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Akasharaja Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2019 Posts: 40 Location: Shrewsbury, UK
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Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 6:23 am Post subject: Sudden transitory power loss |
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Hey everyone, greetings from this side of the pond!
I have a transient power loss issue in my ‘72 Bay. Three times now there’s been a sudden noticeable power loss, where the engine doesn’t cut out straight away but will no longer respond to the throttle; the dash lights don’t go on until I stop, at which point the engine stalls. I then wait for a few seconds, fire him up and off we go, no problem. There’s been the suggestion over here that the fuel pump might be starting to go, but there are no other obvious symptoms. Or might it be the coil starting to fail? Any suggestions grateful received. |
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pioneer1 Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2008 Posts: 2069 Location: Ontario Canada
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Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:41 am Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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I'd start with clogged fuel filter and or fuel line. Gas seeps past the obstruction to start motor but when you demand more fuel it can't deliver. _________________ "Always waiting for tomorrow ruined everything"
'85 Porsche 911 Targa
'76 Westfalia project |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51169 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:55 am Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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A failing coil wouldn't suddenly recover after a few seconds of sitting, I'd be looking around for someone to borrow one of those snake style inspection cameras off of, sounds like there's a floatie in the tank. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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Akasharaja Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2019 Posts: 40 Location: Shrewsbury, UK
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Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 8:22 am Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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Thanks. I did wonder about the fuel filter letting through little bits of crud that temporarily block the key before being flushed though. The current filter was only fitted last year, and I haven’t don’t that much mileage, but worth a look |
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Akasharaja Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2019 Posts: 40 Location: Shrewsbury, UK
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Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 8:22 am Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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Jet, not key! |
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mikedjames Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2012 Posts: 2745 Location: Hamble, Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 10:26 am Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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I would also check for things like the mechanical fuel pump pivot pin falling out or almost falling out, as well as a filter blockage.
An adhesive label off an aftermarket fuel tank level sender can create this symptom too, floats around, blocks the outlet as the fuel pump sucks it down. You stop and it drifts off as the fuel pump stops sucking. Drive on, no problem until it floats around again.
And if you have an electronic ignition module, these can sometimes fail with age (anything from straight out of the box to years..) and they can become very temperature sensitive.. slow down, airflow changes around distributor, distributor warms up slightly. Electronic module overheats. You stop, it cools down, restart engine, keep driving, no problem... _________________ Ancient vehicles and vessels
1974 VW T2 : Devon Eurovette camper with 1641 DP T1 engine, Progressive carb, full flow oil cooler, EDIS crank timed ignition.
Engine 1: 40k miles (rocker shaft clip fell off), Engine 2: 30k miles (rebuild, dropped valve). Engine 3: a JK Preservation Parts "new" engine, aluminium case: 26k miles: new top end.
Gearbox rebuild 2021 by Bears.
1979 Westerly GK24 24 foot racer/cruiser yacht Forethought of Gosport.
1973 wooden Pacer sailing dinghy |
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Akasharaja Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2019 Posts: 40 Location: Shrewsbury, UK
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Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 7:41 am Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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I’ve just remembered that I do possess an endoscope and will take a look in the tank - floatie theory sounds plausible. _________________ 1972 Bay window bus, partial engine rebuild in 2022, new alternator same year, electronic ignition module. |
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Nicholas D Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2012 Posts: 226 Location: Charleston, SC
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Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 9:20 am Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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I don't know if it's the same with a '72 but my '71 has the sock filter inside the gas tank at the outlet. Not sure if that's the filter you mentioned being fitted last year but if not, don't forget about that one. It has been said by many that this filter can be omitted entirely if you're running an in-line filter further down the line. _________________ 71 Westfalia
73 Beetle |
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Akasharaja Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2019 Posts: 40 Location: Shrewsbury, UK
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Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 10:31 am Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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The filter i mentioned is an inline filter. Easy to replace. I don't know if there's an outlet filter in the tank, which was new 5 years ago. Would that be a standard part? _________________ 1972 Bay window bus, partial engine rebuild in 2022, new alternator same year, electronic ignition module. |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51169 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 1:40 pm Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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Akasharaja wrote: |
Would that be a standard part? |
If it was a genuine VW NOS part, "new" aftermarket means most likely no screen on the inlet.
Crawl under and look at the bottom of the tank where the line comes out, is there a large (~19mm) hex nut where it meets the tank?, or just a smooth nipple welded to the metal? Nut means filter, smooth means you are SOL.
Smooth also means fuel leaves the tank through a single 7-8mm hole, easy to block with a floatie like some of the plastic that sometimes peels off the seal on a bottle of fuel system cleaner, or a label like already mentioned, or some other gift a passerby deposited in your gas filler. It sucks down tight on the tip of the pipe and kills the engine, then when the suction stops it floats away and it runs normally, until the next time the evil swimmer nears the outlet.
I have temporarily solved that problem by shoving 4-5" of mechanics wire up into the inlet, the end of the wire sticking out of the pipe makes it hard for the floatie to make a good seal, but getting the offending detritus out of the tank is always the best long term fix. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22673 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 2:23 pm Post subject: Re: Sudden transitory power loss |
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Little more diagnosis needed
Next time you feel the power loss, quickly drop the clutch and see if the lights come one right away. I ll bet they do.
Leaving the clutch engaged means the motor is still turning over and the lights will stay off, even though the engine has 'stopped' _________________ .ssS! |
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