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wagen19
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Joined: November 16, 2007
Posts: 565
Location: germany
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 Posted: Thu May 22, 2025 10:13 pm Post subject: Re: Military 1952 Standard |
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[quote="sinclair"]
| wagen19 wrote: |
L344 Reed green is the translation.
Yes I've seen a few descriptions of the military green on birth certificates, but none correct. They seem to pick the closest sounding. Middle green being closest to the Medium Bronze Green used on the BAoR cars. This is very different. |
What makes you sure, the given info, L 13 middle or medium green for some 1952 cars for British Military is allways wrong?
Imo it´s possible, ther was more than only one green tone for british cars between 1945 and 1952 or later on.
Thinking pre mid 49, there was most probably some kind of mixing of paint.
Also I´m thinking about repainting and paintjob repairs, while these cars were in military service. (remembering german Bundeswehr cars and bikes, they often had many lacquer layers of similar nato olive on top of each other.
What about paint code on birth certicicate of your 52?
We need more input about L 11, L 12, L 13. L 14, L 15, L16, L 17, L 18, L 19 pics, relation on which types or vehicles these paints were used.
The British Military repairshops must have had info about, what kind of paint and color, paint code were around. But I doubt, it was that important that times. Main thing, the cars ran! |
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virtanen
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Joined: January 08, 2006
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Location: Finland
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the dominator
Samba Member
Joined: March 18, 2016
Posts: 128
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2025 1:51 am Post subject: Re: Military 1952 Standard |
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| virtanen wrote: |
| Our March 1952 car the birth certificate says "army green". |
Same applies for my Oct 52 11E
_________________
52 Zwitter standard ragtop, parts hunting
67 T2A candywaxred en chestnutbrown
1988 T3 doka synco 2.1WBX |
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sinclair
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Joined: July 01, 2004
Posts: 437
Location: New Forest UK
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2025 2:10 am Post subject: Re: Military 1952 Standard |
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You are right wagen19, I am making assumptions. And the military did tend to regular repaint. My 54 has two green layers and the 52 has four!
I think we can be pretty sure that the 52-53 "Military" or "army green" specified on the birth certs is the Bronze Green used on British army at the time, based on what owners are having to match to their cars when repainting parts.
I'm sceptical about taking the Birth cert as definitive. They frequently contain errors in interpreting codes (paint, trim and options) though dates and locations are probably accurate.
Pre 50 I think more likely to have been an olive of some sort but couldn't comment. They are so few.
Here are a few certificate desctiptions that I have seen for military beetles.
11E- June 52- 151 company -L13 Middle green.
11E- Sept 52- 151 company- Military green.
11E- Oct 52- 17VB- Military Green.
11A- Jan 53- British HQ- Military green.
11E- Aug 53- CCG- L13 Medium Green.
115- Feb 54- CCG- L312 Palm Green.
111- Dec 54- CCG- Not Deposdeted.
111-May 78- GFAF. RAL 6014 |
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the dominator
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Joined: March 18, 2016
Posts: 128
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed May 28, 2025 6:14 am Post subject: Re: Military 1952 Standard |
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| sinclair wrote: |
You are right wagen19, I am making assumptions. And the military did tend to regular repaint. My 54 has two green layers and the 52 has four!
I think we can be pretty sure that the 52-53 "Military" or "army green" specified on the birth certs is the Bronze Green used on British army at the time, based on what owners are having to match to their cars when repainting parts.
I'm sceptical about taking the Birth cert as definitive. They frequently contain errors in interpreting codes (paint, trim and options) though dates and locations are probably accurate.
Pre 50 I think more likely to have been an olive of some sort but couldn't comment. They are so few.
Here are a few certificate desctiptions that I have seen for military beetles.
11E- June 52- 151 company -L13 Middle green.
11E- Sept 52- 151 company- Military green.
11E- Oct 52- 17VB- Military Green.
11A- Jan 53- British HQ- Military green.
11E- Aug 53- CCG- L13 Medium Green.
115- Feb 54- CCG- L312 Palm Green.
111- Dec 54- CCG- Not Deposdeted.
111-May 78- GFAF. RAL 6014 |
I found somewhere, but not sure where it was, that the colour used for our military zwitters (11E) would be the same as Land Rover deep bronze Green LRC001.
Can anyone confirm this?
_________________
52 Zwitter standard ragtop, parts hunting
67 T2A candywaxred en chestnutbrown
1988 T3 doka synco 2.1WBX |
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sinclair
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Joined: July 01, 2004
Posts: 437
Location: New Forest UK
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| Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2025 3:32 am Post subject: Re: Military 1952 Standard |
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| yes that's correct |
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Martin Southwell
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Joined: November 24, 2010
Posts: 1087
Location: Bath, England
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| Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2025 2:29 pm Post subject: Re: Military 1952 Standard |
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| X2, in the main, but there are exceptions. |
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the dominator
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Joined: March 18, 2016
Posts: 128
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2025 10:45 pm Post subject: Re: Military 1952 Standard |
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| sinclair wrote: |
| yes that's correct |
| Martin Southwell wrote: |
| X2, in the main, but there are exceptions. |
I guess for me, when looking at the painttest we have done on original B column, it is the right colour.
The high gloss example is LRC001 , we will top it off with some less glossy clear varnish 
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52 Zwitter standard ragtop, parts hunting
67 T2A candywaxred en chestnutbrown
1988 T3 doka synco 2.1WBX |
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wagen19
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2007
Posts: 565
Location: germany
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2025 2:50 am Post subject: Re: Military 1952 Standard |
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| the dominator wrote: |
| sinclair wrote: |
| yes that's correct |
| Martin Southwell wrote: |
| X2, in the main, but there are exceptions. |
I guess for me, when looking at the painttest we have done on original B column, it is the right colour.
The high gloss example is LRC001 , we will top it off with some less glossy clear varnish
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For me, up to now it´s rather clear, the military cars we are talking about here were manufactured and painted at WOB, or am I wrong?
Cans of paint were available and listed in VW spare books.
Where is the evidence, that VW has ever used paint from GB or the tone LRC001 from a common pait supplier for VW that times?
If LRC001 is possibly correct, what I do not deny, there `must be´a aequivalenl L xx paint code for that tone, imo.
Some posts ago, I´ve listed the eary 2-digit green tones L 11 to L 19. I believe, the military tones must be among these colors.
But who knows better and can show any form of evidence?
As we know meanwhile, the original military paint coming from WOB was more shiny than expected, it seems to be possible, the cars have been repainted outside, very soon after they had left the factory. |
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