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donmac Samba Member

Joined: April 23, 2007 Posts: 367 Location: Pearland, TX
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:59 am Post subject: Is an Engine That Has Sat Full of Water Worth Rebuilding? |
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Bought a '74 Bug for parts. The engine had no plugs or distributor and was full of water/oil. The engine can't be spun. Pulled the valve covers and the valve springs had some surface rust. My question is; is this engine even worth considering for a rebuild? What is likely to be ruined due to rust that might otherwise have been good; crank? cam? Thanks. |
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hon Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2007 Posts: 30
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 7:20 am Post subject: |
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Open it and see if there is anything worth saving. |
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Gary Person of Interest
Joined: November 01, 2002 Posts: 17069 Location: 127.0.0.1
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 7:28 am Post subject: |
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I had an old early Type 2 engine pulled from a car that had about a cup of water that came out with the oil. A friend of mine took it home and opened it up (engine was seized). He went through it and built it up and now uses it as a spare. Give it a whirl and see what you find. _________________ West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624 (1943) |
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joescoolcustoms Samba Member

Joined: August 08, 2006 Posts: 9054 Location: West By God Virginia
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 7:30 am Post subject: |
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What is likely to be ruined due to rust that might otherwise have been good; crank? cam? Thanks. |
Anything up to everything. Engine most likely froze due to water in P/C from open valve and rusted to the point it will not move.
Pay special attention to the sump area of the block. Water, iron and magnesium do not mix very well. The mag will "give" itself up to slow the corrosion of the steel components. I have seen sumps so thin from loosing material to corrosion that they were not usable. But I have also used engines just like you describe to build perfomance engines in the past before new cases where cost effective or avaliable.
So....
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Open it and see if there is anything worth saving. |
_________________ Bad News Racing 2018 NORRA 1000 3rd in Class
Best Day Ever Racing 2022 NORRA 1000 2nd in Class and first All Female team to complete the race
Everyone is gifted. Some just do not open the package.
Looks like it was painted with a live chicken,polished with a brick and buffed with a pine cone |
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tumtum Samba Member

Joined: May 22, 2007 Posts: 221
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 9:02 am Post subject: |
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if you can get in there with a wire brush and take out all the rust it will be fine. _________________ you know what they say about us welders, we do it in all positions, and we have deep penetration! |
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veedubcrazy Samba Member

Joined: February 14, 2005 Posts: 2172 Location: La Porte, Tx.
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 9:09 am Post subject: |
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Here is an engine that I am working on that has some water in it. I think its definitely worth saving as it is a AS21...
This is one pic of an intake. The other side is the same.
Best case, the heads, pistons and cylinders will need to be replace with new parts. _________________ 1967 Deluxe Sedan
1971 Squareback - "The Silver Surfer" |
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[email protected] Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2002 Posts: 4394 Location: Brew City
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 10:57 am Post subject: |
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The primary thing you want to look at is that sump area. Even if it's been severly coroded, it can be fixed as long as the rest of the case is good. |
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Jason C Samba Member

Joined: June 14, 2005 Posts: 1028 Location: Portland Oregon
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:27 pm Post subject: |
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Pour some marvels mystery oil in the plug holes and let it sit a day or two. Then try to turn it over. It would be easier to tear down if you can get it to trun over. _________________ Throw me a bone here. All I wanted were
sharks with friggen laser beams attached to their heads.
64 Bug |
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fredster Samba Member
Joined: June 10, 2007 Posts: 303 Location: Ipswich, UK
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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I bet whatever you find in the crankcase it WILL NOT be as bad as what i found in a junker engine I bought for the tinware. prepare yourselves...
Believe it or not, crankshaft was fine after a good clean! Bearing journals all still shiny. Alternator was good too. This on an engine that had sat outside for seven years. Heads good and in a damn worse state cosmetically than those pictured above. I shit you not. |
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dwayne prince Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2004 Posts: 434
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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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fredster wrote: |
I bet whatever you find in the crankcase it WILL NOT be as bad as what i found in a junker engine I bought for the tinware. prepare yourselves...
Believe it or not, crankshaft was fine after a good clean! Bearing journals all still shiny. Alternator was good too. This on an engine that had sat outside for seven years. Heads good and in a damn worse state cosmetically than those pictured above. I shit you not. |
good god that looks like not just shit but hammered shit |
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joe cool Samba Member

