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samwise
Samba Member
Joined: May 04, 2010
Posts: 611
Location: North Salt Lake, Utah
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 Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:15 am Post subject: |
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Hey Ben, good to see you start up your thread here (it's Rallybug from the other site!).
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Ben
1979 7-passenger bus
Harvee the Wonder Bus' pics |
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Bendejo
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2012
Posts: 122
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:48 am Post subject: |
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Last night there was a post concerning hacking up a nice bus. Leroy is far from nice. Many years of careless hippy driving and "repairs" show in almost every area. I don't intend this to be a show bus that rarely gets driven. I've done my level best to make this a reliable vehicle and drive it daily. My plan for the heater is a self contained unit from summit racing called the Mojave. The dimensions look right for between the front seats in a console (maybe cupholders!!), with ducting into the heater tree under the floor and two vents blasting heat at the boys. On our return trip from NM, my kids stayed in sleeping bags almost the whole time.
I guess I just think the end justifies the means of keeping another bus rolling down the road, having adventures, and making memories. |
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secretsubmariner
Champagne Wrangler
Joined: January 08, 2011
Posts: 3109
Location: Tulsa, OK
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:59 am Post subject: |
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Nice dude. I'm with you on that. If I could do a VW watercooled swap by myself for cheap, I'd certainly consider it. Seems like it'd play nicer with all the other cars on the road these days.
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-Tony
ᏣᎳᎩᎯ ᎠᏰᎵ
1978 Champagne Edition Bus FI
1970 Auto Fastback FI |
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Kirk
Samba Member
Joined: December 05, 2003
Posts: 5492
Location: North Texas
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:02 am Post subject: |
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| BusterBrown wrote: |
It's a big enough world for each of us to be happy in our own sandbox.  |
Best way I've seen it said yet.
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MAKE FORUMS GREAT AGAIN
Bear
Fasty
Super |
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Stuartzickefoose
Samba Post Whore
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 10350
Location: SoCal for now...
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:41 am Post subject: |
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| Kirk wrote: |
| BusterBrown wrote: |
| It's a big enough world for each of us to be happy in our own sandbox. |
Best way I've seen it said yet. |
x2
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Stuart Zickefoose
2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual
206-841-7324
[email protected] |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20857
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 10:07 am Post subject: |
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Nice setup. I have been considering a WC swap in my 70. I love to see the different approaches taken to solve the myriad problems that arise. Looking forward to more post and pics of this conversion.
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Confusious say it takes it takes two wipes to know you need three, but it takes three wipes to know it only needed two. |
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aryue
Samba Member
Joined: January 16, 2006
Posts: 1027
Location: Austin, TX
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:27 pm Post subject: |
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Is that photo with the engine mounted?
If it is, it doesn't hang down too low in the back.
Well done - I'll be sticking with an aircooler - but I've always admired the Mexican and Brazilian water cooled Buses.
- Andrew in Austin, TX -
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OldandSlow - but still chuggin.
http://www.ph.utexas.edu/~yue/VW/VWBus.html |
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a1steaksauce
Samba Member
Joined: September 23, 2010
Posts: 612
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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you got me excited from the other thread when you said you put an aba motor in your bus....then i come in and see a bastardized half swap with outdated FI. 
your work is very nice and clean however, the swap looks great..and congrats overall on the swap...i like the radiator setup for sure. clean under mount setup no doubt.
still would love to see someone go full aba on a bay. i'm curious if the manifold for an aba motor would clear the rear shelf. |
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Stuartzickefoose
Samba Post Whore
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 10350
Location: SoCal for now...
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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| a1steaksauce wrote: |
you got me excited from the other thread when you said you put an aba motor in your bus....then i come in and see a bastardized half swap with outdated FI.
your work is very nice and clean however, the swap looks great..and congrats overall on the swap...i like the radiator setup for sure. clean under mount setup no doubt.
still would love to see someone go full aba on a bay. i'm curious if the manifold for an aba motor would clear the rear shelf. |
i couldnt tell ya where to start looking, but i have seen it done...check google images....lots of info there i bet.
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Stuart Zickefoose
2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual
206-841-7324
[email protected] |
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a1steaksauce
Samba Member
Joined: September 23, 2010
Posts: 612
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Stuartzickefoose wrote: |
i couldnt tell ya where to start looking, but i have seen it done...check google images....lots of info there i bet. |
if you've seen it before then i'll have to do more digging.
i've found plenty of vanagon's with the swap, but all bays i've come across thus far have only done the half swap.
