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wesitarz
Samba Member
Joined: August 20, 2012
Posts: 1765
Location: Victoria,B.C.Canada
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RoryGirl
Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2016
Posts: 1014
Location: WestWorld Nanaimo BC
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 Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2024 6:14 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
you know...
call me an asshole... |
Never! I'm Team Skills 💯 |
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MarkWard
Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 19010
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2024 5:56 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| You can lead a horse to water. Good luck getting it to drink. |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17909
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2024 4:53 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| RoryGirl wrote: |
Skills is watching 
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you know...
call me an asshole...or whatever you want to call me but the reality is I DO want people to succeed. If the o/p doesn't want to put in the effort of answering questions and checking things then why should I put in any effort? (or We as it were)
Yes I'm watching  and about to go for a drive in my running subaru conversion 
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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RoryGirl
Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2016
Posts: 1014
Location: WestWorld Nanaimo BC
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2024 4:34 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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Skills is watching
Link
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Mckinleyvillian
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2021
Posts: 596
Location: Bristol County, MA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2024 3:56 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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Yo dude, i saw your x post on the Subaru outback forum…
Before you go further, im just wondering if on either of these engines you’ve done the heads, water pump, and timing belt before putting the thing in the car…
_________________
so many roads i know
all i want is one to take me home
85 Vanagon GL 1.9 stick |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17909
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2024 9:01 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| wcdennis wrote: |
| Skills suggested that you might have a bad ignition switch. Did you replace it or at least confirm it is working correctly? |
I'm about to have a stroke...
I'm just going to sit back and watch how this plays out now.
it's either that, or the base timing is fucked... kinda like IT HAS THE WRONG FUCKING SPROCKETS ON IT but seeing that was never checked engine to engine...i'll just watch.
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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wesitarz
Samba Member
Joined: August 20, 2012
Posts: 1765
Location: Victoria,B.C.Canada
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 7:45 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| VW_thepeoplescar wrote: |
I got the harness back in and tried to start it. The throttle is currently disconnected, so I held it in a more forward position. It started to fire. We repeated this a few times. When the person holding the key stop’s cranking, the engine stops running.
Any ideas? |
It's attempting to run while cranking? Check timing, compression, leakdown if the new engine was a non-runner. |
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wcdennis
Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2004
Posts: 955
Location: Winston-Salem NC
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 6:58 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| Skills suggested that you might have a bad ignition switch. Did you replace it or at least confirm it is working correctly? |
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VW_thepeoplescar
Samba Member
Joined: July 21, 2018
Posts: 34
Location: UT
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 6:23 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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I got the harness back in and tried to start it. The throttle is currently disconnected, so I held it in a more forward position. It started to fire. We repeated this a few times. When the person holding the key stop’s cranking, the engine stops running.
Any ideas? |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17909
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 9:58 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| VW_thepeoplescar wrote: |
| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| it went by emissions code for those trigger wheels so assuming the same part for the same year is dangerous |
I don’t understand what you mean. Could you elaborate? |
I don't know how to break it down for you. Was your car a federal or CA (sometimes NY or MA) emissions car?
Do you have the VIN from the donors?
what I'm getting at is you could toss a new harness in only to find out your sprockets were wrong the whole time.
if it ran before....you need to check the after. clearly something is wrong if it ran before you swapped the engine.
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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MarkWard
Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 19010
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 9:21 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| VW_thepeoplescar wrote: |
| MarkWard wrote: |
| Sir Sam wrote: |
| MarkWard wrote: |
| Sorry there is not enough compression to ignite starting fluid. It would have been spark from the ignition system. |
I disagree, I learned the hard way it can happen. I assumed that running on starter fluid meant I was getting spark and I spent many many hours and days chasing my tail about all sorts of other issues.
The issue turned out to be a blown fuse to the power transistor unit, replace the fuse and it fired right up.
I even kept the engine running for a few minutes hoping something would clear by pulsing squirts of starter fluid in.
I'm not saying this is the issue, I just wanted to point how making an incorrect conclusion and not verifying it another way can really throw a wrench in the troubleshooting process. |
You have misquoted me or at least taken out of context what I was stating. Perhaps I was too polite. I do not troubleshoot a no run condition with starting fluid. Troubleshooting a no running engine is not like throwing pasta against the wall and seeing if it sticks. 4 stroke engines require good even compression, fuel delivery into the intake, and a good spark properly timed.
I come across these threads all the time here. I know other members are trying to help, but it’s often “this was what worked for me.” On a Vanagon with an engine conversion, there are 100 possibilities why an engine won’t run. You can either throw things at it seeing what sticks or you can methodically sit down and figure out what is wrong. The second option is not as much fun. Good news is once you figure it out, you will have a true understanding of how your engine management system works and is tied into the Vanagon electrical system. |
Could you suggest where you would start with diagnosing the problem?
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From my post on the previous page.
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Fuel pressure check and injector pulse. A noid light for checking injector pulse is a handy tool to own. A stethoscope or a long screwdriver against the injector and your ear can let you hear if it’s clicking short of a noid light or stethoscope. |
Its one of 3 problems. Have you checked the compression? If compression is correct, that leaves fuel or spark delivery. Have you checked the fuel pressure? Have you verfied the injectors are getting a pulse during cranking or at least are they audibly clicking. I'm unfamiliar with the Subaru engine. If it has spark plug wires, you can attach a timing light to get an indication if spark is being generated.
This is a process of elimination in the beginning to zero in on the actual problem. Then you can trace back to why the problem exists. You will need a factory wiring diagram and manual for proper troubleshooting if you can't download them from somewhere. I carry a Vangon factory manual and a factory manual for the engine that was installed during the conversion. You will need to verify how the Subaru harness is intigrated into the Vanagon electrical. It may require checking all the connnections. A volt ohm meter will come in handy.
