101.6mm cylinders in a type 1 case??

[cof]

What would i take to put 101,6 cyls in a type 1 case????

I'm planning for a big cc engine for my bug and wonder about the possibilities to use a type 1 case..
Is there any type 1 heads made for 101,6 cyls???

Gonna have 86-90 stroke....

[hanknmorgan]

I dont think many people are going to take the time to answer this one unfotunately, so I will try to help out. I am fairly new to VW's myself, but here goes. One of the "veterans" will correct me if I am wrong. From what I understand the 94mm P&C sets, which yeilds a 1915 cc engine with stock 69mm stroke is the biggest you can possibly go on pistons. 94's are extremely close to the case studs when machined out. So close in fact that many people modify the studs to keep them from pulling out of the thin case material due to the overbore machining. So, to answer the question, no there is no way that I can see of getting anything larger than 94's in a type 1 case. If it could be done, it probably already would have been done. VW's have been around a while. On another note, I believe your stroke desires are unrealistic as well. It would require MAJOR clearancing if possible at all. I dont even think anyone makes a crankshaft with that much stroke. A 2276 (94mm with 82 stroke, I think) is about your maximum displacement from a type 1. If you want bigger, you have to take out a second mortgage and go with a type 4 based engine. Worth every penny, but it's a lot of stinkin pennies. Anyway, good luck to you and have fun learning. This site is great.

-Hank

[Hobbes]

Actually, i believe there Is another way..... but it's pretty difficult.

I think you can bore past the stud holes, and drill new studs in a different spot, however i think you'd have to drill new holes in the head too...

Basically, i'm not sure how it's done, but i've talked to people who have done it... Maybe you can look it up, I don't know.

But it is possible.

[tuna]

The other thing to remember is the distance from the centers of each piston to the other. If the bore is too big, the cylinders will overlap. If you offset bore the case, you'll have to have the connecting rod journals on the crankshaft moved to be centered in the cylinder opening.

This may not mean much, but in over 15 years in the VW hobby, I've never seen a stock case with 101.6mm pistons. The only time I've seen them used were in aftermarket "racing" cases, like the Scat case, or the Dee Engineering one, from Pauter or Autocraft.

You won't know until you start measuring the case.

Tuna
_________________
The VDub Geek
Type 4: Secrets Revealed

1969 Bug - 2056cc Type 4 Cal-Look

[cof]

well what i know for myself is that you can put thick steel plates on the type 1 case sides with the correct holes and bolt pattern for like type 4 101,6 cyls, just wondering if there was an easier way, like a readily made type 1 case for that purpose, so everything is possible=)

For the crank, there is stroke up to 90mm even larger i think but plenty pesetas...

Autocraft heads seems to be a good combo with this too.....

Just wanted to know if anyone here had done a simple solution=)

Thanks a lot for the input guys, I appreciate it a lot!!!!!!

[cof]

ok, so a type 4 crank is longer than a type 1 with larger distance between the rods?

Thanks for the info=)

[cof]

Thanks Tuna=)

I've been looking at the killer case and that one seem to be the cheapest case out there for 101,6mm.

so most probably i have to get the big leather up and do some shopping....

[ekimthemad]

The studs would have to be moved out. You would be better off to go with a type 5 motor that already has a larger stud pattern. I am pretty sure you can fit up to a 103mm bore into one of those. Currently, there are not any streetable heads available that will work with a 4 inch bore. There are aftermarket heads available to run 101.6 but none of them have enough fins to cool well on the street. You never mentioned what you wanted this giant for.

Up to a 90mm crank can be put into a type 1 case but it is difficult to get it to clear the cam without going to an aftermarket dropped cam case. The cranks also tend to flex quite a bit due to the lack of overlap in the journals and end up beating up the case.

Mike
59 single, 66 bug, 69 bus, 73 super
Member of the Ddk
_________________
Remember never argue with a moron. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with a lifetime's worth of experince.

[ekimthemad]

Here are some links you may want to take a look at:

http://www.rockyjennings.com/

http://www.cal-look.com/forum/index.php?topic=3347.0

Mike
_________________
Remember never argue with a moron. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with a lifetime's worth of experince.

[hanknmorgan]

It looks like it can be done, but not easily and not cheaply. I say if you are going to go through all that just go with a well built type 4 from Jake Raby or similar. You get lots of power and a reliable and long lasting engine. I think if you did all that work to a type 1 case you would probably end up spending just as much as a type 4 and have a lot weaker of a starting platform and certainly will not last as long. And with the technology and research going into type 4 engines lately, they are starting to get a decent aftermarket going from what I hear.

[turbo_bob]

[tuna]

If you want the big bores for bragging rights, then the best way is the Type 4 engine. You can easily install up to 105mm in a stock Type 4 case (use the LN Engineering Nickies cylinders) and invest in a pair of aftermarket heads from aircooledtechnology.com . That will get you in the high two liter range. A 105x82 will get you 2840cc.

Tuna
_________________
The VDub Geek
Type 4: Secrets Revealed

1969 Bug - 2056cc Type 4 Cal-Look

[philip1]

just buy yourself an autocraft, pauter or scat killer case if you want big cc. go out to 3.5 litres near enough.

and some advice buy the - aircooled interchange manua, by keith seume. read that and get a better idea. 94 are biggest pistons, movin studs or woteva is a real watse of time and money. and thnk berg can fit an 88mm crank in a type 1 case.

[Muffler Mike]

96.5 is not uncommon in a race motor. Wall just gets real thin by the studs.
I have seen 98 with in the stock head stud pattern too, but can you say paper thin? a modified porshe cylinder.

the problem with moving head studs around on the t1 case is the oil passages around the oil cooler area. Nothing that can not be overcome, but just a LOT of work.

I have heard about an autolinea case coming with no stud holes, but have yet to here of it actually coming true yet.

with the big plate idea, that would work. just more work to do, thats all.
http://www.precisionalloy.com/pages/tf-1.html
maybe use this case and use the through bolts to hold the plates on and sandwitch the entire case
_________________
Muffler Mike
http://MufflerMike.com

[nsracing]

[badbugtwo]

[turbo_bob]

[nsracing]

[badbugtwo]

[turbo_bob]

I see the future of larger CC engines. When is somebody going to make a head like the 044 with the type 1 and wasserboxer spigot centers, but with a moved outward stud pattern to accept 101.6 bore?