Joined: August 20, 2006 Posts: 1262 Location: Yolo County CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 12:02 am Post subject: |
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I've got a couple of engines from an outdoor lot and I am having a hell of a time getting them apart. I can get the heads off, but it seems that the rings and barrels are rusted together and I can't seem to get them apart or separated from the case. I haven't resorted to destructive measures yet. Any suggestions? The engines were free, I am just hoping for some core parts. |
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num1bum Samba Member

Joined: July 19, 2007 Posts: 26 Location: Chino, CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 12:49 am Post subject: |
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I say yes, a motor that's had water in it is worth rebuilding. Or if your lucky like I was you wont even have to rebuild it, I took the motor out of my bug that had been sitting in a field for a few years, took the heads off and dumped all the rust of the cylnders, put it all back together not expecting much then to my suprise the damn thing ran. This same motor is now used as a back up for either my baja or my sandrail, and currently it is in the sandrail running like a champ. _________________ for 10,000 years, man has been hitting things with hammers to make them work....dont mess with a working formula |
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fredster Samba Member
Joined: June 10, 2007 Posts: 303 Location: Ipswich, UK
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 2:40 am Post subject: |
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joe cool wrote: |
I've got a couple of engines from an outdoor lot and I am having a hell of a time getting them apart. I can get the heads off, but it seems that the rings and barrels are rusted together and I can't seem to get them apart or separated from the case. I haven't resorted to destructive measures yet. Any suggestions? The engines were free, I am just hoping for some core parts. |
I had exactly the same problem with the horror story pictured above. In the end I had to resort to a large sledge-hammer (sorry, uk term). The barrels disintegrated pretty quickly. |
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veedubcrazy Samba Member

Joined: February 14, 2005 Posts: 2172 Location: La Porte, Tx.
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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The same engine above revealed these lovely pix as well...
Inside should be interesting... _________________ 1967 Deluxe Sedan
1971 Squareback - "The Silver Surfer" |
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66zeke Samba Member
Joined: November 20, 2007 Posts: 118 Location: bonsall ca.
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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damn  |
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Glenn  Mr. 010

Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 79428 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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fredster wrote: |
I bet whatever you find in the crankcase it WILL NOT be as bad as what i found in a junker engine I bought for the tinware. prepare yourselves...
Believe it or not, crankshaft was fine after a good clean! Bearing journals all still shiny. Alternator was good too. This on an engine that had sat outside for seven years. Heads good and in a damn worse state cosmetically than those pictured above. I shit you not. |
Damn... almost lost my dinner. _________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי |
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joe cool Samba Member

Joined: August 20, 2006 Posts: 1262 Location: Yolo County CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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fredster wrote: |
joe cool wrote: |
I've got a couple of engines from an outdoor lot and I am having a hell of a time getting them apart. I can get the heads off, but it seems that the rings and barrels are rusted together and I can't seem to get them apart or separated from the case. I haven't resorted to destructive measures yet. Any suggestions? The engines were free, I am just hoping for some core parts. |
I had exactly the same problem with the horror story pictured above. In the end I had to resort to a large sledge-hammer (sorry, uk term). The barrels disintegrated pretty quickly. |
So would the next step for me be to destroy the cylinders in hope of getting to the piston pins? I think so. I hope to save the crank, cam and rods as cores, if the case could be saved that would be a nice bonus. |
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Jason C Samba Member

Joined: June 14, 2005 Posts: 1028 Location: Portland Oregon
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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joe cool wrote: |
I've got a couple of engines from an outdoor lot and I am having a hell of a time getting them apart. I can get the heads off, but it seems that the rings and barrels are rusted together and I can't seem to get them apart or separated from the case. I haven't resorted to destructive measures yet. Any suggestions? The engines were free, I am just hoping for some core parts. |
Tip the engines on their side and pour in marvels mystery oil on the pistons and let it sit over night. The next day flip it over and do the other side. After soaking give them a little tap with a hammer and a wood block to help break them loose. _________________ Throw me a bone here. All I wanted were
sharks with friggen laser beams attached to their heads.
64 Bug |
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69 Jim Samba Member

Joined: September 27, 2004 Posts: 6264 Location: Chickengeorge's Neighbor
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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Glenn wrote: |
fredster wrote: |
I bet whatever you find in the crankcase it WILL NOT be as bad as what i found in a junker engine I bought for the tinware. prepare yourselves...
Believe it or not, crankshaft was fine after a good clean! Bearing journals all still shiny. Alternator was good too. This on an engine that had sat outside for seven years. Heads good and in a damn worse state cosmetically than those pictured above. I shit you not. |
Damn... almost lost my dinner. |
lol-Gex? |
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