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philoo Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2006 Posts: 73 Location: France
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2024 8:53 am Post subject: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Hi all
I just got a WW "Okrasa" kit as a gift for my Oval. Nice gift, sure !
I have dilemma... I don't know how much to upgrade the engine. I would like to have your opinion on the best cost/effectiveness compromises of the different configurations below
1 - WW kit only on the stock 36HP
2 - WW kit + big bore cylinders/pistons (1300cc)
3 - WW kit + 69,5 crank (1300cc)
4 - WW kit + 69,5 crank + big bore cylinders pistons (1400cc)
5 - WW kit + 69,5 + big bore + High Performance Camshaft
I don't want to explore 74mm configurations ... I do not need a racing Oval.
At first glance, my choice would a priori go to configuration #2...
looking forward to reading your analysis. And arguments |
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esde Samba Member

Joined: October 20, 2007 Posts: 6174 Location: central rust belt
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2024 9:16 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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I would look into a stroker crank and custom camshaft before big bore cylinders. This will give you opportunity to match the compression ratio to the camshaft, and have something that is optimal for the cc's. In stock form, the 36hp is pretty low compression, 6.6:1. Just slapping nice heads and larger cylinders on doesn't address that.
Options besides the Wolfsburg West for cams are Elgin, Isky, Schneider, and Webcam, and you probably have other options in Europe. _________________ modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
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Alstrup Samba Member
Joined: July 12, 2007 Posts: 7629 Location: Videbaek Denmark
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2024 9:41 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Did you get a "top end" WW kit?
Wrt more displacement. Definitely yes.The Okrasa heads barely functions well at the Okrasa 1286 displacement. Another 100 cc along with a proper valve job makes wonders.
Cam or not sort of depends on the carburetion and exhaust. _________________ https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=435993 |
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philoo Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2006 Posts: 73 Location: France
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2024 9:57 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Alstrup wrote: |
Did you get a "top end" WW kit? |
The heads, carbs, air filters, linkage, manifolds and fuel lines ...
No crank |
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[email protected] Samba Member
Joined: June 24, 2015 Posts: 789 Location: Rialto. CA
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2024 8:37 pm Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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I would go with 4 or 5 options......why not take the advantage of the more power ... |
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philoo Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2006 Posts: 73 Location: France
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2024 2:44 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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I am reluctant for a strong preparation because of the structure and properties of the 36HP case
The Okrasa kits at the time did not go beyond 1300cc, Porsche abandoned this case for powers beyond 55hp... |
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Alstrup Samba Member
Joined: July 12, 2007 Posts: 7629 Location: Videbaek Denmark
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2024 1:22 pm Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Well built 36 hp based engines easily handles 80-90 hp. We build 15-1600´s regularly which pull that kind of power with no issues. Hans biesmann is currently building a 120ish1700 cc. Here you can talk about things getting complicated. Semi full circle crank, slim rods, reduced base circle cam, improved lubrication etc etc. _________________ https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=435993 |
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coolairX2 Samba Member

Joined: September 08, 2003 Posts: 485
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2024 7:28 pm Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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I have been running my Big Bore Okrasa 15xxcc for nearly 20 years with no issues still runs great. Now I am not putting a ton of miles on it, and I am not abusing the engine. At this rate should get another 20 |
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Casperfg Samba Member
Joined: August 31, 2024 Posts: 11
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Posted: Sat Jan 18, 2025 9:26 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Hi there,
Great topic for me as I'm going to have a turnkey engine built for my 57' Oval in pursuit of my version of vintage speed. There is quite an array of options and skilled craftsmen to help make it happen if one chooses. Really fun to imagine the car that meets your desires.
Have you settled on one of the options? |
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wagen19 Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2007 Posts: 245 Location: germany
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Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2025 3:47 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Casperfg wrote: |
Hi there,
Great topic for me as I'm going to have a turnkey engine built for my 57' Oval in pursuit of my version of vintage speed. There is quite an array of options and skilled craftsmen to help make it happen if one chooses. Really fun to imagine the car that meets your desires.
Have you settled on one of the options? |
According to "Jetzt mache ich ihn schneller" Bd. 7, Edition 1, the stock 30 HP crank don´t like high torque and high revs. That cranks often crack under stress.
An original 69,5 okrasa crank or a 74 Porsche crank with stronger 356 rods, 22 pins seems to be a more solid base and is not necessarily a "race engine". Thinking in direction of 356, with "mild" 1500 ccm, 55 HP.
Heads: you can use machined stock, okrasa or 356 pre A heads on a 30 HP VW engine. |
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Casperfg Samba Member
Joined: August 31, 2024 Posts: 11
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Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2025 7:55 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Can you explain what the "22 pins" reference means? |
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Robert Chambers Samba Member