Last missing question. This engine I assume is used? Was it running when it was removed? Did you replace the timing belt and tensioners? I personally would not install an unknown engine without replacing the timing belt. As I said, you will likely be an expert on your conversion when you are done. That will certainly come in handy if you intend to road trip with your van in the future. |
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VW_thepeoplescar
Samba Member
Joined: July 21, 2018
Posts: 34
Location: UT
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 8:47 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| MarkWard wrote: |
| Sir Sam wrote: |
| MarkWard wrote: |
| Sorry there is not enough compression to ignite starting fluid. It would have been spark from the ignition system. |
I disagree, I learned the hard way it can happen. I assumed that running on starter fluid meant I was getting spark and I spent many many hours and days chasing my tail about all sorts of other issues.
The issue turned out to be a blown fuse to the power transistor unit, replace the fuse and it fired right up.
I even kept the engine running for a few minutes hoping something would clear by pulsing squirts of starter fluid in.
I'm not saying this is the issue, I just wanted to point how making an incorrect conclusion and not verifying it another way can really throw a wrench in the troubleshooting process. |
You have misquoted me or at least taken out of context what I was stating. Perhaps I was too polite. I do not troubleshoot a no run condition with starting fluid. Troubleshooting a no running engine is not like throwing pasta against the wall and seeing if it sticks. 4 stroke engines require good even compression, fuel delivery into the intake, and a good spark properly timed.
I come across these threads all the time here. I know other members are trying to help, but it’s often “this was what worked for me.” On a Vanagon with an engine conversion, there are 100 possibilities why an engine won’t run. You can either throw things at it seeing what sticks or you can methodically sit down and figure out what is wrong. The second option is not as much fun. Good news is once you figure it out, you will have a true understanding of how your engine management system works and is tied into the Vanagon electrical system. |
Could you suggest where you would start with diagnosing the problem? |
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MarkWard
Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 19010
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2024 5:06 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| Sir Sam wrote: |
| MarkWard wrote: |
| Sorry there is not enough compression to ignite starting fluid. It would have been spark from the ignition system. |
I disagree, I learned the hard way it can happen. I assumed that running on starter fluid meant I was getting spark and I spent many many hours and days chasing my tail about all sorts of other issues.
The issue turned out to be a blown fuse to the power transistor unit, replace the fuse and it fired right up.
I even kept the engine running for a few minutes hoping something would clear by pulsing squirts of starter fluid in.
I'm not saying this is the issue, I just wanted to point how making an incorrect conclusion and not verifying it another way can really throw a wrench in the troubleshooting process. |
You have misquoted me or at least taken out of context what I was stating. Perhaps I was too polite. I do not troubleshoot a no run condition with starting fluid. Troubleshooting a no running engine is not like throwing pasta against the wall and seeing if it sticks. 4 stroke engines require good even compression, fuel delivery into the intake, and a good spark properly timed.
I come across these threads all the time here. I know other members are trying to help, but it’s often “this was what worked for me.” On a Vanagon with an engine conversion, there are 100 possibilities why an engine won’t run. You can either throw things at it seeing what sticks or you can methodically sit down and figure out what is wrong. The second option is not as much fun. Good news is once you figure it out, you will have a true understanding of how your engine management system works and is tied into the Vanagon electrical system. |
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wesitarz
Samba Member
Joined: August 20, 2012
Posts: 1765
Location: Victoria,B.C.Canada
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 11:59 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| Do you have a good ground connection from chassis to intake ground point? |
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VW_thepeoplescar
Samba Member
Joined: July 21, 2018
Posts: 34
Location: UT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 11:07 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
Your diagnostic strategy is all over the place and you're going to start making assumptions that are going to dig you even deeper into problems. |
Do you have any suggestions for a diagnostic flow chart? |
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VW_thepeoplescar
Samba Member
Joined: July 21, 2018
Posts: 34
Location: UT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 11:05 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
unless you know what you're doing, messing with shielded wiring is a very precise art form and very easy to fuck up. |
What exactly could I fuck up? I am very close to buying a new engine wiring harness, just trying to flush out a potential problem. The wires are extremely deteriorated from heat. |
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VW_thepeoplescar
Samba Member
Joined: July 21, 2018
Posts: 34
Location: UT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 11:02 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| it went by emissions code for those trigger wheels so assuming the same part for the same year is dangerous |
I don’t understand what you mean. Could you elaborate? |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17909
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 8:07 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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it went by emissions code for those trigger wheels so assuming the same part for the same year is dangerous
unless you know what you're doing, messing with shielded wiring is a very precise art form and very easy to fuck up.
Your diagnostic strategy is all over the place and you're going to start making assumptions that are going to dig you even deeper into problems.
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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| Back to top |
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VW_thepeoplescar
Samba Member
Joined: July 21, 2018
Posts: 34
Location: UT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2024 9:39 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon - Subaru swap help |
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| wesitarz wrote: |
| VW_thepeoplescar wrote: |
| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| VW_thepeoplescar wrote: |
| Does anyone have access to a EUC logic diagram? |
did you confirm the trigger wheel teeth on both cam and crank sprockets?
if you can't do that, a diagram of the ECU will be zero help |
Do you mean: are the the crankshaft gear on the 2002 legacy and 2003 legacy the same? I’m a bit confused about what you mean. |
Yes are the crank sprocket gears the same? Take the cam sensor out and count the gear teeth on the cam gear while rotating the crank. Are the gears the same? |
I’ll add the screenshots, but according to the Subaru parts website; the 2002 and 2003 use the same crankshaft gear and camshaft gears.
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