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Bart Dunn
Samba Consiglieri
Joined: May 09, 2004
Posts: 2354
Location: Sea level (Mid Atlantic)
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 Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 5:41 pm Post subject: What's a Hebmüller worth?? |
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Don't know if this belongs in the Beetle section, but hopefully the right people will see it. . .
Astute observers of the hobby may note both (1) the lack of any real market information for a Hebmüller due to their rarity, and (2) that one is for sale in the current issue of Hemmings Motor News, #316. My father in law called the guy, as he's in the market for an old VW or Porsche and he has a flair for the unusual. The guy wants $220,000.00 for it.
Now, I know there are only about 115 of these things still known to exist, and that there were only 700 or so ever made, but seriously, nearly a quarter of a million dollars for a VW?
Any anecdotal or first-hand information about other Hebs that have changed hands in the last few years? They aren't exactly listed for sale often enough to gauge the market, but I recall one for sale around $80K a couple of years back, also in HMN.
Is there really a VW that can command a price well into the six figures? Can a $10K-plus Super Beetle sedan be far behind? The mind reels.
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Glenn 
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 79650
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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I would say $80k sounds like a fair price. But with anything that rare, it's whatever the market will bear.
Recently a friend put a nice Sapphire XV on ebay and it sold for $185. As it turns out i bought a Sapphire XV at a swap meet the week before for $25. My friend emailed the one of the guys that lost the auction and he bought mine Sapphire XV for $150. That's a 600% increase in 2 weeks.
Personally i think it was worth maybe $50.
For $220,000 i'd buy a Porsche GT3.
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Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
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עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי |
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Wiggy
Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2003
Posts: 6606
Location: Downingtown, PA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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That guy is smoking crack. I know of a Heb for sale right now in Europe for 50,000 Euro. Granted, its not restored. IF you spent another 50k restoring that car (and I doubt you would), you might have a $100,000 heb. I can't believe a Heb would go for more than $100k, ever.
There are far rarer coachbuilts (D&S's, Rometchs, etc.), that wouldn't even come close to that price.
The guy is on crack. Period. I can guarantee you the guy won't sell it.
I know of 4 or 5 Hebs that have sold in the last two years, they have gone from $40k-$60.
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Kevin "Wiggy"
My 58 Ghia Vert
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Bart Dunn
Samba Consiglieri
Joined: May 09, 2004
Posts: 2354
Location: Sea level (Mid Atlantic)
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| Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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That's about what I thought! Maybe we'll tell the guy to call us back when he cuts the price by 80%. I didn't even think about what a Rometsch or a Dannenhauer & Stauss might cost. Those sure are pretty. . . are they in the same price ranges as Hebs? Probably as rare, at least with the D&S, from what I remember reading in a book on coachbuilt VWs.
Glen, no offense intended on the Super Beetle comment--I had two '74s over the years. . . I've got no problem with you driving a fat chick! 
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Glenn
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 79650
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Bart Dunn wrote: |
| Glen, no offense intended on the Super Beetle comment--I had two '74s over the years. . . I've got no problem with you driving a fat chick! |
Actually my 74 is a Standard.
No offense taken. I'm OK with my 74's "Fatness"
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Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
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Wiggy
Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2003
Posts: 6606
Location: Downingtown, PA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Bart Dunn wrote: |
That's about what I thought! Maybe we'll tell the guy to call us back when he cuts the price by 80%. I didn't even think about what a Rometsch or a Dannenhauer & Stauss might cost. Those sure are pretty. . . are they in the same price ranges as Hebs? Probably as rare, at least with the D&S, from what I remember reading in a book on coachbuilt VWs.
Glen, no offense intended on the Super Beetle comment--I had two '74s over the years. . . I've got no problem with you driving a fat chick! |
Ive seen nicely restored Romy's (the early "Banana" ones) go for $80k. D&S's, well, those are so rare its hard to put a price on them. I recall seeing one for sale a few years ago for like $30k, but it needed total resto. Noway would that cost you that kind of money. And BOTH are WAY rarer than a Heb.
I've actually seen more Hebs for sale than 49, 50 and 51 Karmann cabrios.
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Kevin "Wiggy"
My 58 Ghia Vert
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thebucket
Samba Stockbroker
Joined: April 06, 2004
Posts: 3734
Location: Houston Texas
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| Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Glenn wrote: |
| Bart Dunn wrote: |
| Glen, no offense intended on the Super Beetle comment--I had two '74s over the years. . . I've got no problem with you driving a fat chick! |
Actually my 74 is a Standard.