Joined: August 11, 2005 Posts: 224
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Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2025 9:52 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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22 pins is referring to the piston pins being 22 mm. The 36 HP stock pins are 20 mm. _________________ '63 OG 117 Herbie Replica
'56 Euro Oval Deluxe
'52 Standard Zwitter
'63 OG 117 |
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Casperfg Samba Member
Joined: August 31, 2024 Posts: 11
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Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2025 10:03 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Thank you! |
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Alstrup Samba Member
Joined: July 12, 2007 Posts: 7629 Location: Videbaek Denmark
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Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2025 12:09 pm Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Casperfg wrote: |
Hi there,
Great topic for me as I'm going to have a turnkey engine built for my 57' Oval in pursuit of my version of vintage speed. There is quite an array of options and skilled craftsmen to help make it happen if one chooses. Really fun to imagine the car that meets your desires.
Have you settled on one of the options? |
There are so many angles for entrance in this game. Some of it is based on ignorance, other finance, other again just want to be able to bragg about having an Okrasa engine and couldnt care less about how it runs as long as it starts and pulls the car on a trailer.
The "stock" WW Okrasa kit works more or less as intended back in the early 50ies. But as so many other subjects we have learned a thing or two since then. With today´s eyes the stock out of the box 1300 Okrasa is a bit toothless. Perform a proper valve and seat job along with increasing displacement with the 80/81 mm big bore cylinders and the engine really wakes up. Much more than the extra 100 cc would indicate. this is because the cylinderhead port volume is on the large side. By adding a measly 25 cc per cylinder you change the behavior on the engine by a lot.
I would definitely recommend doing that if you plan on driving the thing every once in a while. _________________ https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=435993 |
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Bub Samba Member

Joined: June 10, 2004 Posts: 1236 Location: Central Washington
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Posted: Mon Jan 20, 2025 10:23 am Post subject: Re: Which stage for an Okrasa (WW) project |
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Alstrup wrote: |
Casperfg wrote: |
Hi there,
Great topic for me as I'm going to have a turnkey engine built for my 57' Oval in pursuit of my version of vintage speed. There is quite an array of options and skilled craftsmen to help make it happen if one chooses. Really fun to imagine the car that meets your desires.
Have you settled on one of the options? |
There are so many angles for entrance in this game. Some of it is based on ignorance, other finance, other again just want to be able to bragg about having an Okrasa engine and couldnt care less about how it runs as long as it starts and pulls the car on a trailer.
The "stock" WW Okrasa kit works more or less as intended back in the early 50ies. But as so many other subjects we have learned a thing or two since then. With today´s eyes the stock out of the box 1300 Okrasa is a bit toothless. Perform a proper valve and seat job along with increasing displacement with the 80/81 mm big bore cylinders and the engine really wakes up. Much more than the extra 100 cc would indicate. this is because the cylinderhead port volume is on the large side. By adding a measly 25 cc per cylinder you change the behavior on the engine by a lot.
I would definitely recommend doing that if you plan on driving the thing every once in a while. |
Totally 100% all of this ^ .
I'll just add that you can really build a 36hp at hot end of all these specs and it'll run great. And it's not like you're building it to go for 100k reliable miles anymore.
I'm running an oddball combo with WW carbs, cam, 4 tip exhaust- 80mm big bore, stock heads with 'Okrasa ' valves - and almost ZERO deck.
It runs fantastic even on 110* days over mountain passes.--**
*I did add one of Andrigs Evo 1 fans, THAT is worth doing my friends, massive difference.*
Do NOT leave the WW repro parts as-is, and don't be afraid to really spice it up a little -- you're missing out on alot if you do. _________________
hitest wrote: |
Had a girlfriend once who shall we say, nearly arrived at the mere sight of a semaphore in action- easy to please she was... |
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