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jasonious Samba Member
Joined: January 19, 2006 Posts: 210 Location: Western Washington
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Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2010 9:45 pm Post subject: EMPI Rear Sway Bar Install |
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Anybody install an EMPI rear sway bar? Is there some kind of trick to installing the the long bolts that attach the bar to to the lower shocks? When I put the bushings, washer and spacer on, the bolt appears to be too short to put the nut on. Do you need to compress the bushings in order to get that bolt on? Sees like it would really squish those bushings!
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 17022 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2010 6:53 am Post subject: |
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I'm no help but do have a smart assed question for you. Why in the world would you buy something sold by EMPI? _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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Sage79 Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2008 Posts: 433 Location: Holland MI
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Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2010 7:59 am Post subject: |
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Let's ignore the smart ass.
I installed the EMPI kit recently (I got a good deal on it here on Samba). The bolts are 5-1/2" long and I have about 7/16" of exposed bolt left after tightening the nut. I've been happy with it, although it does hang down pretty low in the center. My bus is stock height so there's still tons of clearance.
I was careful to locate my bar under nuetral load conditions (not jacked up) but may have used the wheel motion to help install the bolts.
Hope that helps. _________________ Dirk
'79 Westy 2.0FI
'73 Sportsmobile 1.7dual Solex 003Auto - now my daughter's
'77 delux 2.0FI 090Auto - now my son's |
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jasonious Samba Member
Joined: January 19, 2006 Posts: 210 Location: Western Washington
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Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2010 8:05 am Post subject: |
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Sage79 wrote: |
Let's ignore the smart ass.
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Yes, let us ignore him.
Thanks for the tip, I'll give it a try off the jack stands. |
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nathansnathan Samba Member
Joined: April 14, 2008 Posts: 1671
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Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2010 8:06 am Post subject: |
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In my experience, sway bar bushings do get squished down pretty good. You may have to 'pre-squish'
I've got an EMPI trigger shifter I've been running for about 5 years. To engage reverse required filing the flat on the ball for about 2 hours upon install. You can see the rivets flex when you move it, but still going. |
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Tuna Tim Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2005 Posts: 181 Location: Saddlerock, Aurora, Colorado
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Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2010 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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jasonious wrote: |
Sage79 wrote: |
Let's ignore the smart ass.
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Yes, let us ignore him.
Thanks for the tip, I'll give it a try off the jack stands. |
Well, I certainly understand the reluctance to include EMPI parts in my bus' DNA. I have had this EMPI rear sway bar on my vehicle for about four (4) years now. It has held up well and performed superbly. After I got over my EMPI revulsion I realized that 'Sometimes a sway bar is just a sway bar'.
I would suggest you coat the bushing hardware (cups, spacers, nuts, bolts) with a rust preventative. The bar itself has stood up to the elements magnificently.
You will appreciate the handling improvement provided by a rear sway bar. It far exceeds the improvement seen when only replacing the front bar with a heavier version. This observation substantiates Ratwell's observations. _________________ 1974 Bay
CSII
091
Dual 40 Dells
Unilite
Thunderbird Extractor |
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HBwesty Samba Member
Joined: December 29, 2006 Posts: 173 Location: HB, CA
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Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 11:46 am Post subject: |
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I agree, most sway bars are pretty much the same. I have had my Empi on for over a year and works fine. In fact, unless stand corrected, I saw picture of a sway away kit that looked identical to the Empi kit _________________ Have you ever noticed, in traffic, anybody going slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac
69 Campmobile
65 Bug
06 New Beetle |
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VWDruid Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2008 Posts: 1192 Location: Boca de Ratones FL
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Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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I got a second hand sway bar but it's missing some of the brackets and instructions.
if some one can scan the mounting instructions or snap some picks of the mounting are showing how the 7/8 bushing are mounted to the body.
Thanks. _________________ 70 Westy, 2027cc "dual DRLA 40 m140 i55 wjdoc a165 p33 v30 "w100 straight cut 040 polished heads 1.25 rockers 1.5 A1sidewinder supertrapp muffler trans 091 coil SUM-850500 CDI universal svda Pertronix
http://www.storyofstuff.com/
It's not the straight cut gears It's the T.A.R.D.I.S. engine.
wanted Chameleon Circuit |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 17022 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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Here's some pics of one mounted onto a 1968 bus
_________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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VWDruid Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2008 Posts: 1192 Location: Boca de Ratones FL
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Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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thanks Aeromech.
