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candyman
Samba Trout Slayer
Joined: December 20, 2003
Posts: 2717
Location: Missoula MT
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 Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2021 3:28 pm Post subject: Decoupler bearing |
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Hey all,
So my decoupler has gotten really loud. Using a stethoscope with the van on a rack ive pinpointed the noise to the nose cone tip of the decoupler. Right where the driveshaft connects. There is a bearing that rides in there but I am seeing if anyone has experience with this. That bearing is loud as hell, rumbly and whiney.
I bought the decoupler from VC back in 2015 it only has about 40k miles on it. Looks like there was a change in 2016 to their decouplers? Anyways I want to try and source it. Heres the deal Im leaving for a 2 week road trip in 2 weeks so time is crucial. I am trying to make it to DOB.
I did reach out to VC about that bearing but no word back yet
Two options if I can not locate that bearing in time are
If I were to remove my drive shaft will that bearing still be spinning? I am concerned that it is puking metal into my trans oil. If not that would make it still drivable?
Or does anyone have a non decoupler nose cone they would rent to me in the meantime.
Anyone have experience rebuilding a decoupler? Looks pretty straightforward to me. Also there must be an oil seal in there as well. Does anyone know if that is the same oil seal that is used inside the front diff?
FYI this van was never towed so I am at a loss as to why this bearing is wearing out
Thanks! |
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crazyvwvanman
Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2008
Posts: 10466
Location: Orbiting San Diego
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| Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2021 6:36 pm Post subject: Re: Decoupler bearing |
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It looks to be a pretty common output shaft bearing found in many vehicles.
I see lots of cross reference numbers to the same bearing.
If you have a bearing supply house near you could pay them a visit and possibly get it off the shelf.
ball bearing
30x62x16 mm
VW# 094 301 133
Mark |
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mackaymanx
Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2006
Posts: 480
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2021 7:05 pm Post subject: Re: Decoupler bearing |
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This is a special tolerance bearing, it runs a tighter clearance. I got a decoupler from an American supplier who I decline to name but known to most people. I had to change the bearing to a SKF bearing while chasing driveline vibration, this improved my vibration problem but unfortunately not totally. The installed bearing was a Nachi which are good Japanese brand but does not have the correct clearance, after talking to the SKF guys they advised me that in that size range their bearing does meet the required tolerance.
So any old bearing will not do.
If you a have trouble finding a seal try a Honda one, I have used them with success. The only difference is the height of 11.3 being out by 0.2mm, but they do work.
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/172786208211?hash=item283adc4dd3:g:7nIAAOSwlmxZbzpf&frcectupt=true
P.S. that bearing can be replaced in situ with care.
_________________
[url=http://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate2-18600.png]Click to view image[/URL] |
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crazyvwvanman
Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2008
Posts: 10466
Location: Orbiting San Diego
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 10804
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 6:40 am Post subject: Re: Decoupler bearing |
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| mackaymanx wrote: |
| This is a special tolerance bearing, it runs a tighter clearance. |
Yes if you have a VanCafe decoupler, your bearing is a “C3” (ooops) C2 tighter tolerance bearing, it costs much more than the “C2” C3 that Weddle sells. Maybe 4x or 5x as much as the “C2” C3. It part of an effort to eliminate contributors to driveline vibration.
I’d drain the trans and remove that 6-bolt cover to listen into the lowgear housing at idle in neutral.
Normally theres gear noise anyway due to all the monkey business of the 6:1 granny & reverse (its like the transfer case). Other problems pop up in the lowgear housing more likely than the decoupler. I think You gotta know this before driving to Bend.
Its pretty unlikely for the decoupler bearing to go bad. It has no load on it unless the driveline goes bad, all it does is hold everything in line and its a fairly big bearing just for that. Normally the decoupler housing that holds the bearing goes bad.
OK, all that said,,,,,,I had trouble with my decoupler, the shift fork e-clip came off and rubbed on stuff, and filled my new trans full of trash. New trans with only 300 miles. I was focusing on flushing out the break-in trash, but it wasn’t depleting, rather making more, bigger trash all the time. This was kind of painful. That (new!) trans is still apart (since 2016).
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, NEW oil rings (!) 2Peloquins, 3knobs, SyncroShop pressure-oiled pinion-bearing & GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox.
