75. However, that said I'd also have to add an extra bolt for the lower starter motor bolt so I don't mind the fact that I have to have a section welded in as expected.

Original flex plate.

Crank spacer removed...

Audi S4 (2.7 Twin Turbo V6) Flywheel check into the 996 bellhousing. It sits proud of the mating surface by around 1.5mm. Not great.

Bolted onto the engine!

This was all going very well until I realised that I could no longer turn the engine.

Having removed the flywheel again and checked, there is a slight raising of material on the back which is interfering with the engine block. It's only 0.5mm or so but it's enough.

Mid measuring...

Also, the reason that the flywheel is sitting proud from the gearbox mating surface is that the centre of the flywheel is raised. This is hitting the input shaft.

It's also hitting the centre of the Porsche 996 friction disc.

I removed the spigot bearing (which incidentally is the correct size for the 996 gearbox input shaft.

A quick check of the S4 flywheel and clutch to see that the Porsche release bearing will work with the pressure plate.

It's spot on.

So, the 5mm snout in the centre of the flywheel face needs machining down and the back of the flywheel needs the raised section (forgot to take a photo!) removing before I can bolt to the two together.

Otherwise... it fits Confused

Once I've had the machining done, I can get on with mounting the engine and gearbox into the van.

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:40 am Post subject:

Update:

I've found a new machine shop in Banbury as the last one was unreliable.

They've machined the areas mentioned down and now the flywheel fits the engine without catching and the engine turns easily again.

The spigot bearing is a bit of a problem.

It's designed to work with the Audi input shaft which obviously has a longer section after the splines. The Porsche 996 input shaft support journal is much shorter and as such only half of it reaches the needles of the bearing.

The journal on the input shaft is only 15mm long.

The needles in the bearing start at about 9-10mm in so there'd only be 5mm or so supported.

I'm looking into alternative bearings that will match my need.

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 11:39 am Post subject:

I've been a little busy with other things but managed to get some time to get back to this this afternoon.

I picked up some bearings from ebay.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360499867140?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

As they're only 5mm deep, I bought two and they'll sit back to back.

They easily slide onto the input shaft of the 996 gearbox...

And are a good fit (not press) into the flywheel. I used bearing retainer to secure them in place. There won't be any axial load on them.

I test fitted the flywheel and clutch and then removed the clutch slave cylinder from the gearbox, offered up the gearbox and felt for play in the clutch release arm.. just a little. Good, no need to shorten or lengthen the slave cylinder rod. The pressure plate is where it needs to be.

Now I go to turn the engine over. All ok and then dead stop. Hmmmmmmm...

Try again the other way... now my engine is making clicking noises, oh bugger.

So... paranoia got the better of me and I ended up thinking that by turning the engine backwards, maybe the timing belt had jumped or maybe the chains had done the same.

I pulled the timing belt covers off and turned the engine clockwise and then anti-clockwise. The timing belt is nice and tight and doesn't slacken up when going either direction. Phew!

Ok now onto the clicking. This was coming from the heads.

I pulled one of the cam covers off and watched the timing chain which runs from exhaust to inlet cam. The chain is going slack and then tight as I turn the engine. Not good. I check out the timing marks... all is well as they line up with the marks on the cam caps. Good! Now I remember that just before I took the car off the road that I had to change the chain tensioners as now and again, they were allowing the chains to run loose and it sounded a bit like a diesel. A common problem but as the fuel pump died, then I stripped the car... I haven't got around to doing it.

Ok so why is the engine locking up?

Pull the gearbox off and look into the bellhousing... no marks.

So the clutch and flywheel come off again. Now I go back to turning the engine and all is fine.

So now I go to the back of the flywheel again!

This little lump is hitting the back of the block.

You can see the shiney bit at about 5 and 7 o'clock... most obviously at 7.

I don't really want to remove metal from the flywheel as it's balanced so I remove a little from the ally on the engine and as is well. I connected up a battery to the starter and span the engine over a few times just to cheer me up Laughing

With all the faffing and me getting paranoid, just bolting up the flywheel, clutch and gearbox has taken quite a while!!

Next move is to get the engine and gearbox mounted into the van... now if it will just stop raining for an hour or two...........

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:11 pm Post subject:

Today the weather was pretty good so I set to with the engine/gearbox install.

This engine and gearbox are very heavy...

My skateboard was having difficulties Laughing

After having rolled the Bluestar down the drive to leave enough room to get the engine passed the front of the van.

Pushing it back up the drive by hand really isn't an option unless there are three people...

So I used a fairly 'Heath Robinson' approach!

A drive full of T3s Smile

Next is to put the van on ramps and a little height assistance from Snap-on.

Even with the spacers holding the suspension up further, I needed a little extra from the jack to get the engine underneath.

Once in position, my skateboard decided that it wasn't going to play ball and the wheel bearings were starting to fail so I had to use a truck strap to just pull the engine and gearbox under the van.

With the engine and gearbox supported on axle stands and the van lowered back down onto it's suspension the engine looks pretty good in position.

With the engine in and as high as I can get it, the lid it sitting on the oil breather canister.

Even with this lack of clearance and with the engine/gearbox sitting parallel to the van, the setup is too low.

