At what point do you consider an engine rebuild?

[Jason Rolfe]

The basics:

I'm at a point in my engine's life (2.2 rebuild done by Wolfsberg in Seattle RIP about 14 years ago, with 110,000 miles on it), where I'm wondering if it might be worth considering a rebuild.

Top end has been rebuilt twice in that period, most recently a few years ago when, upon noticing some coolant leakage at one of the head gaskets, I decided to replace the heads (there were cracks between valves).

The van runs pretty well these days, overall. In fact, just got done with a 2 week, 1,000 mile+ road trip through BC/Alberta and it did great. But boy, it really seems to go through oil, and there are no obvious leaks. I know that a leak down and/or compression test will tell me more, and I plan to do both this summer just to see what I find out.

In any case, as I said, considering engine age/mileage, at what I'm pretty sure is more than 1 qt/1,000 miles oil consumption, is it worthwhile to think about taking on an engine rebuild this winter?

What other signs of wear can I look for? Fouled plugs? Other?

Just trying to stay ahead of things and avoid a complete failure at a more inopportune time.

Thanks for any tips/advice.

[zerotofifty]

compression and or leak down test, plus oil pressure test are good to do. best to install a permenant oil pressure gage so you can detect oil shortage seeing as you indicate she burns oil. Mine drinks oil if I keep here topped up to the full line on the dip stick, but consumption drops greatly is I leave the oil level a bit below half way between full and low marks

Two head jobs do to coolant leaks! Consider doing something different next time, she should not have such recurring leaks. Are you using antifreeze, minimum 50%, AND doing every two years flush and renewal of antifreeze?

Anyway, your job is to do the compression and or leak down test, and oil pressure test, do the oil pressure test fully warmed up at highway speed. a cold test in the driveway is no as helpful.

save the worry for after you do the tests, it may be fine.
_________________
Sorry About That Chief.

Give Peace a Chance.

Words to live by.

[Jason Rolfe]

[vanis13]

[Jason Rolfe]

[dhaavers]

[MarkWard]

Pressure reported does sound low. That the pressure drops and the light comes on is more concerning. A recent thread had similar symptoms. In that case it was determined by the owner the oil level was too low. VW stated a qt in 1000 miles was acceptable. I don’t agree.

[Jason Rolfe]

[Jason Rolfe]

[?Waldo?]

More oil usage than 1qt/1,000 and low oil pressure. It's past time for a rebuild. 110,000 on the motor with two times doing the top end is terrible cost/unreliability.

[bobbyblack]

My experience with all my VWs (except my EuroVan Westy) has been to find a spare engine to have on hand. There is big business in engine transplants, going away from the WBX in favor of a Subaru, or TDI, etc. and those that are getting transplants done are not usually doing it because of low OP, consumption, etc, but just wanting more gogo juice, thus the WBX is fine, and sometimes free for the taking, or at a very reasonable price. And, since I have a few spare engines, I am not as worried about my low OP at hot idle, if my gauge was graduated in the 0-10 range better, I could actually have a number for you, but it goes 0-10-20-30-40 and so on, and I can tell very clearly hot OP is under half way from 0 to 10 at hot idle. BUT, I think the wire I ran from the dash to the sender in the engine compartment might be the wrong kind to be accurate anyway, so who knows why I've gotten nearly 80K miles running it like this. Just saying, there are plenty of ideas out there. I agree though, throwing a rod would not be much fun.

dhaavers has done a great thing on his approach to watching his OP closely, and getting a fantastic build from a really great shop, so be sure to chat him up on further thoughts, since he has just gone through something very similar to your situation. I am not sure how the shop he used would view your 'core' though, I think they don't much go for anything that has been taken apart/rebuilt before.

-bobby
_________________
'87 Westy 'Flossie','86 Westy 'R1','86 tintop GL - Subi2.2 'J2','83.5 stock tintop L 'ZoomBus','74 Karmann Ghia, '63 Notch

[Jason Rolfe]

I really appreciate the insight and feedback. It's more or less confirming suspicions I've had, though I do still wonder about a few things.

If the engine is worn to the point of needing a rebuild immediately, would there be other signs like poor gas mileage and/or performance.

I get relatively good mileage (I think): typically around 18 mpg average.

And the van runs well as far as I can tell. Accelerates strongly on the freeway when I want to pass someone, doesn't struggle too much up hills (aside from the steepest ones). I know some of this is somewhat subjective.

But, of course, the oil consumption is a big question mark, as is oil pressure.

I'm going to try to get compression and oil pressure tested this weekend and will report back with some numbers.

In the meantime, happy to hear any add'l thoughts.

And, for what it's worth, my mention of "top end rebuild" only included replacing heads; didn't mess with pistons/cylinders. Just want to avoid any confusion on that front.

[?Waldo?]

[dhaavers]

Classic literature here…if you haven’t yet, read this NOW:

http://volksweb.relitech.com/21rodbrg.htm

Bottom line: Do ya feel lucky?



- Dave
_________________
86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS>

[Ahwahnee]

[Jason Rolfe]

[Jason Rolfe]

Another (disheartening) data point:

Looks like my oil consumption was even more drastic than I thought going back over my notes from the trip.

I did an oil change before our recent trip. Put 4 qts of 10w-60 in. (I'd been running 20w-50 for years but thought I'd try a different oil out to see if I noticed any difference in pressure, etc).

Road trip was about 2,500 miles. I put 4 quarts in over the course of the trip.

Just went out to recheck the oil, and it took 2 quarts to bring the level up to the bottom mark on the stick.

So that's 10 quarts in the last 2,500 miles.

Oof.

[Jason Rolfe]

[?Waldo?]

You shouldn't count the 4 qts of oil from the oil change as 'oil usage'. However, you still added 6 quarts of oil over 2,500 miles in order to maintain that initial level and that oil usage is very excessive IMO (more than 2X what I would consider the limit of acceptable), so it doesn't really change the situation.

[Jason Rolfe]

Yeah, 2500 miles/6 quarts=less than ideal.

I guess my next question would be: should I even bother going through with compression and leak down tests, and oil pressure check with a different gauge?

Or should I just pull the engine and get a closer look at things, since it would appear the engine probably needs to come out anyway?

Put another way--is there any chance that further testing will reveal a simpler fix/solution?