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matt.white
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2009
Posts: 81
Location: London, England
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 Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2022 2:46 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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| Clara wrote: |
FWIW, since Greg's last post in this thread in 2018, we moved from Washington state to California, to a 1907 farmhouse with 1907 barn and a couple acres which could use some repair and tidying up.
Oddly enough, it seems that forward progress on our bus projects has slowed to a glacial pace in the same time frame.  |
Thanks for the update @Clara, that sounds like an awesome project you've taken on, and seeing the attention to detail on this Westy, I simply cant imagine how he is applying that to a 1907 farmhouse! Good Luck!
If any progress is made on the subhatch, please remind Greg he has a waiting audience on this thread  ! It is a seriously cool project... |
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Clara 
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003
Posts: 12608
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| Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2022 9:33 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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FWIW, since Greg's last post in this thread in 2018, we moved from Washington state to California, to a 1907 farmhouse with 1907 barn and a couple acres which could use some repair and tidying up.
Oddly enough, it seems that forward progress on our bus projects has slowed to a glacial pace in the same time frame.
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DanM
Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2002
Posts: 1376
Location: Falls Church, VA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2022 1:34 pm Post subject: |
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| campingbox wrote: |
| The bus has never had a deadline to finish it, so I always figured why rush it. |
That comment is from Sunday, Nov 28, 2010. Patiently waiting over here! |
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matt.white
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2009
Posts: 81
Location: London, England
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| Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2022 9:36 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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@Campingbox - I've just read this thread from beginning to end, and am left with the obvious question - is this finished?
I would really like to see some more photos of this being finished (or where in the resto process you've got to)? |
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Alan Brase
Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004
Posts: 4570
Location: Cedar Falls, Iowa
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| Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:25 pm Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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BTW, back in about 1971-73, I worked in a shop and turned drum and arced the brake shoes to fit. Wow that grinding stuff smelled so nice!
In general I think the asbestos thing was completely overblown. The main danger was to the people at JM that made stuff from asbestos.
And those that GROUND IT.
Maybe some of that $30 billion has my name on it?
Al
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Al Brase
Projects: 67 sunroof bug, 67 Porsche 912 Targa, 70 Westy
Dec 1955 Single Cab pickup WANT 15" BUS RIMS dated 8/55, thru 12/55
To New owners: 1969 doublecab, 1971 Dormobile
Vanagons:
80 P27 Westy JUL 1979, 3rd oldest known US
83 1.6TD Vanagon, 87 Wolfie Westy daily driver, swap meet home |
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Alan Brase
Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004
Posts: 4570
Location: Cedar Falls, Iowa
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| Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:20 pm Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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Wow, nice writeup on the tranny. Do you know are most internals same as bug or are there bus specific parts?
Seeing as how my December 1955 single cab tranny was only partly bolted in when I began working on it, it seems like a good time to pop it apart and see what we have, replacing boots, seals, bearing if it needs it.
Did you find a procedure for stretching the boots on? I bought some new seamless ones. Seems like a good idea. I see somebody makes a MODERN tool for use on newer cars.
Al
_________________
Al Brase
Projects: 67 sunroof bug, 67 Porsche 912 Targa, 70 Westy
Dec 1955 Single Cab pickup WANT 15" BUS RIMS dated 8/55, thru 12/55
To New owners: 1969 doublecab, 1971 Dormobile
Vanagons:
80 P27 Westy JUL 1979, 3rd oldest known US
83 1.6TD Vanagon, 87 Wolfie Westy daily driver, swap meet home |
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velvetgreen
Samba Member
Joined: August 17, 2004
Posts: 2893
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 12:30 pm Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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| many thanks for the measurements |
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campingbox
Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2000
Posts: 10249
Location: Petaluma, CA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 12:21 pm Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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Ok. I am not really worried about the rivets coming loose but I'll check them out during service intervals. I have the right clincher and backer to install them.
The rivets measure .156" diameter x .290" long. |
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perello
Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2005
Posts: 891
Location: where social security comes for free
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:33 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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[quote="campingbox"]
| perello wrote: |
Thanks!
Why did your guy feel riveted brake shoes were unsafe?
