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nemofulcrum
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2012
Posts: 126
Location: Nebraska
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 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 6:22 pm Post subject: Hot VW power 300HP |
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Hot VW magazine, has an article on a pair of racing beetles that have 420WHP.
For mere mortals what does an air-cooled turbo engine that could put down 300hp crank or wheel (flutters, no blow off) looks like? Size? Ballpark cost of engine and trans that can handle it?
Inquiring minds want to know 
Thanks in advance!
Last edited by nemofulcrum on Tue Dec 13, 2022 7:15 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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nemofulcrum
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2012
Posts: 126
Location: Nebraska
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 7:02 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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My kids have been playing with some bugs, I may have caught the nostalgia bug.
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Rickf1985
Samba Member
Joined: November 26, 2022
Posts: 285
Location: NJ
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 7:29 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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| nemofulcrum wrote: |
Hot VW magazine, has an article on a pair of racing beetles that have 420WHP.
For mere mortals what does an air-cooled turbo engine that could put down 300hp crank or wheel (flutters, no blow off) looks like? Size? Ballpark cost of engine and trans that can handle it?
Inquiring minds want to know
Thanks in advance! |
If you have to ask............... You probably can't afford it.  
There is an old saying in the racing world, "Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?". That saying says it all. |
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rosevillain
Samba Member
Joined: December 28, 2005
Posts: 1341
Location: roseville, ca
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 7:40 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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| Rickf1985 wrote: |
| nemofulcrum wrote: |
Hot VW magazine, has an article on a pair of racing beetles that have 420WHP.
For mere mortals what does an air-cooled turbo engine that could put down 300hp crank or wheel (flutters, no blow off) looks like? Size? Ballpark cost of engine and trans that can handle it?
Inquiring minds want to know
Thanks in advance! |
If you have to ask............... You probably can't afford it.
There is an old saying in the racing world, "Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?". That saying says it all. |
I always heard it as,” Speed costs money, how fast can you afford to go?”
$30k to make it run. $10k to make it go . $5k to make it stop. $10k to make it grab. Or do a Subaru swap for $20k for the motor and trans, and then the $15k for brakes, suspension, and rigidity. |
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Glenn 
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 80410
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 7:41 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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Link
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי |
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vwracerdave
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004
Posts: 15604
Location: Deep in the 405
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 8:20 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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| nemofulcrum wrote: |
Hot VW magazine, has an article on a pair of racing beetles that have 420WHP.
For mere mortals what does an air-cooled turbo engine that could put down 300hp crank or wheel (flutters, no blow off) looks like? Size? Ballpark cost of engine and trans that can handle it? |
Ballpark guess. 2332cc 300+ HP Turbo VW engine & trans
$10,000-$12,000 carb turbo engine all new parts
$15, 000-$18,000 EFI turbo engine all new parts
$3000-$4000 Type I trans that might handle it.
$4500-$6500 Type II trans that should handle it
$7500 Mendeola trans that will Handel it.
_________________
2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK |
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nemofulcrum
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2012
Posts: 126
Location: Nebraska
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 9:27 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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I get that throwing money at the problem eventually solves all issues with deep enough pockets...
I love my Subarus, though I feel like the character is lost a bit. I rented a speedster replica in Maui that had an aircooled 1.9L with a really notchy gearbox, it was sweet to drive and distinct from my 2L Crosstrek.
Could you keep it in the VW family and still make power, while keeping heat exchangers and AC for a functional street machine?
I have an Autozam AZ1 and having a functional heater and AC let's me drive it just about in all seasons. I drove my 1970 beetle, when I had it, as a daily but man was I sweaty or smelled of oil and exhaust at all times.... |
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bugguy1967
Samba Member
Joined: January 16, 2008
Posts: 4368
Location: Los Angeles, CA 90016
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 9:31 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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Turbo power isn't that big of a deal. 300+ N/A is harder to accomplish.