*end thread jack.
i'm interested in seeing what work around you did for your coolant flange at the side of the head as you said that was a problem going in. |
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Bendejo
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2012
Posts: 122
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:56 am Post subject: |
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| a1steaksauce wrote: |
you got me excited from the other thread when you said you put an aba motor in your bus....then i come in and see a bastardized half swap with outdated FI.
your work is very nice and clean however, the swap looks great..and congrats overall on the swap...i like the radiator setup for sure. clean under mount setup no doubt.
still would love to see someone go full aba on a bay. i'm curious if the manifold for an aba motor would clear the rear shelf. |
The overall height wasn't the problem with the ABA crossflow setup, the coolang flange was. If you're willing to section out a fuel tank and lose a little fuel range (I wasn't) it would fit. |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17871
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:01 am Post subject: |
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The peoblem with a ABA swap is you need a speed sensor and the cluster so it dosent go into limp mode. When I did the ABA swap in my jetta I used the 2.0 lower end, ABA head gasket and a big valve CIS head (my car is a 86) I did a ton of other work too but no joke that engine I put together has a torque line....no curve  I can be in second gear just rolling and mat the pedal and smoke pours off both tires. Ask schell...he has seen the car.
If I was going to do a inline 4 to a bus I would totally use a ABA lower end. The rods are 15mm longer so the overall engine is taller but the torque is amazing. That is what we need gobs and gobs of useable torque.
If you really wanted to have fun do a digi 1 swap from a G60 and with a healthy charger and enjoy the ride
Sorry the watercooled part of me slipped out here
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Bendejo
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2012
Posts: 122
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:19 am Post subject: |
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Sad to report that I think my spirited test driving may have caused Leroy some pain. Twice yesterday and once this morning, the transmission wouldn't come out of fourth gear. I guess I'll have to pull the motor and tranny to have a look in the nosecone and hopefully find a broken bracket. Worst csae scenario is a new tran$mi$$ion freeway flyer style.
During my build I paid attention to access for working on it so the job won't be too bad.
One more sacrifice to the gods of horsepower. |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17871
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:30 am Post subject: |
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That sucks..... the power of 8 angry valves 
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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FNGRUVN
Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2007
Posts: 2237
Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 6:12 am Post subject: |
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| a1steaksauce wrote: |
you got me excited from the other thread when you said you put an aba motor in your bus....then i come in and see a bastardized half swap with outdated FI.
your work is very nice and clean however, the swap looks great..and congrats overall on the swap...i like the radiator setup for sure. clean under mount setup no doubt.
still would love to see someone go full aba on a bay. i'm curious if the manifold for an aba motor would clear the rear shelf. |
So why don't you be the first to jump in there and show the rest of us how a conversion is supposed to look like. 
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"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin |
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a1steaksauce
Samba Member
Joined: September 23, 2010
Posts: 612
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 9:18 am Post subject: |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| The peoblem with a ABA swap is you need a speed sensor and the cluster so it dosent go into limp mode |
Incorrect. If your donor is of mk3 years there's no need to run the VSS. And it does not matter if it's obdI or obdII motor. not running the VSS with the earlier non fly by wire aba's will not cause any issues.
Likewise you could easily wire up the stock engine management with just a couple of wires.
| FNGRUVN wrote: |
| So why don't you be the first to jump in there and show the rest of us how a conversion is supposed to look like. |
The op stated in another thread that he put an aba in his bay and I assumed he put a full aba swap in there. I play in the water cooled world as well, and when someone says they put in an aba motor they usually mean a full swap. So I assumed incorrectly in this case, no biggie. Nowhere did I say what a conversion "should" look like, I just incorrectly assumed the op's original statement.
*back on topic
Damn shame about the transmission. And you said that the water outlet on the side would be hitting the gas tank? Or would it just hit the firewall?
Last edited by a1steaksauce on Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:20 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bendejo
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2012
Posts: 122
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:17 am Post subject: |
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[quote="a1steaksauce*back on topic
Damn shame about the transmission. And you said that the water outlet on the side would be hitting the gas tank? Or would it just hit the firewall?[/quote]
The tank, for sure. I modified the existing firewall to clear the tank seam by about 1/8" and currently have a pretty tight fit between the rear of the 1.8 head with the outlet blocked off. I think the ABA could be done with cutting a section out of the tank, but that's outside of my skill set. I still have the ABA head and ECU/ harness in case I meet someone in the future who likes to do great welding on old fuel tanks for beer.