I would trust 10 mechanical fasteners over any type of glue any day.
I think the advantage of bonded shoes over riveted shoes is that they are faster to install and you can make use of the entire pad thickness before you experience any metal on metal contact.
I've heard that riveted shoes dissipate heat better, wonder if it's true?
I can't count the number of times I've seen where a bonded shoe has failed when I've needed to pull the drum on a bus which has sat out in the woods for a number of years.
I wonder if the old asbestos linings will stop better than the low carb version you can buy today from various parts suppliers? |
Sure! asbestos lining do much better.....they just happen to be...unhealthy. As long as you are aware its ok.
An experienced relining drum brake mechanic told me that rivets tend to develop play if you dont do them perfectly...a compromise would be rivets + glue.
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Aug '58 pressed bumper SO23
1974 German Thing
1978 Bug 1200 |
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crofty
Judas of the North
Joined: August 09, 2000
Posts: 19825
Location: Land of Whine and Phonies
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:00 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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I would have used some sweet chrome backing plates but otherwise it looks great, Greg! 
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velvetgreen
Samba Member
Joined: August 17, 2004
Posts: 2893
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:45 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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I have a set of those Jurid (cough cough  asbestos brakes but have no stell rivets. If you have any spares could you please post up what they look like or some measurements?
Many thanks! |
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Okie Adam
Samba Member
Joined: November 07, 2003
Posts: 1347
Location: OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOklahoma
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 8:23 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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Another great mystery of the VW world and one I will obsess about even though hardly anyone will ever see my lugs! 
I just went and looked at my 55 and it has a mismatch collection of lugs on it now. Everything from 29 lugs, VW stamp only lugs, and dimpled HWE lugs. I can't wait to get home and inspect the set I have set aside.
Sorry for the hijack! Now back to the regularly scheduled yellow and tan beauty!
_________________
Oil Capital Air Cooled
55 Wolfsburg Kombi
60 Walkthrough Kombi
62 Single Cab
66 21window
67 so42
76 Westy
64 Karmann Ghia |
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Clara
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003
Posts: 12608
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:59 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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The 29 part numbers were used through 1953. I think VW started using the 9 digit part numbers for 1954. There are plenty of bd parts that came new with the 9 digit part numbers, a Jan 55 bus would have the later part numbers on almost everything. But everything (original to the bus) on my June 53 has the early 29 style p/n on it.
The 29 p/n lug nuts were installed on new buses somewhat into 1956. Why for over a year later? Had they ordered a huge pile of lug nuts before changing the system?
Did the lug nut manufacturer just not get the memo?
Who knows, that's how it was. Anyhow, in the spirit of David Mayes, early p/n lugs correct for this bus was used.
IIRC, the Feb '56 high roof Acme panel from Alaska also had 29 part number lug nuts. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
then I think they later in 1956 went to the 211 ... ... p/n ,
then the flat w/o number,
then the dimpled
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Okie Adam
Samba Member
Joined: November 07, 2003
Posts: 1347
Location: OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOklahoma
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:57 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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| campingbox wrote: |
| Okie Adam wrote: |
| derRHDmeister wrote: |
| Okie Adam wrote: |
| campingbox wrote: |
29 part # lug bolts.
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Are these split case specific lug bolts? |
#29 signifies barndooor/wolfsburg production line (pre 55) |
As soon as I read your response it made perfect sense. I knew I'd heard of 29 part numbers before! |
I'm not sure how late those lug bolts went. I think they might have been fazed out around the end of '55. I don't think they made it to the end of the Wolfsburg run.
There was a very low km (8000 km's?) neon green singlecab found in Canada a few years back which was dated 1/56 and had a full set of 29 lug bolts. Our 1/56 bus had 10 of them on the front too. I've seen a number of similar date buses with the flat lug bolts with only a vw logo on it. Easy item to change, but an 8000 km singlecab painted lime green with matching lime green lug bolts was enough to convince me. |
I'm going to have to look at the lugs I have stashed for my 55 now. I remember them being flat top but I'm not sure if they have the part number on them.