The centre point of the gearbox front propshaft flange is 10cm below the bottom of the gearbox mount cross member.

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:30 pm Post subject:

Here's a couple of photos from Patrik's Air-ride Tristar which is running a 1.8T 20V Turbo with 996 C2 gearbox.

You can see that the lower and rear sections of the cross member in the centre have been cut away to allow the snout of the gearbox to move up inside.

The centre line of the front mount bolts is just behind of the rear bolts that hold the mount onto the cross member.

I have the engine positioned in the engine bay so that the timing belt covers are clearing the engine bay rear cross member and so that the air intake is comfortably away from the engine bay front bulkhead.

I'll take some photos of the gearbox position tomorrow but I think mine is further back than Patrik's.

Because I'm running a C4 gearbox, I have the output flange to contend with. This will mean more cutting of the cross member as at some point in the future, I want to use the 4WD.

MG
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Tristar Eric · Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:24 pm Post subject:

Nice job Mike, looks like a tight fit. I really like Patrik's mount, does somebody make the cable shift bits long enough for the transporter?
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insyncro · Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:30 pm Post subject:

SyncroGhia · Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 10:45 am Post subject:

I haven't looked into shifter cables yet. There are several companies offering them and everyone has a different idea as to which shifter to use up front.

I'm set on using the 996 shifter (with short shift kit) but mounted at floor level with a longer rod, as per factory T3. It might not work but I'm going to give it a try before moving onto anything else.

I'm half tempted to remove the output flange from the front of the gearbox just at present so I can have a simple gearbox mount and not have to cut the cross member. I'll ponder on this some more before making a decision.

Today's work was just concentrating on engine/transmission height and ground clearance.

I want it all.. as little mods to lifting the lid but maximum ground clearance. Of course I can't have it all so it'll be a compromise of both.

I got the van back on the floor while supporting the engine from support beam.

The top of the inlet manifold is about an inch above the bed. The injector rail feed pipe sits very high as does the fuel pressure regulator and crankcase breather.

I think that I could have the feed pipe and fuel pressure regulator moved fairly easily and the crankcase breather won't be a problem. Obviously, if I do it this way, none of the nice plastic covers will fit due to height.

With the rear suspension sitting with an inch between the rear bump stops, I have 4 1/2 - 5 inches of clearance from the lowest point of the sump. The engine support bar will sit slightly lower than this (maybe 10mm) so that it takes any damage rather than the sump.

The gearbox is currently sitting 95mm from the floor on the block of wood. If I remove the output flange, I could push it up a little more and make a simple mount similar to Patrik's in the above photos.

I'd like to use a stock shape engine lid, but modify it with some kind of bulge. I'll make up a surrounding board to support the rear cushion but I'm hoping not to have to move it up more than around 30mm.

MG
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 2:10 pm Post subject:

I've just looked at when the last post was.. Dec 2!!

Hmmm right well, things have been moving today.

I've reached a decision, or maybe that should be a realisation that the only way that Limey going to get back on the road is if I bring the shell home and do all of the metal work myself!

I can't do that until the Bluestar is running so... on with the Bluestar!

I bought some steel to build the engine mount bar but was waiting for some brackets that never arrived to make a neat job of bolting up to the chassis... so I figured I'm make my own and change the design.

The box section is 40 x 60mm, 3mm wall thickness.

I spent a lot of today working out angles and cutting out small sections to try and get neat bends etc.

For the moment, I have 3 x M8 bolts holding each side up. I'll add a 4th in between and then probably 3 more horizontally through the bottom of the chassis legs into the engine bar.

I'm using as many factory pick up points as possible and am removing as little as possible of the original bodywork.

Funny shapes these bars!

I reached the point where I realised that I couldn't make the main bar out of one section. The bar needed to change direction in two planes... so I decided to build from the outside in.

Once at this point, I trimmed off the excess, measured and cut a length for the centre.

My welder is on max welding this stuff up.

It may look crooked.. but it's not. The sump is however but it doesn't help when you drop one of these engines! I have a new sump ready to go on.

At last, it's sitting in it's final position!

I will be adding two more lengths of steel from the front sections of the bars, down to just outside the engine mounts. Hopefully that should be strong enough for the 360-380bhp .

Then I have to make a gearbox mount and make up a bracket for the engine stabiliser mount at the back left of the engine bay.

MG
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rubbachicken · Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 3:16 pm Post subject:

very nice, glad to see you are still plugging away at it.
the bolt holes in your brace, are you going to sleeve them, and add extra gussets on the angle changes on the brace, to stiffen it up ??

i think i would if it were mine, a little extra weight, to help hold a lot of power

i like to over engineer
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SyncroGhia · Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:41 am Post subject:

Yes I'll be welding sleeves in. I haven't decided yet whether to up it to M10s rather than M8s. I also like to over engineer a little Smile

Gussets... I haven't decided yet. I think where the bars attach to the horizontal bars I probably will but the rest I think may be ok as they are.

If anyone is looking at this and screaming... "it'll fall out!", please say so Laughing

The part I'm not looking forward to is cutting the gearbox cross member to allow clearance for the drive coming out of the front of the gearbox. If this was a C2 gearbox, I wouldn't have the problem. I do like the idea of adding the front wheel drive to the van later on though.

MG
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