but I'm looking for the rear sway bar. _________________ 70 Westy, 2027cc "dual DRLA 40 m140 i55 wjdoc a165 p33 v30 "w100 straight cut 040 polished heads 1.25 rockers 1.5 A1sidewinder supertrapp muffler trans 091 coil SUM-850500 CDI universal svda Pertronix
http://www.storyofstuff.com/
It's not the straight cut gears It's the T.A.R.D.I.S. engine.
wanted Chameleon Circuit |
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Amskeptic Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2002 Posts: 8568 Location: All Across The Country
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Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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Tuna Tim wrote: |
You will appreciate the handling improvement provided by a rear sway bar. It far exceeds the improvement seen when only replacing the front bar with a heavier version. This observation substantiates Ratwell's observations. |
I don't think so. Ratwell and I went head-to-head on that one.
Ratwell wrote on his site:
When I finally located some high end shocks for ths bus and I removed the rear sway bar and this so far has been my favorite combination: oil filled shocks and a HD front sway bar provides best balance of handling and comfort.
Now that I am old and crotchety, I prefer to play with people mercilessly on this very topic.
For example: what does a "sway bar" really do?
How does a rear bar help a VW bus or any rear-engined car if they act as a negative, they reduce traction at the axle they're installed on?
Colin I'll Wait Right Here _________________ www.itinerant-air-cooled.com |
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TomWesty Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2007 Posts: 3482 Location: Wyoming,USA
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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I'm with Colin. Don't you just eliminate IRS with the rear sway? _________________ If you haven't bled on them, you haven't worked on them.
Visit: www.tomcoryell.com and check out my music! |
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ned Samba Member
Joined: June 28, 2004 Posts: 1574 Location: Arroyo Grande Ca.
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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EMPI is the only manufacturer that I found for that sway away. I would have prefered to buy something else. But in awswer to the OP it looks like you have it right. The debate about improved handling is the same as the pancake vs. upright debate. I do not recommend the rear sway away for off road use. |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50444
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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Anybody have pics of older rear sway bars installs from when there were other brands than EMPI on the market. Just having the bar sticking down that far would keep me from even trying one out. I can just envision a 3" diameter stick getting hung up in the bar and doing severe damage to the transmission, axles, or something. |
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VWDruid Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2008 Posts: 1192 Location: Boca de Ratones FL
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 6:39 pm Post subject: |
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Ned I was trying to keep all the rear sway bar fitment stuff in one thread.
VWDruid wrote: |
I got a second hand sway bar but it's missing some of the brackets and instructions.
if some one can scan the mounting instructions or snap some picks of the mounting are showing how the 7/8 bushing are mounted to the body.
Thanks. |
Wildthings
a broken image from Ratwell site
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://homepag...29,r:2,s:0 _________________ 70 Westy, 2027cc "dual DRLA 40 m140 i55 wjdoc a165 p33 v30 "w100 straight cut 040 polished heads 1.25 rockers 1.5 A1sidewinder supertrapp muffler trans 091 coil SUM-850500 CDI universal svda Pertronix
http://www.storyofstuff.com/
It's not the straight cut gears It's the T.A.R.D.I.S. engine.
wanted Chameleon Circuit |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50444
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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VWDruid wrote: |
Wildthings
a broken image from Ratwell site
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Thanks, doesn't look like that design sticks down as far.
I might just put rear sway bars in the list of things to look for when I haunt the wrecking yards. |
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ned Samba Member
Joined: June 28, 2004 Posts: 1574 Location: Arroyo Grande Ca.
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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Hey Druid I apologize for missing your comment. I have been accused of being a little slow on the up take. Sorry. |
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josefprem Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2010 Posts: 18 Location: DFW Area, TX
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:52 pm Post subject: Questions about sway bars |
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I have a 69 bay window and am a "new guy" when it comes to working on cars.
Removed the front sway bar as I am tearing apart the bus I am planning to restore. How can I tell if it is worth reusing? If I should replace it with an HD model, can I get a suggestion?
Also, I twisted off the bolt head on the torsion arm as I was removing the bar, the nut came off the other side ok, but it looks like the bolt is welded in there. Any problem drilling it out and reusing the torsion arm? I don't see why not.
_________________ "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence then is not an act, but a habit.” ~ Aristotle |
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VWDruid Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2008 Posts: 1192 Location: Boca de Ratones FL
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tat2ace Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2010 Posts: 44 Location: new philadephia, ohio 44663
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Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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Recently installed a 7/8" EMPI front sway bar from Bus Boys. It makes a huge differance, I couldn't believe it. I can drive the freeway now! Best thing I've done for my bus. |
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