_________________
Oil Capital Air Cooled
55 Wolfsburg Kombi
60 Walkthrough Kombi
62 Single Cab
66 21window
67 so42
76 Westy
64 Karmann Ghia |
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campingbox
Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2000
Posts: 10249
Location: Petaluma, CA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:46 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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| Okie Adam wrote: |
| derRHDmeister wrote: |
| Okie Adam wrote: |
| campingbox wrote: |
29 part # lug bolts.
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Are these split case specific lug bolts? |
#29 signifies barndooor/wolfsburg production line (pre 55) |
As soon as I read your response it made perfect sense. I knew I'd heard of 29 part numbers before! |
I'm not sure how late those lug bolts went. I think they might have been fazed out around the end of '55. I don't think they made it to the end of the Wolfsburg run.
There was a very low km (8000 km's?) neon green singlecab found in Canada a few years back which was dated 1/56 and had a full set of 29 lug bolts. Our 1/56 bus had 10 of them on the front too. I've seen a number of similar date buses with the flat lug bolts with only a vw logo on it. Easy item to change, but an 8000 km singlecab painted lime green with matching lime green lug bolts was enough to convince me. |
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campingbox
Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2000
Posts: 10249
Location: Petaluma, CA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:39 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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| perello wrote: |
As usual in Greg you are doing a fantastic resto!
Just as a side note, the brake pads you are using do have asbestos. In my bus I also wanted to use rivets and was strongly discouraged to do so as highly unsafe. |
Thanks!
Why did your guy feel riveted brake shoes were unsafe?
I would trust 10 mechanical fasteners over any type of glue any day.
I think the advantage of bonded shoes over riveted shoes is that they are faster to install and you can make use of the entire pad thickness before you experience any metal on metal contact.
I've heard that riveted shoes dissipate heat better, wonder if it's true?
I can't count the number of times I've seen where a bonded shoe has failed when I've needed to pull the drum on a bus which has sat out in the woods for a number of years.
I wonder if the old asbestos linings will stop better than the low carb version you can buy today from various parts suppliers? |
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Okie Adam
Samba Member
Joined: November 07, 2003
Posts: 1347
Location: OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOklahoma
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:25 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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| derRHDmeister wrote: |
| Okie Adam wrote: |
| campingbox wrote: |
29 part # lug bolts.
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Are these split case specific lug bolts? |
#29 signifies barndooor/wolfsburg production line (pre 55) |
As soon as I read your response it made perfect sense. I knew I'd heard of 29 part numbers before!
_________________
Oil Capital Air Cooled
55 Wolfsburg Kombi
60 Walkthrough Kombi
62 Single Cab
66 21window
67 so42
76 Westy
64 Karmann Ghia |
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derRHDmeister
Samba Member
Joined: June 22, 2004
Posts: 569
Location: worldwide
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:21 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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| Okie Adam wrote: |
| campingbox wrote: |
29 part # lug bolts.
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Are these split case specific lug bolts? |
#29 signifies barndooor/wolfsburg production line (pre 55)
_________________
Ask not what your bus can do for you, but ask what you can do for your bus.
| unclespanky wrote: |
| Piercy could dip those wheel cylinders between his cheek and gums and spit them out rebuilt. |
Check us out on Instagram:
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Okie Adam
Samba Member
Joined: November 07, 2003
Posts: 1347
Location: OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOklahoma
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:19 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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| campingbox wrote: |
29 part # lug bolts.
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Are these split case specific lug bolts?
_________________
Oil Capital Air Cooled
55 Wolfsburg Kombi
60 Walkthrough Kombi
62 Single Cab
66 21window
67 so42
76 Westy
64 Karmann Ghia |
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perello
Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2005
Posts: 891
Location: where social security comes for free
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| Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 1:23 am Post subject: Re: Yellow & Tan '56 Subhatch Westy - 20-147419 |
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As usual in Greg you are doing a fantastic resto!
Just as a side note, the brake pads you are using do have asbestos. In my bus I also wanted to use rivets and was strongly discouraged to do so as highly unsafe.
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Aug '58 pressed bumper SO23
1974 German Thing
1978 Bug 1200 |
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