No offense taken. I'm OK with my 74's "Fatness" |
Glen your car is pretty PHAT  . I'd drive the shit out of the berg 5. Back to the subject my friend told me that he'd be hard pressed to buy a heb for over 80k. He has a two 50 hebs in the garage and has owned two others previously.
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Bart Dunn
Samba Consiglieri
Joined: May 09, 2004
Posts: 2354
Location: Sea level (Mid Atlantic)
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| Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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I spoke to the Heb seller today, and he's a very nice older gentleman. But, he actually wants 200,000 euros for the car, which is around $240K. Just FYI.
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Wiggy
Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2003
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Location: Downingtown, PA
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horatiocaine
Samba Member
Joined: April 13, 2004
Posts: 207
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| Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 3:42 pm Post subject: hebmuller |
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| 220,000 yen is more realistic. |
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53 0val
Samba Professor
Joined: July 03, 2003
Posts: 11396
Location: Irvine, CA
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| Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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The guy needs to take a couple of laxatives to get all the shit out. $80,000 tops. 
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EvilBus
Samba Art Critic
Joined: June 18, 2004
Posts: 1523
Location: Texas Damnit!
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2004 8:16 pm Post subject: 240K? |
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For 240K I'll get me a Hemi Cuda.
But, as they say, they're not makin these anymore.
Someday, $240K, maybe not. But all it takes is the market.
How much are we paying for NOS Semaphores now? Or what's the asking?
How much did that spilt NOS vert decklid go for?
Humm. I keep sayin buy up all those vanagons, bay window busses and superbeetles. Stickem in a barn and in 20 years, you'll still be broke.
But then again I just paid $200 for a lunchbox this weekend, so I guess I'm the goat.
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bmxtc4free
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2003
Posts: 10
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| Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2004 5:17 am Post subject: heb 4 sale? |
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| hey 2 splits ,I know a guy from pa lookin for a heb .he's not an internet guy but hes got the right credentials ,46 kdf,56 okrasa vert,23 window ,flip seat westy and then some.He is serious about finding a heb,so email me if you know of any for sale.buy the way saw your splits at campbelltown and reading.They are badass!.Cant wait to see that vert. |
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Wiggy
Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2003
Posts: 6606
Location: Downingtown, PA
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| Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2004 12:02 pm Post subject: Re: heb 4 sale? |
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| bmxtc4free wrote: |
| hey 2 splits ,I know a guy from pa lookin for a heb .he's not an internet guy but hes got the right credentials ,46 kdf,56 okrasa vert,23 window ,flip seat westy and then some.He is serious about finding a heb,so email me if you know of any for sale.buy the way saw your splits at campbelltown and reading.They are badass!.Cant wait to see that vert. |
Thanks Bro.
No secrets on the Heb...
http://www.bbt4vw.com/Car%20sales/Autoverkoop/cabrio/cabrio.php
Looks like it just got sold...
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Kevin "Wiggy"
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Jason Eden
Samba Member
Joined: July 04, 2003
Posts: 952
Location: Inland Empire
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| Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2004 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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There is a guy in Texas i think he was on samba about 6months ago selling a brown zwitter it was nice and a 55 hard top blue and he had a heb it was red and white he said he might be getting rid of i dont have his info but someone out there might. Good luck
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EverettB
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Skim
Rants Master
Joined: April 15, 2001
Posts: 17095
Location: GFK 31 Year Vet
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2004 4:28 am Post subject: |
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| EverettB wrote: |
| Jason Eden wrote: |
| There is a guy in Texas i think he was on samba about 6months ago selling a brown zwitter it was nice and a 55 hard top blue and he had a heb it was red and white he said he might be getting rid of i dont have his info but someone out there might. Good luck |
I'm pretty sure that was this guy:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=93067 |
That was Don Garies heb. He passed away not too long ago and the family started to sell off all his cars. The brown Zwitter belongs to forum member EvilBus now.
Yes the oldschool rants guys will remember that heb being picked apart in the rants about 2 years ago.
Sadly that heb, even though its number 6, is a piece of shit. Poor dude got burned by bodymen, one body man stole the car then he let a 17 year old inexperienced kid do the resto and now the doors dont shut right. The rusty doors were repaired at the bottoms and they are too high. You can see the daytime thru the bottoms of them from the inside of the car. He took it to the classic and the heb guys gave him a true rants style picking over on all the incorrect shit. Hot VW's wouldnt shoot it and the rear bumper brackets are on the front so the front bumper sticks out 800 feet. The family still has it as they dont know what to price it at.