The problem as I saw it was the fact the ABA head has only one outlet, on the flywheel end of the engine. Maybe a cu$tom machined water neck. |
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a1steaksauce
Samba Member
Joined: September 23, 2010
Posts: 612
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Bendejo wrote: |
The tank, for sure. I modified the existing firewall to clear the tank seam by about 1/8" and currently have a pretty tight fit between the rear of the 1.8 head with the outlet blocked off. I think the ABA could be done with cutting a section out of the tank, but that's outside of my skill set. I still have the ABA head and ECU/ harness in case I meet someone in the future who likes to do great welding on old fuel tanks for beer.
The problem as I saw it was the fact the ABA head has only one outlet, on the flywheel end of the engine. Maybe a cu$tom machined water neck. |
i went and popped my head out in the garage and looked over an aba i had laying around...you're right the stock flange off the head is far too long. however, if you were to put one off a 1.8 on there then it would be much smaller. and better still if you took some aluminum tube and made a gentle 90 degree bend off that flange you'd be in business. only downside is you'd have to make a couple of bungs for the two coolant sensors. honestly, not to difficult or expensive for a machine shop to accomplish.
where do you think the coolant flange port sits in relation to the seam on the fuel tank? i'm hoping above, as it wouldn't be that hard to notch a small section 1 to 2 inches inwards on the gas tank. |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17871
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="a1steaksauce"]
| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| The peoblem with a ABA swap is you need a speed sensor and the cluster so it dosent go into limp mode |
Incorrect. If your donor is of mk3 years there's no need to run the VSS. And it does not matter if it's obdI or obdII motor. not running the VSS with the earlier non fly by wire aba's will not cause any issues.
Likewise you could easily wire up the stock engine management with just a couple of wires.
| FNGRUVN wrote: |
| So why don't you be the first to jump in there and show the rest of us how a conversion is supposed to look like. |
please enlighten me. how are you wiring your swaps without throwing mr. motronic into fits. seriously, i would like to know it would save me a ton of work. of the 4 swaps i have done, 2 bucked and ran like shit, 1 i did the full harness, dash, a/c etc and the last one ran great. for 3 days before it bucked and ran like shit. i did however fool with a A2 cluster from a GLI with the MFA and cruise. that took care of the problem.
before i sold it, my VAG COM would work in all of the cars.
so, please tell me the easy way of wiring up a ABA swap 
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Charla
Samba Member
Joined: March 15, 2012
Posts: 93
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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Here there guys. I'm the other half that Bendejo refers to playing the role of Press Secretary, Information Minister, and Garage Nurse. It's a lot of work but someone has to do it. 
Here's a bit more of the story......
(posts copied from another forum)
Ben has been pretty thin with the details so far.
He didn't mention the weeks of agonizing over the "convert or not convert" issue, then the weeks of "which motor" issue. Hours and hours and hours of time spent researching forums and weighing pros and cons. Once he decided to do it he said "next winter" that made me laugh, I knew there was no way he would be able to wait a full year to start the project.
As much as we wanted to keep Leroy Brown stock it finally came down to the fact that keeping a classic Type 4 motor in good running shape with the abuse we've been throwing at it would have been cost prohibitive. Parts are getting more rare every year, are expensive, and many are simply unobtainable.
We spent a day at the junk yard just looking at motors and weighing options. Ben had a list of possible candidates that people have been using in Bajas and some buses but he needed to see them to get a gauge on what the possible issues might be. The Chevy Ecotec was the front runner that morning but by the end of the day it was crossed off the list in favor of the Subaru. The troubling part about the Subaru was that every one of the cars in the lot had an engine compartment that was stripped clean. Subaru motors are in high demand around here so that didn't bode well for being able to find a cheap one. There were however, lots of 2 liter VW's there with relatively untouched engine compartments. Ben was intrigued by the VW motor and started looking at it more closely. There would definitely be some issues to deal with but it became a solid runner up to the Subaru.
Time to hit Craigslist to see what was out there....
Well wouldn't you know......
I want an air cooled VW engine in exchange for my 2.0 water cooled. This motor is in a baja right now complete with all wiring, radiator, fan and shroud and runs/drives great. If you have an air cooled motor in excellent running condition call me @ ###-###-####. Thanks for looking!
When Ben found this listing and mentioned it to me I said to call the guy. Ben says "That's got to be too good to be true, sounds fishy to me."
"So what's it going to hurt to call him?"
A couple days later Ben calls me and says that he just talked to the guy and he's very interested. They made plans to meet up the next day. |
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