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"A petrol engine can start readily, run smoothly and give every appearance of being in good order, without necessarily being in good tune." - Colin Campbell, "The Sportscar Engine" |
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Brian_e
Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009
Posts: 4235
Location: Rapid City, South Dakota
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nemofulcrum
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2012
Posts: 126
Location: Nebraska
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 9:40 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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| bugguy1967 wrote: |
| Turbo power isn't that big of a deal. 300+ N/A is harder to accomplish. |
That is what I'm counting on. Plus, I really like the 90s turbo sounds. Case in point the Autozam does both flutter at low loads and achoes when shifting at heavy load. |
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nemofulcrum
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2012
Posts: 126
Location: Nebraska
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 9:44 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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Looks nice, but pricey. How do they get 2387cc though, is it a strocker or just custom everything? |
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UK Luke 72
Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011
Posts: 2875
Location: Little Britain
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Bad bug
Samba Member
Joined: March 11, 2006
Posts: 1160
Location: Jamaica
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madmike
Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2005
Posts: 5300
Location: Atlanta,Michigan
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| Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2022 5:11 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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300hp Aircooled VW not with heat & AC ,I'm close to that maybe???
_________________
'Black Ice'Drag Buggy 'Turbo'
Rail Buggy 1915 turbo
76 Drag/Street bug 2180cc 'Turbo' 11:85 @113 mph"If I go any faster I'll burn up the Hamster" ,gets 28 mpg. also 10/09/22 11.90 @115 mph
"If I'm ever on Life Support,UNPLUG Me, Then Plug me back In see if that Works" |
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Beetspeed
Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2004
Posts: 434
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2022 5:20 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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I still have an engine issue (probably a ring) and should have made an easy 500hp (crank) at 1,4-1,5 bar, (as it made 224hp without turbo), but it made just 483 crank hp on pump gas (the better octane one, 93 in US for comparison, its called 98 here in europe) and too much boost for my liking.
Opening it up this winter to track the faulty ring or other issue and retry again to achive >500 at just 1,5 bar boost or under.
I drove it to another country (England) and ran 3 mid 10's last september, best of them was 10.58 and drove back home without problems and pretty decent gas milage I might add.
Just to show you don't need a subaru engine for that 
This was at 1,6 bar boost:
Link
Yes, those are 17" rims
Trans is Porsche G50 5-speed with an LSD. Tranny was (very) cheap and a gamble at the time back then (2007-ish), but its still unopened and taking everything I throw at it.
Ring&pinion is same size-ish as Mendy though. Output shaft spline is same as Mendeola. Guess where they got that idea
I use a small diameter sinter dual-plate disks and Tilton heavy PP with an annular (hydraulic) TOB.
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'75 SB 1303 2,4ltr T4 turbo: 10.58 @ 129.9mph
'65 Ruska buggy 1192cc EFI 90hp N/A |
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Dusty1
Samba Member
Joined: April 16, 2004
Posts: 2241
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| Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2022 7:42 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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Whoa! They've gone up a bit since Bergman used to poop them out for around 5k.
More fun, less dough as seen right here on TheSamba:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2582939
Whatever you spend on the engine match it with similar expenditure on transmission, chassis and brakes.
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74 Thing
Samba Member
Joined: September 02, 2004
Posts: 7672
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rosevillain
Samba Member
Joined: December 28, 2005
Posts: 1341
Location: roseville, ca
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| Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2022 6:07 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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That looks like a great deal for all of that stuff. |
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nemofulcrum
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2012
Posts: 126
Location: Nebraska
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| Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2022 7:33 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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| madmike wrote: |
300hp Aircooled VW not with heat & AC ,I'm close to that maybe???
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that is awesome! Is this the 2180cc? |
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nemofulcrum
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2012
Posts: 126
Location: Nebraska
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| Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2022 7:34 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW power 300HP |
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| Beetspeed wrote: |
I still have an engine issue (probably a ring) and should have made an easy 500hp (crank) at 1,4-1,5 bar, (as it made 224hp without turbo), but it made just 483 crank hp on pump gas (the better octane one, 93 in US for comparison, its called 98 here in europe) and too much boost for my liking.
Opening it up this winter to track the faulty ring or other issue and retry again to achive >500 at just 1,5 bar boost or under.
I drove it to another country (England) and ran 3 mid 10's last september, best of them was 10.58 and drove back home without problems and pretty decent gas milage I might add.
Just to show you don't need a subaru engine for that
This was at 1,6 bar boost:
Link
Yes, those are 17" rims
Trans is Porsche G50 5-speed with an LSD. Tranny was (very) cheap and a gamble at the time back then (2007-ish), but its still unopened and taking everything I throw at it.
Ring&pinion is same size-ish as Mendy though. Output shaft spline is same as Mendeola. Guess where they got that idea
I use a small diameter sinter dual-plate disks and Tilton heavy PP with an annular (hydraulic) TOB. |
Ooh that's close to way I'd want to go with a superbeetle as base too! Thanks! |
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