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Samba since before the towers collapsed. Still here.
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jerry.t
Samba Member
Joined: June 26, 2003
Posts: 1442
Location: okc ok
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2004 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Skim wrote: |
| EverettB wrote: |
| Jason Eden wrote: |
| There is a guy in Texas i think he was on samba about 6months ago selling a brown zwitter it was nice and a 55 hard top blue and he had a heb it was red and white he said he might be getting rid of i dont have his info but someone out there might. Good luck |
I'm pretty sure that was this guy:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=93067 |
That was Don Garies heb. He passed away not too long ago and the family started to sell off all his cars. The brown Zwitter belongs to forum member EvilBus now.
Yes the oldschool rants guys will remember that heb being picked apart in the rants about 2 years ago.
Sadly that heb, even though its number 6, is a piece of shit. Poor dude got burned by bodymen, one body man stole the car then he let a 17 year old inexperienced kid do the resto and now the doors dont shut right. The rusty doors were repaired at the bottoms and they are too high. You can see the daytime thru the bottoms of them from the inside of the car. He took it to the classic and the heb guys gave him a true rants style picking over on all the incorrect shit. Hot VW's wouldnt shoot it and the rear bumper brackets are on the front so the front bumper sticks out 800 feet. The family still has it as they dont know what to price it at. |
i remember seeing that car at ennis, it was sad to here all the crap he had to go through! just to have it restored.
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EvilBus
Samba Art Critic
Joined: June 18, 2004
Posts: 1523
Location: Texas Damnit!
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2004 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| jerry.t wrote: |
| Skim wrote: |
| EverettB wrote: |
| Jason Eden wrote: |
| There is a guy in Texas i think he was on samba about 6months ago selling a brown zwitter it was nice and a 55 hard top blue and he had a heb it was red and white he said he might be getting rid of i dont have his info but someone out there might. Good luck |
I'm pretty sure that was this guy:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=93067 |
That was Don Garies heb. He passed away not too long ago and the family started to sell off all his cars. The brown Zwitter belongs to forum member EvilBus now.
Yes the oldschool rants guys will remember that heb being picked apart in the rants about 2 years ago.
Sadly that heb, even though its number 6, is a piece of shit. Poor dude got burned by bodymen, one body man stole the car then he let a 17 year old inexperienced kid do the resto and now the doors dont shut right. The rusty doors were repaired at the bottoms and they are too high. You can see the daytime thru the bottoms of them from the inside of the car. He took it to the classic and the heb guys gave him a true rants style picking over on all the incorrect shit. Hot VW's wouldnt shoot it and the rear bumper brackets are on the front so the front bumper sticks out 800 feet. The family still has it as they dont know what to price it at. |
i remember seeing that car at ennis, it was sad to here all the crap he had to go through! just to have it restored. |
Being the owner of the "Zwitter" now, I can tell you it's sad to see the car in the storage building. But Don took a lot of crap and the whole story about the guy in Longview stealing the body... yikes. I wish I had the
scratch to get it, but I don't.
It's covered in about two inches of dust.
Inevitably from what I've read and talked to other folks who knew Don he really loved VWs and he loved that car. The vintage guys ripped into him a few times, so I think he kinda shelled in but he was a nice guy, very personable.
I've talked to the guy Don hired to work on the Heb, and unfortunately from those discussions corners may have been cut but I think that was more from the frustration of getting the car done and finished than not wanting to do the right job. From my minimal Heb knowledge, I don't think it's as bad as everybody thinks. I even mentally compared it
to the Heb at Eureka Springs, so some of it is perceivable but then again
since this is one of the first production hebs, it's difficult to say.
As previously stated, the body and some other things were stolen from him, he had to recover them. He was "taken" by numerous mechanics and body shops. Again I don't think however the car is as bad as anybody truly thinks. Some research would have to be undertaken, some money spent if you want a 100% correct Heb. How much time and how much money would be a ventured guess but it's still
0006 
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tjsuckerpunch
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 42
Location: kelso wa
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| Posted: Mon Sep 20, 2004 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| body man in LONGVIEW is this Longview TX or WA, I am from Longview Wa and the only thing i have seen around here is a schwimmer and a kubel |
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