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered original gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb
Last edited by Sodo on Fri Aug 13, 2021 8:49 am; edited 1 time in total |
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candyman
Samba Trout Slayer
Joined: December 20, 2003
Posts: 2717
Location: Missoula MT
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 7:14 am Post subject: Re: Decoupler bearing |
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| Sodo wrote: |
| mackaymanx wrote: |
| This is a special tolerance bearing, it runs a tighter clearance. |
Yes if you have a VanCafe decoupler, your bearing is a “C3” tighter tolerance bearing, it costs much more than the C2 that Weddle sells. Maybe 4x or 5x as much as the C2. It part of an effort to eliminate contributors to driveline vibration.
I’d drain the trans and remove that 6-bolt cover to listen into the lowgear housing at idle in neutral.
Normally theres gear noise anyway due to all the monkey business of the 6:1 granny & reverse (its like the transfer case). Other problems pop up in the lowgear housing more likely than the decoupler. I think You gotta know this before driving to Bend.
Its pretty unlikely for the decoupler bearing to go bad. It has no load on it unless the driveline goes bad, all it does is hold everything in line and its a fairly big bearing just for that. Normally the decoupler housing that holds the bearing goes bad.
OK, all that said,,,,,,I had trouble with my decoupler, the shift fork e-clip came off and rubbed on stuff, and filled my new trans full of trash. New trans with only 300 miles. I was focusing on flushing out the break-in trash, but it wasn’t depleting, rather making more, bigger trash all the time. This was kind of painful. That (new!) trans is still apart (since 2016). |
Thanks Tom
We are pretty confident the noise is coming from the decoupler and specifically the nose cone section where the bearing rides. We had it on my buddies rack at the honda dealership he works at. We ran it in all gears and stethoscoped all around the mainbox, decoupler and front diff. All the bearings in trans and front were quiet but the decoupler was loud as hell. I guess next step is to pull the decoupler and see what the extent of damage is.
Again, this van has never been towed so the fact that something is failing in the decoupler is pretty disappointing. The drive shaft is a new donutless GW shaft.
Anyone have a syncro nose cone laying around by chance? |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 10804
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 9:28 am Post subject: Re: Decoupler bearing |
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| candyman wrote: |
If I were to remove my drive shaft will that bearing still be spinning? I am concerned that it is puking metal into my trans oil. If not that would make it still drivable?
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Remove driveshaft and decouple.
Then the flange is un-powered but likely it will freewheel.
So you could ziptie it, to NOT spin the nosecone bearing.
But I would take the decoupler off and look.
And if nothing alarming …. Look under that 6-bolt cover.
And you could take the “coupler spline” and stuff out if you can’t find a nosecone to borrow.
I have a nosecone I could send you in time for DOB but I’m 900 miles from home right now. It hurts me to think of a brother forced to drive in 2wd!!🤣🤣
The only noise you should tolerate is the buzz of your compound granny (and reverse) while __in neutral__. Any other noises ……. you should stop driving that tranny. Those days are over.
But best of course is to call SyncroShop!
He won’t stand for a decoupler problem and no phonecall,
If hes reading this I’ll bet he’s thinking of how to drive to Montana to rip it out of your van.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, NEW oil rings (!) 2Peloquins, 3knobs, SyncroShop pressure-oiled pinion-bearing & GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox.
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered original gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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candyman
Samba Trout Slayer
Joined: December 20, 2003
Posts: 2717
Location: Missoula MT
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 11:45 am Post subject: Re: Decoupler bearing |
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| Sodo wrote: |
| candyman wrote: |
If I were to remove my drive shaft will that bearing still be spinning? I am concerned that it is puking metal into my trans oil. If not that would make it still drivable?
|
Remove driveshaft and decouple.
Then the flange is un-powered but likely it will freewheel.
So you could ziptie it, to NOT spin the nosecone bearing.
But I would take the decoupler off and look.
And if nothing alarming …. Look under that 6-bolt cover.
And you could take the “coupler spline” and stuff out if you can’t find a nosecone to borrow.
I have a nosecone I could send you in time for DOB but I’m 900 miles from home right now. It hurts me to think of a brother forced to drive in 2wd!!🤣🤣
The only noise you should tolerate is the buzz of your compound granny (and reverse) while __in neutral__. Any other noises ……. you should stop driving that tranny. Those days are over.
But best of course is to call SyncroShop!
He won’t stand for a decoupler problem and no phonecall,
If hes reading this I’ll bet he’s thinking of how to drive to Montana to rip it out of your van. |
Thanks Tom, just got off a long super beneficial call with the master. He’s getting me squared me away! |
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